Forewarned is forearmed. Find out from independent sources (Consumer Reports, e.g.) how much the dealer paid for the car and how much the dealer is receiving in incentives from Subaru for selling it quickly. You negotiate upward from there, /not/ downward from the sticker price, which is strictly sucker bait. Suppose the dealer paid $28,000 and will receive a $1,500 rebate from FHI when the vehicle is sold. The dealer cost is now $26,500. You should probably offer, maybe, $27,050, but read up on that yourself. That price would give the dealer a 2% profit and a quick sale. If he's anxious to make room for new models, that might do the trick. I have heard it said that anything up to 4% over true invoice is reasonable. That would be $27560 in this case. The dealer would complain that's below his invoice, but you would counter that he's profiting, counting his incentive. You can't threaten to walk and not mean it. Once, after a long, grueling haggling session, a Toyota sales manager said to me "You wouldn't walk for a piddling $200, would you?" Turning toward the door, I said "Watch my feet." "Would you come up $25?" Turning back to the sales manager, I said "Done." In fact, I would have come up $50.
That would be illegal if it's a new car. Dealerships often violate that law, but you may ask for the window sticker and they will retrieve it and print it for you.
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Negotiate up from your independent knowledge the dealer's true cost including incentives. Any "confidential invoices" that the dealer may show you are almost certainly bogus; the dealer has no legal obligation to tell you what s/he really paid for the car.
Even though you're waiting for the Outbacks (as am I), you might want to check the inventory of your local dealerships to see what they're asking for Foresters. They'll have both 2013 and 2014 models of those in stock now, so you can see how much lower than the 2014 models the 2013s are running.
Ask to see the invoice. These things vary all the time but several years ago I got one on a family and friends deal for 2% below invoice but another guy I know, a year or so later, got one at 3% below invoice without any special deal. He bought during a car slump.
I don't normally plan a car purchase but just buy when I need to. There are better times of the year, like after Christmas when sales are tight.
Dealer may say he can not make money selling below invoice but that is not true as there are kickbacks.
If that was the "invoice" that the dealer showed, the buyer was had. You have to get the dealer price from an independent source, as the dealer will show you a bogus invoice. He is allowed to do that because he has no legal obligation to tell you what he paid for the car.
If you have only a meaningless sticker price and a bogus dealer "invoice" you are entirely uninformed. Consumer Reports is probably the best place to get the /real/ dealer price and information on dealer incentives, but KBB and Edmunds, and probably places I am unaware of also offer these services.
Of course. I'm also reminded of my brother telling me when he was selling cars a customer came in and made a rock bottom offer after doing intensive internet research. My brother accepted his offer but would have sold him the car for $1,000 less.
for subaru don't count on that much. I would not be surprised if 2013 forresters of the last batch would sell for the same or more than 2014. since outbacks are not graced with x-mode yet that trend won't surface until fhi blesses outbacks with the same obama inspired technology advancements (tongue is very firmly planted in the cheek)
I'd print the quote from carsdirect which options that you need checked and all the garbage that you don't unchecked and won't pay a penny over that
The thing to watch for are the options that detract from the value of the car. The inside autodimming mirror would be one example.
illegal in the us of a
walk in calmly, choose a car with the right options set (mathcing what you cliked and klacked online) knowing the precise buzzwords for at the very least the two top exterior color choices.
when approached by the sales guy explain you want to avoid the impeding x-mode (another buzzword dropped) doom purchasing car this year instead of waiting for 2015
at this point the sales guy understand you are fhi buzzword compatible and have low tolerance for bullshit.
you should have no problem negotiating your way into the bright new world of symmetric (for now) all wheel drive
In other words, your goal is to (casually) show the salesperson you are not their average car buying moron and once that objective is reached you are taking home some savings
nothing is wrong with the SIDE autodimming mirrors, cause you obviously can not reach outside to dim them, so it's an improvement.
The problem surfaces when autodimming is added on the mirror inside the cage: with the old (manual) arrangement I tend to switch early, sometimes during the day (some two wheel riders apparently think low beams are not sufficient and high beams make them more visible, they do and you want to kill the f*er that uses them). with automatic dimming the mirror starts to dim too late for my taste and there is no manual override. That loss of functionality drived me nuts. Besides you had a reliable no power required solution and all of a sudden you had another powered for no good reason gadget just because some folks are reluctant to lift their arm up to flip the mirror.
I wish fhi stops messing with the inside mirror and just adds the autodimming to the side mirrors only: those things are wired for side turn signals anyway so extra wiring for heating and autodimming would not makes much of a difference: they have to get a wiring harness in there anyway and it will probably get just fatter.
"impeding x-mode doom" was in reference to the increasing front wheel axle torque bias that is being tested on 2014 forrester buyers now and is bound to spread like cancer throughout the rest of the subaru lineup in the coming years.
while most people might not care about the power distribution between the axles I do mind receiving most of the power to the front.
of course fhi could choose to go the other way around and start off brz "platform" making a sedan a wagon and a utte with rwd bias. I doubt they will go that route though. Meaning that at least in the states in the coming years you'd have to bring your (hard earned?) dollars to bmw or a porsche to get rear wheel bias (or at least about 50/50 power distribution with the current subarus). And that's a lot of dollars we are talking about. Here it's simpler due to subaru pricing: is costs as much as germans (or more in some cases) in urop and, thusly, is not on many folks shopping lists. not on mine for sure
For "impeding x-mode doom" or so, few people will care in US. Read: probably not much impact on salesperson. May, or may not, even be aware of situation.
As your power to negotiate is not that strong to begin with, the idea to wait for 2014 models on the dealer lot is an excellent one. Equally good or better, is to find and approach, a dealer that has an inventory of several old models. The more the better. This is where you're biggest monetary gains may come from!
Good Luck.
I myself bought a 2013 Forester XT just last week! Never thought I would be buying a turbo. Got a sweet deal, as dealer had several XT's left, five or six. Be flexible if you can afford to.
Congratulations! Do you know about the free Subaru badges you can get for it?
I, too, unexpectedly ended up with a turbo car years ago, just because it was otherwise what I was looking for in a used car. It's been very reliable and has come in handy occasionally.
if you count railroad cars I guess. Subaru is the marketing name and the name of FHI subsidiary in the US of A. FHI is the actual maker of the forester (until foresters start to roll off Subaru of USA production lines that is, and even then guess where most parts are coming from)
thusly i'm reluctant to refer to subaru unless there is something specific to the us model (such as idiotic product specs as we discussed in the autodimming for no good reason center rear view mirror). I'm not in any way implying that US division is feeding only idiotic specs making fhi hq life difficult. Say if it was not for north american market I doubt we would have seen outback line in the current shape and form. And outbacks seem to outsell legacy 5 to 1 in the states and 10 to 1 around here. At least in late model years. I see way more 10+ y.o. legacies than outbacks where I live.
from what I understand x-mode is the me-too-crossover mode. Meaning that unless anything slips 100% of power goes to the front (kiss goodbye to permanently powered real axle)
the only difference with competition is that fhi is using their own center clutch rather than haldex. Maybe it works marginally faster or significantly faster for subaru offering to have some merit
Anyhow, got to congratulate basia on her 2013 forrester xt. It's the last of a kind and in a good sense.
I was always kinda in awe of the folks who are keen on the significant functionality degradation so they jump right on to snatch the good ones while they can be had. (having vivid memories of protege 5 sw that was sold briefly in the states at the end of protege production)
No, no--they're free! Subaru pays the contracted marketing company to send them. It's a promotion for Subaru.
I do wish they would separate Outdoor Sports into Hiking and Canoeing. Lots more people hike than canoe, so it's frustrating to have the hiker in the background of the canoer.
I was after a normally aspirated, X model, with stick shift, (greatest value) but all were sold out. I guess people noticed the last chance to grab a 50/50 split AWD system... so I went for "second best."
Actually the 50/50 AWD split on the manual transmission is the same for 2014 models. I guess people like the manual cause its cheaper, and more powerful, or dealers must have had little inventory. By the time 2014's arrived the manual 2013's were sold out.
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