Our daughter bought a Honda Fit, which seems to be a high quality car. Compared to my '04 Prius, it has less interior space behind the passengers (mitigated by the remarkable folding seat scheme) but the cars are otherwise comparable. The fit has somewhat better performance and feels sportier, the Prius has a more comfortable ride and has the feeling of a larger car.
The Fit was about $15k. A comparable Prius would be about $25k.
Her Fit gets about 38mpg, my Prius gets about 44mpg.
I understand Honda plans to issue the Fit with a hybrid drivetrain - a great idea, but it will probably not be perceived as a 1:1 competitor to the Prius.
Toyota is going to re-do the Prius as a brand, a la Scion, and will produce three cars: the current car, a larger car (Camry-sized), and a smaller car (Fit-sized). All will be hybrids, of course, as Prius will be their hybrid brand.
I suspect the Fit hybrid will compete with the low end Prius once that comes out. But the Fit hybrid could come out sooner.
...it seems a little sportier (to her eye) ...it handles better (in her experience) ...it comes in copper, her preferred color ...with seats cleverly folded, interior space = Prius (about) ...and the Fit cost $10k less, but that wasn't an issue. Even at today's gasoline prices, the mileage difference does NOT generate enough money differential to pay the interest she would lose on the cash (we're loathe to borrow except on mortgages).
I think these are two excellent choices, and my daughter agrees. Both should live for 200k miles or more, but the spectre of an expensive battery replacement looms only with the Prius.
She also drove both editions of the Yaris and very definitely did not like them.
So with seats up, the Fit has less available space to put luggage. The Prius is a better long hauler with 4 people and their stuff. If that's not an issue, it's not an issue.
You bring up an interesting point about the battery. I don't think anyone other than a rabid Prius fanatic will deny that the battery
*will* become an issue. The question is, will it become an issue during your ownership? If you're thinking 200K miles, then I agree: yes, it's likely.
But in my mind, the battery in the Prius is like the automatic transmission in any other car, Fit included: it's likely to need attention between 100K and 150K miles. The modern automatic transmission is very complex and is very easy to screw up, and likely
*will* need serious attention. People don't think about it, though; they see that "well, I need a car, and cars have to have transmissions, so..." and they ignore the fact that they're buying something with a very fragile drivetrain part that will be very expensive to fix WHEN it needs fixing.
But for some reason, when it comes to Prius, they focus on the battery as if it's something "all-new" for them to worry about. Yes, in terms of it being a battery, it is. That's true. But in terms of it being a $2000-$3000 part of the car that will need attention when the car gets over 100K miles, it's absolutely no different.
Offsetting the battery is the fact that the rest of the Prius is actually *simpler* than the average standard car--no starter, no alternator, and the mechanism that transfers power to the driveshafts--the Toyota Power Split Device--is INCREDIBLY simple and straightforward, and will likely require zero repairs EVER. The Power Split Device and the Hybrid Synergy Drive mechanism overall is utter genius in terms of effectiveness AND simplicity.
So I call it a draw on the battery issue vs. a conventional car with a conventional automatic transmission.
Now, if that Fit has a manual transmission...winner, Fit. If the interior space and the equipment levels fit your needs, there's no doubt the Fit is the winner. A 4 cylinder Honda engine mated to a Honda manual transmission is an absolute jewel to behold, and that drivetrain will take SERIOUS abuse while lasting forever. In fact, absent some seriously bad driving habits, I doubt that setup would even need a new clutch inside 200K miles.
Given that the Prius gets, for the average driver, 40-50mpg and the Fit gets only a little less...that $10K savings buys a lot of gas.
By the way--I got a Prius 4 months and 7000 miles ago. And I'm a Honda man from way, way back--back to the late 70s. I know what I'm talking about here.
How do you enjoy *your* Prius? Do you do any highway driving with it? I own a 2004 Honda CRV right now and am looking at an upcoming longer commute to work (55 miles one-way (with 35 of those miles on the 195 in New Jersey).
It's a fine car. I had it on a long trip a couple of weeks ago, and it was VERY comfortable. I sat down and didn't leave the car for 6 hours, and it was not tiring, not uncomfortable, nothing. The car just went. A week later, I came back. Same thing.
I went 75mph except for a few construction zones, sometimes I used cruise control, the climate control was on keeping me comfy, and I got
53mpg. I don't drive the car any special way, I drive it like I've driven cars for years--and that's what it got me.
I'm getting between 40 and 50mpg overall.
As far as comfort goes, you'd probably be very happy doing your commute in the Prius.
The front passenger seat folds down flat in the Fit, just like it does in the Matrix and most other small hatchbacks, so you can fit long objects inside, but not in the Prius.
I disagree, but I don't have details yet. I have seen between 10 and 20 reports each of two expensive failures in Prius cars: hybrid battery and hybrid transaxle. The transaxle is the worse, costing right at twice the price of the battery. What strikes me - although I haven't recorded and analysed the reports yet - is that transaxle failure occurs much more often in older cars. I only know of one that occurred in the first year and IIRC there was another around the 50K mile mark. But the battery failures don't seem to correspond to age at all; they appear to be randomly distributed. New, middle-aged, old, it can happen. Battery failure just remains extremely rare; way under 1% of Prius have ever needed a replacement battery. Mine is just over 110K miles and I don't expect trouble.
I know of several 2001 models that have reached the 200K mile mark and only one I can think of that needed a battery that late in life... around 201K miles, IIRC.
Front seat in the current NHW20 Prius does fold down to nearly flat. You just have to move the front seat back on the track so that the headrest clears the front dash. I've carried an 8' pole without needing to fold the seat, but I've heard of others carrying an 8' kayak inside the car or 8' long lumber in the car with the seats down.
My guess is "no." With that many miles there must be a lot of freeway driving, and the fuel economy difference shrinks. Depending on the speed, the difference can be as little as 10%. To save $10K you'd have to spend $100K, and at $3 per gallon that means 30K gallons... or the better part of a million miles!
My recommendation: if you like the Fit after a comprehensive test drive, go for it! $15K is a good price and as Elmo says, you can expect great service as long as the maintenance schedule is followed.
Fit, call it 30mpg, fuel cost is $0.10/mile (cheaper to buy but more expensive to operate)
Prius, call it 45mpg, fuel cost is $0.0667/mile (more expensive to buy, but cheaper to operate)
for a difference of $0.0333/mile
A $10,000 price difference, at $0.333/mile difference, means the cheaper to buy/more expensive to drive car meets the more expensive to buy/cheaper to drive car at 300,000 miles. That's the break-even point for fuel cost.
At $4/gallon:
Fit, fuel cost is $0.1333 Prius, fuel cost is $0.0888 difference = $0.045; break even is 222,222 miles.
And so on.
Ask yourself: where will gas prices be in 5 years? Certainly not as low as $3/gallon.
2007 Toyota Prius average MPG from owners:> 45.9 (and that's the lowest average of the NHW20 model...)>
That is, the Fit has to burn more than 3000 gallons more than the Prius to cover the difference in price.
It's the slim differential in consumption that creates the problem. If the fuel economy is only 10% better (highway driving) roughly ten times the difference in car price has to be spent on fuel - $100,000 - to make the difference. That is around 30,000 gallons, and at 40 to 50 mpg it would take about one million miles to make the $10K difference. If the car were driven mostly in town the gap would be closed much more quickly.
In 2001, we did a similar comparison between the 2001 Prius, $22k, and
2001 Echo, $14.2k. We bought the Echo and it is on the driveway with just over 25,000 miles. My wife didn't drive the car enough to justify the Prius and I was still driving our 32 MPG, 91 Camry.
In 2005, the Camry was lost in an accident due to an unexpected insurance company rule. I needed a replacement car but didn't have a lot of cash so I bought a used, 2003 Prius, $17.3k. The other alternative was a Scion xB at $16.4k.
The Prius is on the driveway and has gone 37,000 miles at an average of
52 MPG. With a total mileage of 87,000 miles, I still have 13,000 miles of battery and inverter warranty and complete confidence that I can handle any major repair using salvage parts.
The rule of thumb is to get the right tool for the right job. In 2001, it was an Echo. In 2005, it was a used Prius. It really depends upon what it is going to be used for and managing the risks.
BTW, I've made three trips of over 700 miles each way. At a cruise control speed of 65 mph, I'm getting 52-53 MPG and finding it is an excellent ride. The Prius lower noise and vibration makes it a much nicer ride than the Echo. Both have 1,500 CC engines, the same engine block.
Not in our 2007 Prius. The front passenger seat reclines, but does not fold forward. At least, not with any levers I've found and not according to the manual.
If you know how to fold the passenger seatback forward, please teach me.
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