MM Camber Guage - experiences?

It may be a bit late for this, however, I was intrigued with MM's new camber gauge kit. It is inexpensive ($60), portable, and offers accuracy to

1/8-deg., which is pretty impressive for portable mechanical gear. It was delivered today, however I haven't opened the box yet.

Any real-world experience with this item I should know about? I've been itching to set Charlene's camber to zero for a while now, but it's a bear to get into my favorite shop for professional work. (One must book an appt. 6 weeks in advance. They're that good.) I thought I'd try this one out in my own driveway this weekend, but if it's a piece, I won't bother.

So far, I haven't heard anything good or bad about it here. Perhaps I am breaking new ground myself?

-JD

________________________________________________________ | | | 1998 Laser Red GT RAMFM Member Since 1998 | | M-5400-A Suspension http:/207.13.104.8/users/jdadams || Subframe Connectors & Seat Bracing, Strut Tower Brace || 4-point K-frame Brace, Tremec T-45 & OEM 3.27:1 Gears ||________________________________________________________|

Reply to
JD Adams
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I've used similar (even gone as far as a straight-edge and a protractor once) and should get you real close in the ball park (bubble gauges are only so good) if you split hairs. Two things to be sure of.... the rim needs to be dead true and the ground you're on needs to be flat and level. If you've had the car jacked up, move it a few feet to let the suspension normalize...

HTH

Reply to
Jim Warman

When you change the camber:

Depending on the front end design. You might also change the caster, and you will definitely change the toe-in!

Plus, your driveway has to be level within a 1/132nd of an inch corner and side to side for accuracy!

Floor angle also changes alignment angle!

Just a warning, so you don't chew off a new set of tires.

I hope this helps?

Respectfully submitted,

Refinish King

Reply to
Refinish King

Actually:

In alignment theory class, a good instructor will tell you that: "A bubble gauge is more accurate than an electronic or computerized gauge!"

The level never lies, electronic sensors can!

I get cars that are in for problems, aligned a few times by competitors, I use the bubble equipment to diagnose those!

Refinish King

normalize...

Reply to
Refinish King

What you say is true to a point but either tool is only ever going to be as good as the hands grasping it. I also get the ones that no one else seems to be able to cure and always seem to send happy customers down the road. You will admit that this has more to do with pride and experience than anything else.

How many times do you see something that can only be described as a white knuckle drive because someone simply got angles into spec rather than right? Too often.....

I prefer the electronic aligner (which I calibrate probably more often than it needs, BTW) since it tends to be quicker (especially with the jack and hold feature) and accurate enough to deliver a good handling car that will not wear tires unevenly and give me a straight steering wheel without a fight. I used bubble gauges for many years but still prefer the electronics. (Now if a guy could stop agonizing over that last tenth of a degree 8^) )

Reply to
Jim Warman

I use the FASTRAX setup from

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bit more $ but it works fantastic.

TIM -aka- MUSTTANGUY "at" AOL "dot" COM

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Reply to
Musttanguy

I can agree with you to a point:

but, I don't sell alignment as a service. I sell it as a diagnostic and corrective service. true too many techs just let spec. go as good!

I prefer perfect, and if it's not attainable, I check for any problem there might be, with frame gauges and tram, tape measure and strut tower or frame control arm mounting flanges.

they don't make guys like us anymore, but a DIYer can make a mess on a driveway sloped 4 degree to the left, don't you agree?

Just a thought!

Respectfully submitted,

Refinish King

electronics.

Reply to
Refinish King

I think a DIYer can make a c*ck-up of replacing tie rod ends let alone adjusting stuff. Too many times I have seen someone figure they are saving money and they bring me a car with 3 inches of inner threads and a half inch of outer threads showing. And I'm supposed to do something with this.

With the electronic rack I love the ability to align the whole car instead of just the front. I rarely do a two wheel alignment without taking the centreline into account. Unless asked, my alignments are conservative...... no pull, no wear - boring. It's rare that I get asked for a "sporty" alignment... consumers and service advisers alike don't realize don't realize what us grunts down in the trenches can do.... especially if we have a clue.

Enough damage can be done with a driveway sloped a half degree..... Keep up the good work

message

Reply to
Jim Warman
** I've used similar (even gone as far as a straight-edge and a protractor ** once) and should get you real close in the ball park (bubble gauges are only ** so good) if you split hairs. Two things to be sure of.... the rim needs to ** be dead true and the ground you're on needs to be flat and level. If you've ** had the car jacked up, move it a few feet to let the suspension normalize...

The rims are perfect, but the ground the car sits on is suspect. I plan to obtain a long bubble level Saturday and check it.

I'm hopeful that it is off by about 0.5 deg. You see, the tech that set it up promised me exactly -0.50 deg. on both sides. I leveled the tool by using a separate bubble level to shim up the side of the garage door using thin cardboard and duct tape to make it perfectly straight vertically, then I zero'ed the alignment tool by placing it up against that, making sure it was also perfectly horizontal using that other bubble level as well.

After zero'ing it out both vertically and horizontally, I checked both wheels. They're both set to exactly -0.9375 degrees, which is a far cry from the -0.50 deg. I asked for. I'm hopeful that the floor the car sits on is off a bit, which would explain the difference. A long piece of 2X4 and a long bubble level placed on the cement foundation that the car sits on should tell me for sure. I'll probably just calculate the difference, rather than shim the floor underneath the tires. I also plan to drive the car forward 2 feet and check again, just to be 100% sure the wheels aren't throwing it off.

My goal is to obtain 0.00 deg. camber. The toe is already set to 0.00 as well. I'm one of those people who believe that Mustangs exhibit way too much neg. camber from the factory, and that given a +4.00 deg. pos. caster rate, enough dynamic negative camber is generated in tight turns, negating the need for any static neg. camber. Some claim I will burn the outside edges on long freeway drives. I've never found this to be a problem with any car I've ever driven. And I'm sure the inside sidewalls will thank me when I'm done.

Thanks for the advice, Jim. And you're right: mechanical tools ARE only as good as the person holding them.

Quick question: must I remove the weight from the front end before adjusting the cam angle? I'm sure there is some weight borne by the strut towers, but is it enough to concern myself with? I assume so, and plan to lift the chassis and adjust each side a tiny bit, then drop it back down to check. Close? I would imagine I'd also have to drive it a few feet back, then forward to the same spot after dropping it back down as well.

-JD

________________________________________________________ | | | 1998 Laser Red GT RAMFM Member Since 1998 | | M-5400-A Suspension http:/207.13.104.8/users/jdadams || Subframe Connectors & Seat Bracing, Strut Tower Brace || 4-point K-frame Brace, Tremec T-45 & OEM 3.27:1 Gears ||________________________________________________________|

Reply to
JD Adams

An old timer's quick pinch substitute for turntables:

Four square 1 foot by 1 foot pieces of sheet metal. grease in between two, and grease in between another set of two.

Place one set of plates of sheet metal under each front tire in place of turn tables. this will relieve any constriction on the tires and give you a more accurate reading.

I hope this helps?

Refinish King

Reply to
Refinish King

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