prius worth getting?

No, "weight" is not a unit of anything. Pounds are units of mass. Slugs are units of mass.

You are one confused fool, failing to understand the simple fact that "weight" is an ambiguous word, one with several different meanings.

The word "weight" entered Old English over 1000 years ago, meaning the quantity measured with a balance. That quantity is mass, not force. It was used as a measure of how much stuff people had, for the purpose of trade. We still use the very same word today, with the very same meaning, for the very same purposes.

Weight is never a force when anybody talks about "net weight" of anything, nor about "tare weight" of its container. Naturally, when products in American supermarkets and auto parts stores and whatever include pounds and ounces for this weight, they are every bit as much units of mass as the grams and kilograms which appear right alongside them on the same label. In fact, we no longer have independent standards for those pounds; since a 1959 international agreement, the common, worldwide definition of these pounds is as units of mass exactly equal to 0.45359237 kg.

Weight is never a force when anybody talks about "troy weight" of anything. That's one way the troy units differ not only from their avoirdupois cousins, but from grams and kilograms as well--they have never spawned units of force of the same name. There is no troy ounce force, never has been.

Weight is never a force when anybody talks about "carat weight" of anything (5 carats = 1 gram in the modern definition).

formatting link
?body=S Fuel tank capacity (l) 45 . . . Load Capacity Kerb weight (kg) 1300 Gross vehicle weight (kg) 1725

formatting link
Prius

Curb weight is 2,733 pounds--about 250 pounds heavier than a Corolla, and 330 pounds more then a Ford Focus sedan.

formatting link
Curb weight: 2,890 lbs. (1,311 kg)

[Note that this is the number you used, Rod--GN]

formatting link
047&trimid=-1&src=VIP Curb Weight - Automatic (lb.) 2890

Now, Rod, it is your turn. Like you said, those kilograms are units of mass. Now, why in the hell don't you just explain to us all exactly what is done differently when this "curb weight" is measured in pounds, from what is done when it is measured in kilograms.

While you are at it, tell us why in the world the manufacturers would measure two different quantities for this purpose in the first place?

Or just wake up and smell the coffee. Let's add another to my list above: weight is never a force when anybody talks about "curb weight" or "kerb weight." It doesn't make any difference how they spell it. It doesn't make any difference whatsoever what units they use to express it. Nobody in the whole wide world ever measures curb weight in newtons, and nobody in the whole wide world ever measures curb weight in pounds force.

You can. But the only units of energy in the only subsystem which includes slugs are foot-pounds force.

You don't have pounds force. You have pounds mass.

If you use pounds mass and feet per second in your kinetic energy formula, the result is in foot poundals. It is just as easy to convert foot poundals to Btu, as your calculations converting foot pounds force to Btu were.

If the curb weight is indeed 1311 kg, as listed in one of the sites above, at exactly what areas on the surface of the earth would that much mass exert a force of 2890 pounds force, measured to the nearest pound force? Note that even if you limit yourself to sea level on the surface of the earth, a mass of 1311 +/0.5 kg will exert a force of from 2881.4 lbf to 2898.9 lbf (throw in elevation, including Mt. Chimborazo, the highest mountain on earth in both ways relevant to this discussion, and the variation on the surface of the earth is even greater). But 1311 kg is 2890 lb anywhere on earth, or anywhere else.

If curb weight were in pounds force, as you erroneously believed, you'd never have more than 2 significant digits, if all you know about location is that it is somewhere on earth.

It is indeed relevant to figuring any change in the fuel efficiency overall.

I'm intrigued by the idea, but I've never even seen a Prius.

Gene Nygaard

Reply to
Gene Nygaard
Loading thread data ...

and nothing else deserved consideration.

Reply to
Bill

Thanks Bill. You are right. He has no interest in the Prius, just wants to show off his knowledge of an arcane subject. How do you suppose he landed on the Prius newsgroup? Do you suppose he Googles newsgroups looking for people who abuse units? Chief of the Units Police maybe? Anyway, I just put him in the kill-filter box and closed the lid.

Rod, the happily confused fool.

Reply to
nobody

I didn't read beyond the insult (never do) but having spent a lifetime in engineering, the topic boors me to distraction anyway.

I ordered a Prius on June 25th and was 9th on the waiting list. I'm now 3rd on that list and will be 2nd by the end of the month. Mine will be black with the 2005 level 6 package. Is it worth it? From the standpoint of putting my money where my mouth is, yes. It is my environmental statement.

Reply to
Bill

I was told by a dealer recently that the $2000 tax exemption is no longer applicable. That may just be in CA. But what does "the Group" say?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Life is too short to post at the bottom! John (remove .remove to reply) DeGrazia

Reply to
John J. DeGrazia

No Way!

For some reason I thought you were a young, sexy, environmentalist. no-bra-wearin' hotty. That happened to monitor a NG about her car of choice. I guess first impressions can be deceiving!

Just kidding of course. But I still wanted to flirt!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Life is too short to post at the bottom! John (remove .remove to reply) DeGrazia

Reply to
John J. DeGrazia

Well, except for the young part, you pretty much got it right. We'll be celebrating my 62nd birthday at the local Rocky Horror Picture Show in a few weeks.

That too.

Well, you did get 4 out of 5, big boy.

Nothing wrong with that. ;)

Reply to
Michelle Steiner

It's a federal tax credit (not an exemption), and is applicable throughout the country.

In 2006, it will be reduced to $500, and in 2007, it will be eliminated--unless the law is changed again, that is.

Your dealer is just plain wrong.

Reply to
Michelle Steiner

To be more accurate, it is a tax deduction - you don't get $2000 back, but you do get to deduct $2000 from your taxable income. Still very worthwhile.

Mike

Reply to
Michael Pardee

I've met Michelle in real life. She's an older sexy, environmentalist...

Reply to
Mike Rosenberg

Sorry, I got the terms wrong; I knew what it was, but used the wrong term. Actually, it's neither a credit, exemption, nor deduction; it's an adjustment. It is entered on line 35 of the (2003; the line number may change for the 2004) tax return.

Credits: Money reducing the tax itself.

Exemption: Money reducing income, based on the number of people in the family (who meet age and other criteria) and certain physical conditions of the filer or filers (e.g., age and eyesight).

Deduction: Money reducing income, based on expenditures for certain activities (e.g., medical expenses, property tax, mortgage payments) meeting specific criteria--or a standard amount, depending on filing status (e.g., single, married, head of household)--whichever is greater.

Adjustment: Money reducing income based upon expenditures for certain listed activities, in addition to any exemptions or deductions.

The advantage of tax credits is that it reduces the tax dollar-for-dollar by the amount you can claim. All the rest reduce the tax by the percentage of your tax bracket. (E.g., a $100 deduction or adjustment results in a $25 tax savings for someone in the 25$ tax bracket.)

The advantage of adjustments is that you do not have to itemize to claim it. If your itemized deductions come to less than the standard deduction, you have to take the standard deduction, but you can then reduce your claimed income even further with any adjustments you may be eligible for.

Reply to
Michelle Steiner

Your dealer is misinformed.

Thanks to the newly signed "Working Families Tax Relief Act of 2004," the Clean Fueled Vehicle deduction has been extended. The amount of the deduction for purchases in 2004 and 2005 are now the old amount of $2000, whereas prior to the act the amounts were $1500 and $1000 respectively. 2006 is still $500, with the sunset still in 2007.

formatting link
0146,00.htmlhttp://www.irs.gov/newsroom/article/0,,id4549,00.html For information on how to file:
formatting link
and see the IRS Publication 535 "Business Expenses," chapter 12, for the Clean Fueled Vehicle federal income tax DEDUCTION.

Note that you can only take the deduction on NEW purchases (financing OK), but not on leased vehicles, or used vehicles.

Reply to
Michelle Vadeboncoeur

Right, Mike. Even if one takes the standard deduction instead of itemizing, they still benefit from the $2000.00 adjustment.

Reply to
Bill

But have you put the back seats down and done it in your Prius yet???

:)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Life is too short to post at the bottom! John (remove .remove to reply) DeGrazia

Reply to
John J. DeGrazia

I have owned an Insight for four years. I also just picked up my Prius. The Insight is a great car and you won't be able to beat the great mileage it gets. Love the Prius for all of its other great features, but it won't touch the Insight's mileaage.

Also, I was T-boned a few months ago, a woman with dialated eyes ran a stop sign. Nailed the Insight's passenger door. The officer was amazed at how well it took the damage. Repair costs were amazingly low, under $3,000.

- Robert

Reply to
RZ

Well, after reading these posts and many articles I decided to get a Prius, and I love it! The Prius had more room and features than the Insight, and according to the EPA, better gas mileage (for automatics)

- and that's the whole reason for me getting a hybrid. I've driven almost 400 miles already and it only cost me $13. A lot better than my $30+ a tank before.

For the person who wrote "ride a bike" probably doesn't live in CA or commutes to work.

Thanks for everyone's feedback.

-Aaron

Reply to
Aaron

Congrats, Aaron!

We now have 7000 miles on our '04 (purchased mid-July) and we cannot imagine having a nicer or more economical vehicle. Although we're not getting the 60 mpg that we've heard about, we don't baby it either and drive 80 on most Interstate highways and 60+ on the state highways and county farm-to-market roads.

We live in Iowa so it will be interesting to see how the Prius handles the cold weather but we expect no problems whatsoever.

Our fuel savings have been significant and it handles and rides like a dream. We truly believe that this is the best auto we've ever owned and we've owned some nice Caddies, Oldsmobiles, Chryslers, etc., in the past.

Good luck with your new Prius and I hope you enjoy yours as much as we are enjoying ours!

Larry Morphew '04 Toyota Prius '55 Studebaker Commander

---------------------------

don't want to waste my money buying a hybrid when I

Reply to
Larry Morphew

I have been told it is $1500 this year, it was $2000 last year.

Ken

Reply to
Ken

That's been changed by legislation passed last month. It was restored to $2000 this year (and next year). In 2006, it becomes $500, and after that it's eliminated--unless it's changed by legislation again.

Reply to
Michelle Steiner

And what a good influence you are. and have you visited the NG alt.impeach.bush yet?

>
Reply to
BananaRepublican

MotorsForum website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.