Wisconsin is probably going to pass legislation requiring all gas sold to be at least 10% ethanol. I have heard Minnesota has gone to 20%. The oil companies opposed the legislation.
Good news for the couple of ethanol plants in the state and corn growers I suppose.
I have a 1989 Buick Park Avenue 3.8l v6. The owner manual specifically states no alcohol over 5%.
Legislators have apparently said there are NO concerns with the new rules.
Is there a difference in the type of alcohol used today as opposed to
1989 that makes it OK to run ?
Should I change anything like oil change intervals?
Or is this just a non event for owners of older cars.
I own a Jeep CJ7 and my manual calls for 'no' ethanol. The engine runs like a bag of dirt when forced to use it and the gas mileage takes a major dive.
Ontario Canada also is calling for the crap in all the gas.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail >
The big issue that I see is that older fuel lines are not designed for alcohol, and tend to dissolve in alcohol.
If your car is a 1989 model, odds are the fuel hoses have been replaced by now with more modern materials. If they haven't, it's probably time to replace them all with fuel line that can handle 100% ethanol. Do the vacuum hoses while you're at it.
No need to alter your oil change interval, though it's possible you can get away with longer intervals if there is less soot getting into the oil. I wouldn't try it, though.
Surprising that the oil companies would oppose it, they have interests in the ethanol plants.
Yup. I hear Champagne corks popping at ADM.
GMs biggest concern was with methanol. Above 10%, methanol could strip the Tern coating from inside the fuel tank/lines. Other than jetting up a size or two, my 36 year old Plymouth runs okay on it.
For them, of course not. They get a per-diem for travel which puts money -in- their pocket. Between that and the campaign contributions, they're sitting pretty.
No difference in the methanol, no difference in the ethanol. Begs the question; have you been paying attention to any stickers and/or placards on the pumps for the last year or two? Reason for asking is two fold;
1) Gasohol has been sold in the Fox Valley for some time now (and I suspect other areas)
2) There was nothing stopping gas stations from selling gasohol to begin with. They -were- however supposed to placard the pumps stating the percentage of alcohol mix (doesn't mean they did).
The positive side to the new legislation is that selling gasohol outside the metro areas where it was mandated almost ten years ago will now be regulated and monitored (supposedly). IOWs, there was little if any prior oversight.
No.
The added ethanol may have some solvent action that was not present in the good old gasoline you were using. It would not be unusual to see a rash of plugged/restricted fuel filters as a result of this unseen before solvent action inside the fuel tank. The lines and tanks should handle the change just fine. Injectors don't tend to suffer any more than the normal rate of failure -unless- there is a screw up at the alcohol refinery like there was earlier in 2005 that effected fuel sold in the metro Milwaukee area. Other marginal components may see failure such as fuel pressure regulators and accelerator pump cups on carbureted vehicles. Naturally, you'll likely see a drop in fuel economy.
Archer Daniels Midland wins again, and drivers lose.
Know any legislators who drive cars more than a year or two old? Of course they have no concerns with it!
No.
Your car. You should be a good little consumer and get a new car. Everyone wants a new car. Anyone who doesn't must be a terrorist, or at least a communist.
You can look forward to driveability problems, reduced fuel economy, and fuel system component failures.
Um, Daniel, that's already happening. Fuel evaporates out of carbs much quicker, vapor locks easier, and don't even think about using a NOS fuel pump diaphragm, new production ONLY. Modern gas will eat an old diaphragm real quick (and hoses, too - if you have a 20+ year old car, CHECK THE HOSES! they are cheap and it would be a shame to lose a good car over $5 worth of hose that wasn't replaced)
...and I'm really not old enough to be all crotchety about "this newfangled crap they call gasoline these days" but truth be told it isn't the same stuff that they used to sell...
The OP wrote of Wisconsin and 10% ethanol in GASOLINE. Canada has been using this mixture for years - since at least 1980. Mohawk and Husky sell this blend. IF their ethanol mixture would have caused problems we Canadians would have experienced it by now.
It DOES NOT void car warranties - IF it did there would be all sorts of litigation by now. NO litigation.
Besides, this blend prevents gas line freezing at any temperature. We get lots of cars with frozen gas lines here at about -25C and then at around
-35C. Some folks like to drive their cars with nearly empty tanks and fill them only 1/2 or 1/4 full. That results in condensation accumulating and causing the gas line freezing.
The 10% ethanol blend prevents this.
By the way, I use this gasoline in my old 1972 Land rover and in my 1972
510 Datsun (until it's timing chain broke). No problem with old or new (1982 Volvo, 1984 Voyager) vehicles either.
Excerpt: "Subd. 1a. Minimum ethanol content required. (a) Except as provided in subdivisions 10 to 14, on August 30, 2013, and thereafter, a person responsible for the product shall ensure that all gasoline sold or offered for sale in Minnesota must contain at least 20 percent denatured ethanol by volume.
Interestingly, the law contains liability protection for fuel sellers in case the new gas damages cars: "(c) No motor fuel shall be deemed to be a defective product by virtue of the fact that the motor fuel is formulated or blended pursuant to the requirements of paragraph (a) under any theory of liability except for simple or willful negligence or fraud."
Balls. Any vehicle with a carburetor has to be *tuned* to the amount of alcohol used in the fuel. A vehicle running a fuel with 10% or more alcohol won't be running at stoichiometric anymore; it will need to be richened up to run correctly. And then, of course, it will run like shit on regular gas, if you can find any.
It was more than just the fuel lines, IIRC. It is no trick to use elastomers that will tolerate alcohols as easily, or more easily, than they tolerate the aromatics (BTX;benzene, toluene, and xylene). Even the old 'rubber' components might survive alcohols pretty well. Polyamides like Nylons dont necessarily tolerate alcohols very well.
Alcohols can actually react with and corrode some of the crap metal alloys that were extensively used in fuel systems. This is not a factor of the alcohol bearing water. The alcohols themselves can react. And you know how much 'pot metal' (zinc alloys), aluminum, etc was used in the old systems.
I dont have any big grudge against the use of alcohol, but I am very suspicious of our government if they are peddling favors to one particular industry.
Some research reports suggest we will have major oil shortages within 10 years. This last little round of price gouging is just a prelim...We are not out of oil, but the demand may well exceed the production capability this soon.
Oregon does 10% for winter gasoline, the DEQ says it cuts down on smog. While I'm not an atmospheric chemist I still don't see how 10% alcohol cuts smog down in the winter.
Gee, I've been driving an old 83' Chev using 10% alcohol from almost day one and the original fuel pump still works. The carb is original too except for the float. When they used MTBE instead of alcohol, it used to have a lean miss. The alcohol seems to run OK and mileage is as much as 23 m.p.g. combined (3.8 V-6 auto).
The legislatures are talking about their belief. The problem I see is that the 20% called for by Minnesota voids the warranty on my new car. I have yet to have a Mn legislature respond to me on THIS problem.
That would figure, my Jeep loves ESSO gas and gets by far the best mileage on it.
My engine refuses to run on Shell or PetroCan 'gas'. It won't even idle and looses all power over 65 mph.
I can get an easy 350 miles to a tank of 91 octane Esso gas. When I burn 91 Shell gas, I am out of gas by 225 miles. Made it to 250 once and was dead on the side of the highway.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
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