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Do Fresh Air Recirculating Motors Fails Gradually? (1993 Accord)

Greetings, I recently needed to convert to R-134a from R-12. However, I live in Phoenix & you cannot effectively cool your car without recirculating cooled cabin air. My recirculate button ceased functioning in the open position. I took it to the Honda dealer. I was told there would be a $101 diagnostic fee & any additional parts would cost more. I agreed. After 2.5 hours, I was informed that the door motor was failing (not dead!!!) & would need to be replaced ($466). However, I was told that somehow the motor was working now & in the closed(recirculate) position. Furthermore, I was told that it could fail again & I should not touch the fresh air button as the motor could fail again at any time. I told them this was fine & I paid the $101 & now the car blows 38-40 degree recirculated air instead of 60 degree fresh air (103 degrees outside). Would I be cynical if I thought that the mechanic discovered a simple fix after taking the dashboard apart to troubleshoot & effectively lost money ($101 for 2.5 hours) & was attempting to salvage the deal by saying the motor was failing so that they could make $300 in labor & $166 in parts to replace a normally functioning motor with a new motor? It just seems highly coincidental that the motor somehow started working after troubleshooting the problem. I think they did not want to send me away disgruntled with nothing to show for my $101 & gambling that I would opt for a $466 repair for a relatively small thing in a 14 year old car. Naturally, as tempted as I am, I dare not touch the fresh air button to test my suspicion. Does an air flap motor usually fail & if they do, do they fail intermittently? The car has 159,400 miles & is a great car. Thanks, Rich

Reply to
Rich
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What they told you sounds reasonable to me. And yes, it could stop working again. Wait at least till September before you push the button.

Reply to
Ashton Crusher

That is a rather common failure mode. If it starts working again it could work once or it could work 5000 times (though once is much more likely). If it should fail again I would just have someone manually move it to the open (recirc) position and then disconnect the motor so there is no chance of it closing again.

Steve B.

Reply to
Steve B.

Disconnecting the motor is a good idea but I was told it takes $300 in labor to it. Maybe I might get lucky & find a dedicated fuse. By the way, how do you suppose it managed to work again after they discovered it was bad? Thanks, Rich

Reply to
Rich

They tapped it with a screwdriver, or they rattled it a bit when removing it, if they actually removed the motor, or the planets were aligned properly...

What others are trying to say that electric motors occasionally get to a point where they sometimes work, sometimes don't.

And, is it actually a motor? Are you sure it's not a door powered by engine vacuum? in which case there's a vacuum leak and they un-kinked the hose, or reattached it better.

Reply to
Bob M.

It's an electric motor. Majestic Honda's web site shows it as a small box with an electrical connector. At least I was able to watch the AC tech take apart the glove box & motor housing to reveal the motor when he took a look at it for me. That way I can at least give it a tap if I ever need to in the future. Also, I understand your point about electrical motors performance possibly becoming intermittent with age. Thanks for the insight.

Rich

Reply to
Rich

Pop the thing open, and put a drop of very light oil (like a sewing machine oil) on the front and rear bearings of the motor itself. That will fix a large number of these issues.

Small DC motors that sometimes work and sometimes don't either have a dead spot on the commutator, or the brushes are shot, or the bearings are bad. If the bearings are gunked up, a little light oil will keep them running for a few more years.

--scott

Reply to
Scott Dorsey

Scott, Between Bob's tip about holding the button in if the control head solder is cracked & your advice to place a little bit of light oil on the motor if that is sticking, I now have just the possible work-arounds I was looking for to deal with a pesky problem in a 14 year-old car that isn't worth the $1000(control head) or $600(motor) quoted by Honda. You gotta' love the internet & newsgroups. Thanks to both of you for taking the time to reply. I appreciate your expertise. Thanks again, Rich

Reply to
Rich

I don't know exactly how Honda systems work, but I presume its servo motors much like my wife's 93 Chrysler. What gets out of whack on the Chrysler is the position calibration of the doors, so that when you push, say, 'recirc' the door doesn't move to exactly the right position. The motors can also fail, but ours haven't in 250,000 miles so far, nor have I heard of failures from friends with the same type of car. I'm surprised that all that "superior" Honda technology doesn't have the same fix as the Chrysler- you can re-calibrate the control system by simultaneously holding 3 buttons on the AC control panel for 10 seconds, after whiich it will cycle all the doors and sense the correct "full open" and "full closed" positions, and then store the calibration in memory. Works like a charm.

Or maybe that's EXCATLY what the mechanic did... for the usual superior Honda fee, of course. ;-)

Reply to
Steve

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