airbag for 93 9000CSET

No of course not. Just as the last time this old wive's tale was discussed. The airbags in the US don't cause any more (or less) injuries than they do anywhere alse. We are just a more litigious sort...

Reply to
Malt_Hound
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Sssshhhhh, I was trying to, well, nevermind.

An airbag is a hell of a lot softer than a dashboard, steering wheel, windshield, etc etc etc. If you wear your belts, you'll even be in the right place for it to help you. I've been an EMT for a dozen years or so, and I still can't think of anyone with head trauma who was belted and had an airbag. Plenty of folks with trauma who were unbelted. For the record, going head-first through the windshield, and then back, is really bad for your nose.

But, people will continue to badmouth airbags, not wear seatbelts, and think that they're speaking authoritatively on the subject without doing basic reasearch. I suppose that won't change.

Reply to
Dave Hinz

...and you would be correct more times than not. ;-)

I agree that some collisions are somewhat unavoidable once the situation develops. But we also tend to put ourselves into the positions where these unavoidable situations occur. When we drive, and where on the road we are at any given moment, that sort of thing.

For instance, when the driver ran the stop sign did you see him approaching and *assumed* that he would stop? How about the other one where they pulled into your lane? Were you approaching him from his rear (blind spot)? Had you not noticed that if you pulled alongside that car you would not have an escape route?

See, I ride a motorcycle too (only for pleasure) and the huge potential for incurring major bodily harm due to even the most minor of "collisions" has shaped my perspective even when driving in a well protected car like a SAAB. I *never* assume that a car is going to stop at a crossroad even if there is a stop sign or light. And I always assume that a driver is going to do about the most asinine thing possible.

A true story: This past weekend I was out on a ride around my semi-rural hometown. I happened to pass by a big soccer field complex where there was a line of cars illegally parked on the side of the road instead of in the parking lot provided. As I approached the cars I thought to myself, "I really need to go slow here, looks kind of congested, some kid might dart out from between the cars, or a ball could come rolling out or, etc...".

Well, as it turned out it was none of those things. Some soccer Mom in her SUV decided to try to make a nifty 3-point turn directly from her parking spot on the side of the road, just as I approached, which of course put her fully broadside across both lanes of the road directly in front of me. I can still see the look of horror on her face as she stared at me as it appeared I would not be able to stop without nailing her.

My Ducati has some really good brakes and sticky tires, so I was able to come to controlled stop without splattering myself across her lovely kid hauler with a few feet to spare. My bike has the headlight on at all times, so I'd be willing to bet that she never bothered to turn her head and look. She probably just "peeked" in the side mirror, if that, before making her "big move". She asked me three times if I was OK, even though I obviously did not hit her. I was too livid to even scream insults at her and could only manage to demand that she "look first next time,eh?"

Just to take my argument to the extreme, if you don't drive at all you will never get into collisions. Where, when and how you drive will all increase your chances proportionally. And I'm still not in denial... ;-)

Reply to
Malt_Hound

Nope. It's the same geniuses whose whole mission in life is to turn off DRLs. It's mostly a "guy" thing. Or I should say a "stupid macho guy" ego thing. "I don't need to wear a seatbelt because my reflexes are so incredibly quick and I'm so unbelievably clever I can avoid any accident" Some men need to feel in control at all times. They won't acknowledge they're subject to the same forces of nature as everyone else and they have no concept of the forces involved. One genius actually told me, "If I don't wear a seatbelt I'll be able to jump out of the car to avoid injury." In a nanosecond? I don't think so.

That brain surgeon Dale Earnhardt wouldn't wear a head restraint; he called it "The Noose" even though the guys with lots of letters after their name proved a hundred different ways how it worked. He knew better. Guess what killed him.

So, I guess I better replace that airbag.

Reply to
seog

Well, let's be realistic; we're talking milliseconds, not nanoseconds. Distorting the reality doesn't do your credibility any good in an argument. The point I'd make at that time would be that the car is designed to protect you, if you're _inside it_. Being ejected (or worse, "partially ejected") is a really bad thing - cars are large and heavy, and better to be inside than under.

I'd still pay someone else to do it, if it were me. But yeah.

Reply to
Dave Hinz

Here are some cites from the Dept of Traffic and Road Safety in Australian Mr Ignorant.

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Reply to
ShazWozza

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Reply to
MH

Thanks mate! Its is also called the Department Of Transport and Regional Services - duh! The GovCo here is always changing the names of its various departments.

In a similar vein ABS systems here in Australia are/were also better. Because of the large amount of dirt roads in rural areas, the controller firmware was developed to use a different strategy and it actually locks the wheels to build a dam of dirt in front of a wheel. Don't ask me to cite you on how the firmware senses unmade roads but it does.

You can use google to get your own cites for this.

Sweden also has large network of unmade roads so I expect that their ABS strategies are similar.

Reply to
ShazWozza

Pure heresay. First of all substantiate firmware used down under is different anywhere else. Secondly, even if it is, define "better". What is better downunder may actually be worse up yonder where there are mostly paved roads.

Reply to
yaofeng

I looked at your "cite", and it doesn't back up your claim that Saab uses different parts in the US for the airbags. Maybe I missed it. I do like your new name though.

Reply to
Dave Hinz

From

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: "US airbags must fire earlier and with greater force than the systems seen in Australia. . ... The US airbags fire with much greater force and are designed to stay inflated longer in order to prevent the unbelted occupant from going through the windscreen."

To me, this implies that some parts must be different.

Reply to
MH

Yes. I read the article. The bias in the writing is extreme, it's vague, and doesn't mention "Saab" once.

In general, perhaps.

In some cars, perhaps.

Reply to
Dave Hinz

This stuff is mandated by ADRs. Australian Design Rules. No new car can be sold in Australia unless it complies with the ADRs. It is as simple as that. That includes Saab cars.

The cost of complying with ADRs has a benefit in that it keeps a lot of junk out of the market (especially of US origin).

Reply to
ShazWozza

So you have a different cite then?

Yawn. Your bias is showing again.

Reply to
Dave Hinz

I'll help you out here. See, I have the CD version of the SAAB Electronic Parts Catalog virtually at my fingertips...

Hmmm. It seems there is only one part number for the subject 1993 SAAB

9000CSET Air bag module regardless of whether for a right hand drive or left hand drive version car. It is part number 44 16 061.

Well perhaps things changed later than 1993 after the Australian government "got on the ball" so to speak... Let's see what it looks like in model year 2002 9-3. Oh, there *are* two different part numbers for airbags in 2002. They are part numbers 52 04 243 and 52 05 059. The latter has the switch for the radio incorporated. So it appears that the same airbag modules are used in the US and Oz even in 2002.

Thank goodness. I'd hate to be killed by one of those rogue airbags!!

Reply to
Malt_Hound

Oh good. I didn't want to dig through my microfiche just for this.

Maybe the Australian parts are post-factory modified. Or maybe that guy's cite is, you know, wrong in this case. I suspect the latter to be more likely.

Hm. Dontcha just hate it when facts get in the way of a good anti-American rant?

Ah, but don't you see? That's how good the Australian's laws are, they protect us, too!

Dave "or something like that..." Hinz

Reply to
Dave Hinz

I agree with you on defensive driving. Always, always leave youself an escape route.

This obviously means no tailgating and watching the cars beside you. I also use the theory that it better to be behind a truck than in front of a truck - I can stop faster than the truck. If possible, never get between two trucks. You also mentioned to assume the other drivers are idiots and they will do every stupid thing possible. I drive the beltway enough to be able to predict which cars will come over without looking or signaling. I also practice pushing my Saab to its winter handling limits on a safe area - a flat empty parking lot. I know the car's/tires limits - and more importantly - my limits.

I based my theory on seatbelts and airbags on over 20 years of hands on and "hands in" operating room experience. All thoughts of riding a motorcycle went out the door after we worked on a person who slid over the gas tank of his motor cycle in an accident. The motorcycle had a gas cap that stuck out of the gas tank. You can guess what part of his body hit the gas cap . . .

Reply to
ma_twain

After I posted I googled around on this for a while. I did turn up a link at the DOT that had similar language to the Aussie site. You know, US airbags were originally designed to protect both with and without a seatbelt. That sort of thing...

But at least as far as SAABs go, there just isn't any difference that I can find so I'm not sure what that means. I wonder which "standard design" SAAB's airbags are aimed at.

Reply to
Malt_Hound

Yikes. Luckily for me my Duc is very aerodynamic and everything is flush. ...at least till you get to the speedo and bars. ;-)

Reply to
Malt_Hound

Malt_Hound wrote in news:yMSdnd997qsnG snipped-for-privacy@adelphia.com:

I didn't see the driver before she ran the stop sign. She was coming out of the entrance to an apartment complex and pulling out into a very busy street and right into me. On the interstate, I was just driving along and the car next to me suddenly pulled over on top of me. No signal, nothing. Simply changed lanes. Try keeping an escape route on a busy interstate through a construction zone -- no shoulder. Any empty spots are quickly filled by idiots who think it will get them there faster. The only way I got out of it was by running between the two lanes of traffic on the driver side. Luckily the 900 fit and I just lost a side mirror to a semi.

Reply to
Laura K

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