Omaha judging

Sounds like just another bunch of goofy quirks, during judging. The dull red wires belong on a '63. People that don't know what they are doing, should judge what they know and avoid what they don't. As far as I am concerned, they have taken the fun out of it so many times, that I refuse to be part of it any more. As far as the build sheet thing, that is just splitting hairs. KK

Studeski wrote:

How many GT Hawks decided to register in the Modified class? After the Charlotte Int'l Meet just about everyone was threatening to do so.

Lee

I will make a few comments and then I will shut up and it will be off of my chest. There were some very well restored cars being judged in Omaha and some very nice originals......an outstanding 51 Land Cruiser,

100% original just needed to have the engine compartment detailed....scored a second place. A two tone orange and black 54...17,000 original mile car....just needed the block touched up a little....scored a second. A 64 Daytona Wagon, red......absolutely beautiful restoration, incorrect tires.......scored a second. Very tough judges !!!! Why wouldn't one want to go into the custom class next time around.....less stress. Also if that hearse wasn't a 400 point car, I wouldn't know what one would be.

I don't think you'd want to go to custom class (division 8), at least based on what happened at Omaha. There wasn't a single first place winner out of the 43 cars and trucks in that division!. With over

25,000 miles on the clock, I knew a first would be a stretch for me, but there were some awesome vehicles entered, and I was stunned when they announced there were no first place winners. It seems we got the GT judges this time around?

S2DSteve

58packardwag> I will make a few comments and then I will shut up and it will be off

I just have to make a few observations.

1) They were begging for judges. I know some that stepped up to the plate and judged. One I know judged the type of car he is familiar with.

2) How do you judge a car that is driven regularly against a trailered car that is only taken out for SHOW? Look at the judging sheet. It doesn't say Driver and Show cars. Every car is based on the same criteria regardless.

3) If you don't like the judging then don't have your car judged. Next year YOU judge a group of cars.

Respectfully, "Bluebird" 63 GT Hawk owner

I lost 10 points for, "Over spray on rad, two color on fan shroc." Maybe, "shroud?" I'm still looking for the multiple colors on the shroud, haven't figured that one out yet. Here is the "over spray" on the radiator:

is the second time this has happened, but the first time darn suredidn't cost me 10 points! Here is what the, "over spray" is on theradiator: judging sheet: 'm not complaining, just dumbfounded. The 4 points for pitting onbright work... deserved! The crack in the tail light lens... deserved,had to go look, though, didn't know it was there! 5 points for, "Scaleon exh. manifolds." Don't know what to do. I painted the manifolds onGoliath, and got docked 7 points for, "Dirty int and exhaustmanifolds." I agree, the intake could have been cleaner on Big G. Ithought the exhaust manifolds looked pretty spiffy, but I was wrong, Ireckon.

I haven't made up my mind whether I will have my car judged at the International level again, or not. Earned 391 points in South Bend in '02, 381 in Charlotte in '04.

Taking note of the fact that I was losing ground, I addressed the issues of the '04 meet. I took two seats out of the car and had them repaired, among other things. I know my car better than anyone else, and I know it was standing taller this year than in '04. I also know it has warts, and that they would likely be found. I also knew I would be judged by different folks than before, and therefore would see some differences. I didn't, however, expect an extra 5 point deficiency for my efforts!

I have my vehicles judged because it keeps me honest. I likely would not have repaired the items that cost me points in '04 without that incentive. That would mean, sho' 'nuff, that I was allowing the car to deteriorate. I don't want to let 'er go, I want to maintain 'er!

I want to believe that if I work hard enough, I can EARN a 1st place at the International level. Right now, I don't believe I can do that. I'm not saying that it can't be done; I'm saying that I don't think I can do it. Modifieds and customs are going to take an extra hickey next year, and I'm not even sure I could muster a second place. Earning a first place at the International level is a big deal to me... maybe it shouldn't be, but that is what I strive for. I made it by one stinkin' point this year, so IF I go to South Bend next year, I may fly or drive a brand X there. What's the point of driving a Stude, if you are going to be docked by the apples, because you drive an orange?

It is NOT, IMHO, unfair for the classes to be judged differently, because they are, after all... different. I will be the first in line to say that modified or custom Studes should not win, "Best of Show." That honor should be reserved for original, or well restored to original Studes. Best of Division is a different story... apples, and oranges.

I have had the honor, and been humbled by "Best of Show" at zone meets. I don't expect that to happen at the International level. I do expect, however, for judges to know the difference between over spray and intentionally painted surfaces... or at least to ask questions. I don't expect to be docked 66% of possible points for something that is not "wrong" to begin with, or 25% of possible points for, "Scale on exhaust manifolds," when that category encompasses, in its entirety, "Engine... ALL paint and condition, ALL attached items." (I was docked 5 out of a possible 20 points for the ENTIRE engine and ALL attached items, just for the exhaust manifolds.) One side of me says, "That's the price you pay for driving it," the other side says, "BS... it's supposed to be a driver's club, and exhaust manifolds are going to become discolored, "scaled," or everwhat." If you don't paint them, you lose 5 points, and if you do paint them, you lose 7.

And, I will say... I could be wrong!

But, I will also say that I am considering joining the camp that says, "It's not worth the hassle."

That said, I appreciate the time and effort the judges put into their effort. They did the best they could, with what they had to work with.

Oh, yeah... the, "Glue visible on the headliner." Don't know where it is, ain't gonna look. As best I could tell, this particular judge found some sort of visible glue on some part of every interior on every car judged in my class, so he was at least consistant. And, he only docked me one point for it out of 15, so I'll leave it there for him to find next time. It apparently gives him great pleasure, and is too much trouble for me to look for something that neither the 50 judges before him, or I have noticed in the 7 years since I finished the car. (I also lost a point on Goliath for "visible glue," and I ain't lookin' fer that, either!

Do I think I got, "Hosed?" No. Do I think I got a bad deal? Yep. Do I think it was intentional, vindictive, or on purpose? Absolutly not! Everybody else in my class got the same treatment, so it was, "fair," if not, IMHO, accurate.

Dave I agree with everything you said. I was not going to give my 2 cents worth but since I am not the only one who feels this way. I drove my coupe

1400 miles to have a them take 8 points for the rock chip in the hood that I got getting to Omaha and another 4 points for a chip in the windshield that happened at the same time. I lost another 2 points for an oil spot under my car that did not come from my car. I completely agree that the 4 points I lost for not empting my trunk was justified and also for the 2 points for the small dings in the dash overlay. but I have a hard time with a total of 12 points from the same stone I picked up getting there.I think that was a little harsh. I for will not have a car judged at an international meet. There were several cars there that deserved a 1st in the custom division (mine not being one of them )They should be very pissed. The 28 Pick up that Richard brought was trailer to the meet from the restoration shop and had never been driven.and it only got a 2nd. And it is just one that deserved a first. OK that's enough from me.

I don't know, but I suspect there's been some note made of the trend to entering what would normally be stock cars in the custom class just to avoid authenticity hassles. It seems a decision may have been made to "tighten up" standards to discourage this practice. During judging, one of the judges did say something to the effect that we would be held to a higher standard-we couldn't fall back on the "that's the way the factory did it" excuse for less than perfection. When you think about it, that makes sense, and the quality of some of the cars is certainly trending toward a level of perfection unheard of just a few years ago. I do think they might have raised the standards a bit to abruptly though. I dropped 30 points between Spokane and Omaha, and I don't think the car was that much worse this year. I'm not sure what could have been done after the scores were in, but 0 out of 43 should have been a red flag that maybe something was awry.

Overall it was a great meet and we're happy we went. Got home without major mishap and got to see a lot of different cars and meet a lot of different people. I do think organizers could use a little coaching on the awards ceremony though. From what I could tell, there were two vehicles tied for "Best in Show", but that was mentioned in a very offhand manner, and I have no idea which cars they were. It's a shame they didn't receive better recognition.

S2DSteve

Jim Caldwell wrote:

Hard to do if the Modified had no first places. . . . rat bastards!