Would they rather spend 2 hours in a ditch and money on a tow, than $200 on a set of tires? They don't even have to be good ones ... just have some tread on them!
I could drive circles around most people in the snow using a Subaru Justy, or heck, a Yugo with snow tires. Hemi powered, 4wd, 20 inch rims with half bald tires means 'ditch diving' in winter.
My other pet peve (today): With a few inches of snow on the ground, why can't people figure out where to park in a parking lot. It's like a slolom course with rows zig zagging all over the place.
Well - in general, SUV's and big trucks seem to give the owners a sense of invincibility - that they can go anywhere, anytime, as quickly as they see fit... it's never pretty when reality comes crashing down (literally) on them. (funny, but not pretty)
Try snow tires on your sub and be even further amaized I have 4 new snows on my 2004 Inpreza wagon. It drives like a snowmobile compared to anything else on the road.
For me the problem with snow tires is that in Colorado the snow season begins in September and ends in May. That's a long time to drive on snows every year.....9 out of 12 months.
Snow tires are, by their very nature, softer and squishier than all-weather tires. On windey mountain roads (what other kind are there?) snow tires make my Outback handle like a ford :) compared to high performance all-weather tires.
Hi, As long as the driver knows what s/he is doing. Stupid/dumb drivers will ditch it even on snow tires. Even a tank can go into ditch when road condition is real bad. Tony
Unless you are driving a rear wheel drive in a snow belt area you simply don't need them. But if you do get them, and your state allows them, get them studded.
So there's a good topic: What do you do differently in an AWD car to stay out of the ditch? So far all I've figured out is that that if a wheel starts to slip while going round a gentle corner under power, you don't do anything...the axel with traction will keep pulling/pushing you in the right direction...just get ready to punch the clutch if all wheels start to slip!
Doesn't matter what you are driving. Just don't make any abrupt changes in direction or speed. Just concentrate on your driving, which is what you're supposed to be doing anyway. Don't drink coffee or comb your hair and you'll be OK. I've driven for miles on "black ice" in Montana and never wound up in a ditch. Granted, there was virtually no trafffic and I didn't have to avoid anyone.
I guess that depends upon what's meant by not needing them. If people find that they're crabbing down the road sideways, almost loosing it due to a gust of wind, or getting stuck in their own driveway ... then I'd say they need them.
What prompted me in starting the thread was that I was driving behind someone in a newer Toyota Echo (or something), driving 30 mph down a straight road when suddenly the rear end broke loose, and she almost lost it. Was it a gust of wind, a snowball, or snow snake? I just went into the snowy lane and drove around. No worries.
I've driven in the snow on performance summer tires ... it's no fun and I've seen the light. If you have the means, I highly recommend them !
you mean unless you are driving a front wheel drive..... rear drive is much better than front drive all wheel drive is the best subaru are the best of all wheel drive vehicles A subaru with 4 snow tires is the best of the best :)))))))
The toyota pu 4x4 sits in the garage on nasty icy road days unless the wife leaves hers in the garage(age thing) then she takes the scoobie and I get the toyota. Front wheel has much better traction than rear, plus won't break away on you in a gust of wind, etc.
BTW: live in ND so icy roads are an everyday occurance, love watching the non natives in their 4x4's who think going is all there is to bad road driving. Fun to watch the "rodeo" when they attempt to stop. ;)
Four boxes protect our freedom: the soap box, the ballot box, the jury box, and the cartridge box.
Most tire shops in my region (Montreal, Canada) offer to store your tires (winter tires in the summer, and all-season in winter) for a small price. Also, my Subaru dealer said that they store tires for clients for free (if you buy tires from them I suppose).
I've driven Subarus for four winters in Nebraska, one winter in Idaho, and seven or more winters in Illinois and Michigan, and have never encountered a situation in which I needed snow tires, but I spend closer to $600 on a set of all-weather tires and replace them when tread wear dictates. In fact, front wheel drive would have sufficed for almost all conditions I've encountered in these winters, but AWD is better yet, for reasons you all know.
People pass me in Ford Explorers and such on icy roads - they think they're BAD. It's not unusual to see them in the ditch further down the road. No tire or drive system is a substitute for keeping your head out of your ass. As for the parking lot, I park away from everybody else. Then the lines don't matter and I get some exercise.
A lot of people have made some good points that I agree with.
First, I too live in a condominium tower in Toronto and have no place to store snow tires for my '03 Legacy GT sedan.
Second, unlike many of the other yahoos on the road, I adjust my driving style to the current weather conditions: I do not drive the same in the winter as I do the summer. I suspect that people who complain that their car handles like crap without snow tires aren't adjusting their driving accordingly.
Third, we are under a winter storm right now and most of the cowboys driving around as though they were invincible are all in Escalades, Navigators and Jeeps. Not surprisingly, these are the people I always see in the ditch first.....because they didn't adjust for the driving conditions!!!!!
Finally, if I didn't own an AWD car I would only ever consider driving a FWD car. I agree that they are prone to understeer.....which can be corrected by not goosing the car while cornering in the snow. With a bit of practice (in emergency situations of course) the use of the hand parking brake can correct the understeer quite handily.
Again, I think that people should just accept the fact that the roads are not always dry and bare and DRIVE ACCORDINGLY!!!
See you in the ditch..... Front wheel drive understeers terrible. a bit of over steer in a rear wheel will get you around ramps and curves Understeer sends you to the ditch every time. Every snow storm in Ontario you see ditches full of front drive cars. That is the truth meter. They always have the slowest rally times in performance rally ....... where traction is the ultimate decision maker against a stop watch. Front wheel slowest times, rear next best times, 4 wheel fastest times. Front wheel drive = 70% of your breaking, all of your steering and all of your drive motion on 2 front wheels.......it just does not work good. I have 43 years of driving experience, no crashes, no accidents. Have driven professional rally. Crewed for 10 years consecutive north american pro production rally champion too. (Nial Leslie)1979 to 1989 My rear wheel drives where always better. my neon and saturn front wheelers were terrible in the snow. I left them home many times and drove my rear wheel drive safari van.
ya the front ends of front drive cars wiggle side to side trying to get up hills. It looks really funny
and the cartridge box.
passive Canadian here no guns thanks. "in defence of the country to bear arms" , not shoot your neighbour.
Snow tire are not "needed" but they are nice to have... just as AWD is nice to have. I agree with those who warn about failure to respect winter road conditions, regardless of drivetrain type.
I agree; The first winter in my GT wgn with the new RE92s was better than my Mazda Protege had been with four new snows, and fun in different ways, too. After less than one year of use (April 1st-->Thanksgiving), the RE92s were worn enough @ ~ 16000 miles :-( that I'd rather have had the Protege with four good snows. This lack of traction "forced me to order" four WRX take-off rims with Blizzak LM22's from TireRack. They are now in their second winter, and I expect them to last 2 more. Next year, I will get a set of 4 snows for my wife's Special Edition L sedan, and I will likely go with the LM22s again. I used 4 Blizzak WS-50s on my Protege, my wife's Civic, and both our Mazda 323's before that (damn I've bought a lot of those critters!), and they are a bit too soft on dry roads for other than commuting usage. In fact, the LM22s are better in rain than the '92's are now... IMHO, awd is a huge bonus vs fwd, or rwd; at least if all else is equal. As I've experienced it, a fwd with good rubber meeting the road is better than awd with inadequate rubber. And of course we won't talk about a light weight, rwd truck or wgn. TG it has been a while, but I won't *ever* have one of those again! Terry - '02 Regatta-Red GT wagon 5spd - 25,000 miles '03 Silver Legacy SE auto-sedan - 2450 miles Yakima / TandeMover / Rockymount rack To reply, get rid of the "nonsense"
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