Better Car VTS or VTR

It is... you're thinking of the EnduraE - which is just a tarted up Kent complete with rattly top-end ;-)

Apart from winding Dervy up with a load of pish, would you care to enlighten us as to which focus has had a "refined" CVH put in it?

The only possible thing you could be referring to is the 1.6 8v unit for the russians, which has nowt to do with the CVH as far as I know.

The current engine range as I know it is

1.4 zetec se (all alloy, related to the 1.7) 1.6 zetec se (all alloy, related to the 1.7) 1.8 zetec 1.8 zetec bi-fuel (hardened bits in it) 1.8 common rail diesel 2.0 zetec 2.0 zetec heavily modded inc vct and badged duratec 2.0 zetec lightly modded with turbo also badged duratec

The Americans have a 2.0l spi engine which is utter s**te, and a 2.2l duratec wich is rather better, but loooks like it was installed by a team of blind monkeys armed with dremmels :-)

No room for the manky old CVH there?

Like hell it compares on price ? You mean that not only is the Punto a better car, it's also cheaper as well ?

:)

my MR2 would whip your pug down a country lane boy!

Hmmmm. I was sure there was a 1.6 8v motor fitted to a cheapie special this year. Obviously I'm wrong.

Is that the RoCam?

True. I'm mistaken on this one.... I _really_ can't understand the Ford engine line-up anymore.

They're using the Duratec in preference to the Zetec, which I can't explain - and why does the Fiesta get a 16v Duratec when there's a perfectly good Zetec to put in it? - also, why didn't the SportKa get a

16v Duratec if it couldn't take a Zetec?

Evo says the SportKa is group 7 insurance, HGT is group 15. Sportka is £10k list price, HGT is £12, though you may get discounts to make things closer.

The Punto Sporting is more comparable at £10k ish, slightly faster in a straight line, slower around the track Evo used to test it, and on the road. And the Ka has lovely steering, the Punto has electric steering with very little feel IMO, though I suspect Steve will argue with me on that.

I'd much sooner be shoving a Ka down a road quickly than a Punto from my experience of both cars, though I reckon the Ka will rust first.

Are they still buying the V6's for the Galaxy from VW?

I hear Honda dealers are a bit nuts when it comes to the Civic Type R they keep telling the drives to reve it more. Works well for a 20 minute test drive but owners do seem to get board of having to thrash it so much. Still if it's not your car who cares. ;)

I'm sure they are.... isn't it a VR6 lifted from the Golf / Passat?

Pretty sure all the engines from the Galaxy are VAG-sourced, actually.

Well, apart from the 2.3 petrol, which looks like it's the old Scorpio lump.

As far as I know it's the old 12v VR6 the only 2.3 that I can think of in the VAG range is the V5 (10v and 20v lumps with a cylinder chopped off) If they are all vag based that could come in handy as I know a V6 from the Galaxy sells for less than the VW badged version when broken, just a little heavy though.

Dan405

That's a bit like saying that VWs looked at gas turbines to shift the mark five Golf's bulk earlier this year!

You and I both know that a whole host of 1.6s produce around and about 100 PS, but this doesn't prove anything.

Drive the car, don't believe everything you read. It's possible that there are other people out there who will hate a certain brand "just because."

Sorry? Are you trying to tell me that the 1.6 CVH has good low down torque? Or are you trying to tell me that the Endura-E doesn't have low down torque? Or that consumers don't want tractable engines?

Okay, over a week ago you told me that you didn't dislike Fords, just small ones, then as I recall you slated the Mondeo (not a small Ford), and now you're just slating Fords for being Fords.

But in response to your question, when you can manufacture something that is good for most of the population, it makes business sense. Making something that most people won't really consider materially much better, for a higher price, with a higher list price, means you'll sell fewer units - and makes less sense. It's a little over simplified, but I think you'll get what I mean.

You mean the Zetec-SEs, don't you?

Because if something works, and does the job well, why bother to replace it? Most Ka owner / drivers don't really care what type the engine is, where it is, what wheels are driven, or what it's maximum power output is. They almost certainly don't check the oil every week mile, or the tyre pressure, or the coolant. But what they appreciate is a tractable donk. The Ka was not originally designed to be a racing street machine, it's a city runabout, it was designed and built to meet the market.

A lot of people like to dismiss a certain model because it doesn't meet their exacting requirements. The older model Corsas (awful ride and handling compromise, rubbery gear shift), the Punto (heave-ho handling, rough ride, poor build quality), the older Fiesta (too cramped for a family), whatever. People tend to forget about the target market for these machines.

Kinda. It was revised for the Galaxy / Alhambra / Sharon (!).

The 2.0 and 2.3 petrols are Ford units.

And a fine piece of donk it is too!

I seem to recall it being 90 PS.

Have you tried the 1.6 Sportka? Simply having more poiwer doesn't make it a better car. It makes it a faster car in a straight line, but it doesn't make it better. It's entirely likely that the 1.6 was concieved because it feels "fast enough" for the target market, but not too fast so as to appeal to the Saxo boys and girls /cough/ and so adjust the image _that_ way.

And let us not forget the temptation of a Ka ST150 model, using a 2.0 engine, at some point in the future. But personally I'm not going to hold my breath, given Ford's "if you want more power, buy a bigger car."

Indeed, this highlights Ford's thinking. And to a degree, most other manufacturers - if you want over ~130 PS, you need to move up a class, perhaps so they can put in greater safety equipment! >:-)

And your point is . . . ? But so what? It's good business practice - get the French to do the hard work and take a licence fee, and you sell the cars with their donks.

The Zetec-SE is more a joint venture compared to the TDCi / HDi donks.

The RoCam is also known as the RoCam Duratec, and is simply known as the Duratec in the UK.

Unfortunately, this much is clear.

The 1.3 and 1.6 Duratecs are 8 valvers, and that I have seen, use almost identical heads. The point is that the 1.6 Zetec-SE is a larger engine, and requires some modification to get it to fit into the engine bay, whereas the Duratec is rather more compact and requires less (if any) modification to get it to fit. Given the difference in power output, it's insignificant, and the 1.6 Duratec is easier to tune to produce low and mid range torque.

Ahhh, we've moved on, it's not a CVH.

It is!

You get _both_ revvy and torquey with these new fangled 1.3 and 1.6 Duratec jobbies. You don't get the 7,200 rpm revvy nature of the small capacity

1.25 Zetec-SE, but you get considerably more stomp under 3,500 rpm (this not being difficult, really, heh).

LOL.

Yes, but that's prolly cos the Galaxy *IS* a VW.

Ford's V6 wouldn't fit without extensive mods.

Yep.

You need to move up a class, to make things bearable !

Who wants a 200bhp noisy tinbox shopping trolley ? Surely you'd MUCH rather have something bigger, smoother, and generally better all round, to get you places quickly ?

Sounds like you average italian car to me ! Or are you referring to the SportKa ?