Seing as a few people have owned mercs, what is..

Surely that's going to be dependent on the model and age of the car?

Classic = cheapskate spec Elegance = pensioner spec Avantgarde = "Harris from sales" Sport = badly chosen spec.

The Avantgarde is normally the nicest spec to own, doesn't have all the wood frippery of an Elegance or the fake carbon fibre of a Sport. Normally have decent size alloy wheels and nicely setup but firm suspension. With being a Mercedes a lot of stuff was optional, but by the time the trim levels with names were out things were better. Avantgarde is alloys, ac etc. Leather cost more, cd players were optional on early ones (the Bose CD head unit was extortionately expensive new), but things like headlight washers tend to be on lots of them. If you can find an E class with the "interior lighting package" that's a bonus worth having.

Pretty much it. W211 E classes have 1/2 artico (fake leather) seats and lower but not much stiffer than standard suspension. Aluminium and black wood trim. Elegance got headlamp wash wipe and auto dimming mirrors.

OK, an R plate E 300 Diesel. I thought maybe it had several standard parts that might or might not have additions.

Oh, that's the one that comes with more rust than a 1979 Fiat Mirafiori as standard.

Avoid like the plague.

So would one with cloth trim and a Sony headunit be inferior.

The one I've seen locally, and would need a small personal loan to buy=20 is described as=20 "MERCEDES-BENZ E300 DT Avantgarde , 4 Doors, Automatic, Saloon, Diesel,=20

1998 R Reg , 105,000 miles, Mauve, MOT-07-2009. ABS, Adjustable seats,=20 Air conditioning, Alloy wheels, CD, Central locking, Cloth upholstery,=20 Colour coding - Body, Colour coding - Interior, Computer, Driver airbag,=20 Electric mirrors, Electric windows, Head restraints, Heated screen,=20 Immobiliser, Metallic paintwork, Power assisted steering, Remote=20 locking. Insurance Group:15, =A33,650 "

I like the colour, but I would have thought I get could leather for that=20 price. Can't see any visible rust scabbing anywhere on it. Where do they=20 go? If i'm going to get a loan it needs to be something I'm going to be=20 happy keeping until I pay it off.

--=20 Carl Robson Audio stream:

How much is it, how much have you been offered for the Saab against it, or if no PX on offer, how much do you realistically expect to get back for that, and how much does it stand you in at?

How much do you expect to save on fuel a week by running one of these over the Saab, if you're brutally honest and realistic about the likely MPG you'd achieve with it?

-- JackH

My take from when I had the A class.

Classic - poverty spec, although that meant no aircon - everything else was there. Avantgarde - sporty, whatever the hell that means. Elegance - comfortable and plush.

So being old and decrepit, I would want an Elegance if I were having another.

I have a real sportscar for when I want sporty.

Do you ever read Car Mechanics magazine ?

They had one as a project car which had concealed rust in the lower front suspension crossmember. It looked like something that had been pulled out of a river so bad was the corrosion on the part.

Externally, the car was very nice.

I wouldn't.

So let's get this straight... yes, the Saab has a few niggle you can't put up with any more, but aside from these a consideration for changing it is so you can save on fuel and ergo save money?

I may be offloading my Passat in the next few months once I've got a company car, and I'll let it go for whatever the settlement figure is on the finance at that time (it'll be below whatever it books at by the time I get round to doing it) - might be worth considering if you're still not happy with whatever it is you're driving around at that time.

It might not be your ideal car but it would be something I could vouch for in terms of economy and reliability, and what with it mapped to

176bhp ad 276Nm of torque, I think you'd find the performance vs economy ratio more than adequate. ;-)

-- JackH

Oooooooh that must have been the copy I read in hospital not long ago whilst waiting. No idea how old the mag was, but that all sounds scarily familiar :-)

Elder gurgled happily, sounding much like they were saying:

Early W210?

They're the ones with the bulkhead that rots structurally, aren't they?

Windscreen price =A33650 Haven't asked about px. Don't know but if things start falling=20 off/failing as they have been just recently, weigh in value.

Noticed the last few weeks that it has been a bit awkward pulling away=20 when cold, I put it down to the clutch master seals being a bit hard and=20 the clutch being a bit sharp until pumped a few times. But the last=20 couple of days it has seemed to stumble a bit until warm. As it had a=20 full biggie service 8 months before I bought it, and an annual service=20 when I had the headgasket done(they were doing the oil and coolant=20 anyway), my thought is the DI cassette is starting to fail. =A3175

Noticed at idle today, collecting the car from the alarm place (they had=20 turned the radio off) fuel pump is starting to tick at idle. Next step=20 is starting to whine. This might be the silly expensive one. If it is a Walbro, =A360 if it is a bosch, =A3250 not interchangeable and= =20 don't know till it packs up and is replaced.

The resistor pack for the interior fan has gone so I only have fan on=20 full blow. =A360 + a few hours labour from someone who knows there way arround the=20 aquarium.

I know it sounds like itchy feet again, but this week seems to be the=20 one where everything has come to a head, where things are starting to go=20 expensively wrong.=20

I know these will be manufacturers figures but Insurance Group=0915 Fuel Economy: Urban=0925.9 Fuel Economy: Extra Urban=0946.3 Fuel Economy: Combined=0935.8 Emissions Data (co2 gm/km)=09209

Figures for the Saab (bear in mind I'm getting less than this as it=20 doesn't have the aero transmission fitted, but a standard injection). Insurance Group=0917 Fuel Economy: Urban=0923.0 Fuel Economy: Extra Urban=0932.3 Fuel Economy: Combined=0928.1 Emissions Data (co2 gm/km)=09227

Loan cost will be roughly =A3100 a month, plus fuel + servicing. I tend to be good on tyres (didnt do a Tim Kemps everywhere even when I=20 had the Lexcelsior).

It will be 5 years newer, nearly 70k less miles on it, bodily the one I=20 have seen is in much better shape. The Saab has a dent or scratch on=20 every panel, and loads of bad touchups.

I will lose out initially on buying it but there might be some peace of=20 mind rather than financial gain in the long term.

How often have I refused to enter into having thoughts about taking a=20 loan for a car. It just seems, if you want a diesel auto for under =A33-4k= =20 within 40 miles of me, it is going to be a leggy merc, an import 4x4,=20 and ex taxi, or a starship with no MOT and tax (or an Aixam).=20

--=20 Carl Robson Audio stream:

It might not be arround that long. If the DI is going, it could die at=20 the side of the road and need a =A3175 injection to make it mobile again. =20

--=20 Carl Robson Audio stream:

Thats why I'm asking. That's why I want to know from someone who knows Mercs.

Interior is very clean and exterior is visually pretty unmarked apart from a few small chips arround the headlights and it has a new MOT, but what ever I borrow for has to be better than my usual banger that I buy with a fresh ticket because I either sell before the next one, or just after it scrapes through with advisories.

And the strut towers. And the wings. And the sills. And the floors. And the bootlids.

Unless they've been properly attended to under warranty. Have it inspected, if it's rust free now it'll stay that way. Check the VIN against the main dealer network and find out if a rust claim has been put in - if so it'll likely be a good one.

Ask on

It's a lot of money for a car that could potentially have an MOT fail for structural rust in the next few years.

I've been browsing again - a Volvo S60 D5 can be had at half the age for that kind of money.

Agreed.

And with Vamp we have seen that paying "over the odds for a good one with history" doesn't help much when it turns out the verified history isn't as verified as it seemed.