I am contemplating buying a 2005 Forester LL Bean edition but know nothing about Subaru other than they are AWD. Can anyone out there give me some advice or tell me of their experience with either a Forester or Subaru in general? I know that MSN cites engine and pollution control problems up to
2002, but I can find nother past that short of buying a copy of Lemonaid. If you prefer to contact me via email, please write snipped-for-privacy@hotmail.com. Thanks in advance for your assistance.
They are extremely reliable and rate high in owner satisfaction. You can be assured you will be making a wise purchase decision. It is not as if you are buying a General Motors vehicle that will depreciate quickly and more than likely have a host of reliability problems. They have the relibility and typical design expected from a good Japanese manufacturer.
Mark...read ALL the posts in here....ALL of them..good and bad. *I* personally HATE Subaru for making such a poorly designed automobile (and i get flamed in here for speaking my piece).
If you read on you will find that they are NOT reliable in the long run, however..there are a few owners that really pile on the miles with no problems at all. Read the post from people with head gasket failures, how Subaru does back their product at times, but they fail quite a bit on a lot of people.The failures you read about in here come from OWNERS. I DO NOT own one Mark, i speak from hearing it from people that I know who have them, from articles I see in print. I work in the public service arena, I travel the streets in the Los Angeles area A LOT. All I see are dead ones, ones with engine fires, ones that have been abandoned on the freeways.I see very few running around on the streets. Before you buy, see if your bank will finance one. You might be surprised to see they won't. (I wonder why that is :) Once again....READ READ AND READ. Don't take my word only, but it's an indicator that there IS problems with thier product line. ALL cars will have some "Quirky" issues, but Subaru has a shitload of them. A lot of them that should never happen and continue to occur. Let Google be your investigative friend. A lot of the guys in here are EXTREMELY brand defensive, they don't like people like me warning others or speaking the truth about Subaru in general...... So here come the missiles :) but you have been advised (for what it's worth).
I'm sure the car buying public appreciates your efforts. Can you direct me to your warnings about other makes? Say, Jaguar, or Fiat, or Sterling, or 90s Mercedes or Kia or 80s GM or maybe the mid 90s Ford Windstars with the turning radius of an oil tanker and tranny troubles, or the mid 90's Nissan/Q45 V6s with the 3 dollar O-ring that leaks oil and is a 19.2 hour labor charge to replace or the Toyota V6 sludge problems or...or...or....
Yes Carl..I can! and your right..... Ford Taurus...bad transmission pump resulting in input shaft lockups Ford Taurus...Head gasket failure, resulting in oil leaks Ford Trucks...Cruise Control switch causing underhood fires Ford Truck (early 90's) Ignition switch fires Pontiac Fiero 6 Cyl..engine fires (remember those) VW Beetles (new ones) electrical fires. I will be happy to post more if you like, but it has nothing to do with Subaru....
Ah the good doctor spews his crap once again. I don't know where you got your negative bias from but clearly it is from somewhere other than experience.
What the sane world has to say is very different. Look at Consumer Reports auto issues. The latest one rates SUBARU as the MOST RELIABLE brand overall for 2004. The FORESTER is TOP PICK for car-based SUVs for 2004 and 2005. Even Phil Edmunstons Lemon Aid Guide has many good things to say about them. Try finding a used Forester for sale, their rare because people tend to keep them. All of the industry mags (Car&Driver etal) seem to like them, but take anything an industry mag says with a huge grain of salt.
Personally, I tend to go absolutely over-the-top when it comes to researching big purchases such as cars, appliances etc. I did all the research I could before buying my 04 Forester XS last May. It wasn't originally one of the vehicles in my sites, the Legacy was. But after more research I ended up with the Forester. Here's one tip though, get rid of the Yokahama tires the Forester comes with, they are bad. Oh, and if you are wondering what other vehicles I seriously considered (but eliminated after research and test drives), VW Jetta TDI, Mazda 6 Sportwgaon, Malibu Maxx, Legacy wagon, Nissan X-Trail, Honda SRV, Toyota RAV4 along with cursory looks at Saturns Large wagon, Hyundai, Kia and others.
When I entered the car business oh so many years ago, one of the first statistics that impressed me the most was"if an automobile were 99 and
44/100% pure like Ivory Soap (I'm dating myself here) it would only have 146 things wrong with it. Today, with the complications and sophistication of the current models, I hesitate to guess at how great the number would be. To state that the end result of billions of dollars of money, hours and hours of intelligent analysis by many thousands of people, and more third party endorsement than any car in it's class has resulted in abject failure, would lead a reasonable man to question the accuser and his agenda or perhaps to discount it in total.
If we compare man made machines to perfection, we are doomed to be disappointed. Man is too often fallible so the outcome of his efforts are never perfect, not even his criticism.
Just throwing in my input... Check out statistics and reports for yourself, don't just go by what people tell you. When I bought my 96 Plymouth Neon, all I heard was: "They're junk, you'll hate it, its a piece of shit" Well for some, that is true, but I had it for a little over a year, put well over
40k miles on it, and never had any major problems with it. (Wheel bearing was the biggest problem). Since then I had another Neon, another good car, and now I have a 1993 Subaru Impreza L, which I have had for maybe just over a month, have put 3k miles on it, and haven't even changed the oil in it yet. It is a very sturdy car for being over 12 years old. I know many people with Subaru's, and they have all told me they wouldn't trade them for anything.
I'm always amazed by your posts. I wonder what happens in LA that makes so many Subarus die there. Here in Atlantic Canada, I see them every day running all over the place. I used to have a Toyota Camry; my 98 Subaru wagon is every bit as reliable as the old Camry was.
I personally really like my car, and it has worked very well for the last 260,000 km. Maybe I'm just lucky. I will admit there are two things about my car that my wife hates: the driver's seat is too low (and since I got a Brighton edition, there is no height adjustment), and when you lock the front doors, you have to lift up on the handle as you close it (I could have spent more money and bought electric locks, then this wouldn't be an issue anyway).
So maybe Dr Fafoofnik is right; it must be a horrible piece of poorly engineered crap.
Nah, the only poorly engineered crap here is the stuff Dr. Rasty-ass is constantly trying to spread. I'm sure HIS car has NEVER had a SINGLE problem: as well-versed about the automotive community as he claims to be, I'm sure he knows just exactly how to pick a make and model that's trouble free.
The fact he doesn't even own a Subaru yet insists upon spreading hearsay says something to me, if not to the rest of the world. Personally, I put on 150-200 miles a day throughout much of SoCal and haven't seen these piles of dead Subies he's always alluding to. Maybe he found a Subie junkyard to drive by every day?
I won't try to say Subaru is trouble free, nor would I assert that of ANY make. I'll even give Dr. Rasty-ass some fuel for his anti-Subaru fires: mine blew up a week ago! But before he gets started, let me note the car has just over 360k miles, original engine, and probably would still be going had I bought it new instead of used AND abused at 209k miles.
Well...360K out of any engine (except Cummins,Catapiller or Detroit Diesel) is very good, ESPECIALLY if it's turbocharged. I suspect a lot of the failures we see in the Los ANgeles area can be attributed to the high underhood temps experianced in Socal......
"Kurt C. Hack" wrote in message news: snipped-for-privacy@wideopenwest.com...
Gee..thats pretty funny there Kurt! Lets see......owned and driven daily for over 3 years, a lot of it on the highway between Los Angeles and Las Vegas. In that amount of time NOTHING...I mean NOTHING has failed. It still has the factory tires on it. It gets the oil changed every 3500 miles, gets new coolant every March. On the other hand I see OWNERS bitching about Subarus less than 4 years old with....... Raw Fuel Leaks( how hard can this be to fix????) Oil Leaks (even my mid 60's Chrysler doesnt leak) Overheating HEAD GASKETS (Just plain stupid/unacceptable) Noisy valves (2003 Baja) Having to reset the ECU (04 Forester)Why ??? it's SUPPOSED to know whats its doing! Bad/Failed O2 Sensors POOR fuel economy for the size of car (16-20MPG get real, my 4.0L V-6 does that. ) "antifreeze smell" inside car "Auto Climate Control" (04 Outback)..poorly designed, changes settings on its own Floor/Dash vents Clutch Shudder "Check Engine light" usually means nothing, reveals no codes and dealer cant fix it Rough Idle(04 WRX,05 baja) dealer says thats normal??? Engine rattle (03 Impreza) when cold WheelBearing failure Stereo system audio power amplifier catching fire A/C that wont work in traffic, alternator that can't keep up with electrical demands. Windows that whistle,squeak and rattle (WRX many model years) Paint chips and dings all over (ALL of Subaru)(many complaints from Forester owners)Honda/Toyota/Nissan paint is MUCH better. Tranny failures/problems at 3000 miles (like a NEW forester) Wimpy horn Electric lock problems(2000 Forester) Shitty Brakes (Consumer Report on 2001 Outbacks) "Clunking Noises" (05 Outback with 5,000 Miles on it) Cracking windshields (05 Outback with wiper blade heater) REPEATED visits to the dealer to get anything fixed right Shitty dealer network, poor customer support, "NO CAN DO" outlook unless pressured
***READ THIS*** ALL THESE COMMENTS CAME FROM THIS GROUP, FROM OWNERS. This is not made up, not my opinion All of these have been bitched about right here in this forum. While the Explorer is NOT a "rally car" it sure is good at it's job.I know I can turn the key and point it in any direction and GET THERE and BACK without calling for a hook or Ford to come back up my warranty."Warranty"..while they are good to have is NOT the answer.Fact is..there are a LOT more Ford Explorers on the roads in the U.S.A. than Subaru's anyday. There must be a reason for it. There is NO EXCUSE for all these problems in a new or recently purchased car. A lot of this crap should NEVER happen.I expect this kind of crap from a Korean rustbucket (see KIA,DAEWOO, HYUNDAI) but NOT a Japanese car. Subaru's quality and they way they handle it's customers is PISS-POOR at best. Look at it from the standpoint of the owner that can't turn his own wrenches. Those people don't need a "MG" or a Fiat,Triumph..truly a fix/tune up daily. Your daily commuter doesnt need to deal with worthless "Check Engine" lights or the rest of the problems listed here.
I think your list reflects well the range of problems though you tend to exagerate the rate at which they occur. I admit I don't hang out at the Ford Explorer newsgroup so, please tell me, are there NO COMPLAINTS there?
Oh yeah, there are complaints in the Ford forum too, however..VERY few of them are vehicles less than 5 years old. I am pointing out the problem cars that come out NEW with defects, correctable ones (like the leaking fuel lines). Ford is not without "problem" vehicles either. Part of this is due to them sleeping with Kia (they have for years). Fords problem(Ford/Lincoln Navigator and some "F" Series trucks) with cruise control switch fires (caused by brake fluid seeping into the switch) was a poor design. Aerostar (now THIS is a real piece of shit) ignition switch fires. The Ford "Fuckus" (Focus) is a turd, had one as a rental car in hawaii for
30 minutes and took it back for a Honda Ford Work trucks and "E" series vans......bulletproof
I look at the postings as a "Crosscut" of Subaru customers..many of which dont post (or even know it exists).Some do post they like their cars (a lot) others tell of high miles, but way too many mention problems with **NEW** ones, less than 5 years old, less than 50,000 miles and this is simply not acceptable by todays standards. Quality control, good design CAN be done. I mention the fuel leak incident because it's EASY to design around that. many other cars out there have HIGH-PRESSURE fuel injection and they dont leak in cold weather. It's CHEAPO parts, Subaru saves a few cents on each car AT YOUR EXPENSE. I expect this on a $5995 new KIA Rio, not a $15,000+++ car.
Look at Daewoo...they are dying/dead. Besides the ugly styling, they were falling apart on the lot. They are CHEAP...low priced, but even that didn't save them. No one wants to sit on the side of the road, 150 miles from a town thinking...I am SO damn glad that I have a 10 year, 100,000 mile warranty on this car. Even tho I am stuck out in the middle of nowhere, will miss work, will have to rent another car i feel warm and fuzzy all over because i know my dealer will fix it AGAIN. The ONLY way to prevent the car companies from putting out shitty workmanship is DONT BY IT. Stopped Daewoo cold in the U.S.A.!! Kia cant sell much here, Hyundai is pretty much shut down here. So what do they do?? They ship these turkeys to 3rd world countries hahaha Thats the ticket. Sell them to the poor people. They will buy ANY running "Hooptie"
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