MPG experience?

I have just discovered this newsgroup, so please forgive me if I ask questions that have been raised before. I would like to hear about your experience with gas mileage. Since picking up my '05 Prius, I have filled it four times. My MPG averages 44. The last was 38. This is disturbing, so I arranged with the local dealer to look at it. They did a number of tests, particularly the highway test, today. Result: 44 MPG. The service guy said that the MPG will increase with more miles on the car. I have only 2000 so far. Also, he said that my MPG would increase if I would fill with a better grade of gas, such as Chevron or Shell. I have been using Arco. I would appreciate any comment, particularly comparing with your experience. Many thanks.

Harlan

Reply to
HH
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I neglected to mention in my original post above that I drive very conservatively and carefully, and about 75% of my driving is city.

Harlan

Reply to
HH

The MPG rating will be about 46 or 47 MPG on Avg. The rating listed by sticker is completely unrealistic, and will no doubt be changed in the future to reflect real-world circumstances.

I wouldn't worry too much about it. Just remember to use the regenerative braking and drive softly on the acceleration.

KK

Reply to
Kevin Kirkeby

I am pretty happy that I averaged 40.2 MPG with my first tank. The EPA ratings are ALWAYS pipe dreams. Sometimes I think that in order to achieve them you have to be a jockey, driving downhill with a lot of wind behind you, filling a parasail.

John '05 - Driftwood Pearl - Package 6

309 total miles
Reply to
John J. DeGrazia

It won't be changed unless the EPA changes its testing procedures--assuming that nothing else (e.g., engine, drag coefficient, vehicle weight, etc.) changes.

Reply to
Michelle Steiner

Exactly. The ratings were never intended to be reflections of what people get in the real world; they were for comparison. The CAFE averages used the EPA fuel economy ratings.

Mike

Reply to
Michael Pardee

Reply to
Thorn Cuber

Oh! This is pretty dissapointing. Also a friend told me that Prius was actually worse than a good 2.0 turbo diesel from any Euro manufacturer

So why would i want to buy a Prius if there are other, cheaper cars with better MPG?

Thanks

Reply to
Robin Smith

As many have pointed out, the dollars in fuel savings at current prices will never make up for the price difference between the Prius and the similar Corolla. Fuel economy alone is not the best reason to choose the Prius. There have always been cheaper cars with better fuel economy than more expensive cars.

I was hooked by the smoothness of the power delivery, the manueverability (we have a 2002) and the comfort. It was just right for us. I never even considered a diesel - they are still noisy at low speeds, smoky at hard acceleration (yes - even the late model TDi's smoke here at 7000 feet when accelerating up hills in town), and diesels don't age gracefully. When the engine wears they start on ever fewer cylinders and smoke more. Direct injection can't change the laws of physics. And I have been on two charter vehicles, a tour bus and a whale watching charter, that suffered turbo failure on the diesels. Both blew oil spray and huge volumes of smoke out the tail pipes. I don't know about the bus, but the boat went through a 5 gallon can of oil getting back into port from about a mile out. Things like that make me not want to go there.

To each their own. Many people buy Prius for the low emissions. I was interested because the technology is the only sensible way to approach a car in mixed city/highway use.

Mike

Reply to
Michael Pardee

He's wrong.

Well, if you want cheap, go for cheap. You can get an Echo for $12,325 or a Rio for $10,535.

But if you want a midsize car with one of the best gas mileages available, and is one of the lowest polluting cars, some luxury items, and some leading-edge technology, the only answer is Prius.

Reply to
Michelle Steiner

There is a diesel Volkswagen that can achieve 50 MPG. My research reveals that it is not for sale in California. Many of you don't live in Ca so this is no concern of yours. Diesel fuel here in San Diego is more expensive than

87 octane gasoline. Unless you have a source for bio diesel, you may be in the same situation.

Of course... Your mileage may vary.

John '05 Driftwood Pearl - Package 6

400 miles of smiles at 44.5 MPG
Reply to
JJ

It's also not for sale in any state that has the same emission requirements as California. That's because the car can't pass the emissions test.

It's also a smaller car than a Prius, with fewer features and options.

And around here, it's more expensive than 91 octane gasoline.

Reply to
Michelle Steiner

I see your points but I dont think I made myself clear. I'm interested solely in C02 and am looking for the least polluting sensibly sized car

I dont mind paying for efficiency, but it seems that the diesel is "both" cheaper and more fuel economic that the Prius

I love the Prius for its technology and probably being the precursor to a cleaner environement(and hopefully nuclear powered if the public perception is open minded enough) and a faster track to hydrogen

Now I see the reality in the fuel consumption, its got a long way to go and I'm a little sad about this. I did leave a thread last week about the weight/safety issue and this too still has to be addressed. Again i dont mind sacrificing other budget items to pay for this.

rgds

regenerative

Reply to
Robin Smith

Be aware *all* cars suffer the "real world" losses in fuel economy the Prius does. A significant part of every tank of fuel goes into something other than covering miles: heating or cooling the occupants, keeping lights lit. In conventional cars a lot of fuel is burned at zero mpg, waiting in traffic. Today's hybrids control that part well.

Mike

Reply to
Michael Pardee

snip

Right. A round trip from point A to point B and back will consume a certain amount of fuel, be it gasoline, propane, diesel, or electricity. ALL of the energy released by the propulsion process in using up that amount of fuel ends up as waste heat (internal energy) discharged to the atmosphere. That's the price we pay for moving our butts around the planet.

The trick is to maximize or optimize the efficiency of the conversion process (energy to work) and keep parasitic losses, such as excess weight, tire friction, internal engine friction, electrical losses, pumping losses and air drag to a minimum. That is, very simply, strive for the highest MPG possible.

The Prius, by using a small engine with electric motor boosts as needed, stopping the engine instead of letting it idle when the vehicle is stopped, and utilizing regenerative braking has shown the way to go. I think it is definitely the wave of the future made possible by computer control.

By the way Robin, forget hydrogen as a significant replacement for petroleum based fuel. Ain't going to happen. One man's opinion, but I know a lot about what would be involved in attempting that. There's no good answer for replacing petroleum based fuels. We're in an ever-tightening bind.

Rod

Reply to
Rod

If you are interested soley in CO2 emissions, the Prius is King.

There are several measures of effciency. MPG measures just the amount of fuel needed to move the car a certain distance. The CO2, NOX and other pollutants generated per mile is a different measure. The Prius (last year) was the very cleanest in this regard, and the diesels and other technologies did not come close.

Daniel

Reply to
dbs__usenet

Why only CO2? Don't other pollutants matter?

Diesel is more expensive than 91 octane around here; does not meet California emission standards; and very few diesel cars in the USA have better fuel mileage than the Prius does--and those that do are smaller than the Prius and are bottom of the line models.

The reality of fuel consumption for the Prius is that in real world operation, it gets between about 46 MPG to well over 50 MPG, depending on numerous factors, the most important being the conditions of the average trip and the driving habits of the operator.

My autumn mileage is about 51-53 MPG; my summer and winter mileage is about 46-48 MPG; I haven't operated a Prius in the Spring yet, but I expect it to be about the same as Autumn.

Reply to
Michelle Steiner

Thanks guys some good points, I feel better educated about the case for hybrid now, especially given that official figures dont factor in the special items already mentioned, which can only make the case better

Couple of things though:

  • I did a study and comparing Govt official figures it seems a ford Focus
1.8 turbo diesel with direct injection emits 50% more CO2 than the prius and overall consumption is still 20% better for the Prius. This does not factor the above special items. So its still significantly better using a Hybrid over the state of the art diesel available

  • About hydrogen, I agree its a long shot and a great effort. But I think I would prefer the associated expense and trade offs, rather than wait for the water to start lapping at the front door step(I live 75m about MSL so should be OK, but not so for those living 10M or less above MSL after the next 30 years or so) For more data on this point please see
    formatting link
    BTW I'm by no means a tree hugging green. Nuclear seems the only way to resolve this, Kyoto is a nice try but naive. Lets not go there (:

Rgds

Reply to
Robin Smith

Cheers got that from soem research over the weeked. Appreciate your dilligence and I agree totaly now

rgds

Reply to
Robin Smith

snip

Thanks for the site reference. Very interesting. I'm going to check that out when I have more time. We are on the same track. I don't want to clutter this group with off-topic messages, but this is not exactly off-topic.

I am in total agreement that clean nuclear is the way to go, but I'm sure you know the limitations there. Are you an engineer? You sound like one. I'm a Chem E, retired prof, with a deep oil and shallow nuclear background.

Incidentally, it's not a good idea to post your email address in newsgroups. You'll get on the spam lists and who knows what else. Note how some posters disguise theirs. I don't put mine up at all.

Rod

Reply to
Rod

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