Synthetic Motor Oil

I can tell you that my three cars have been hooked on synthetic for about= 2 years. All have gained 2 mpg. The two older ones leak oil out of every crack an= d gasket. They did not do that on regular oil. None of them burn oil. My 92 Grand= Am uses (leaks/burns) about 1/2 quart every 5000 miles. I change filter every 30=

00 and oil every 6000. The syn oil takes a long time to get dirty. I get "Supe= r Tech" full syn oil at Wal-Mart for $2+ per quart. Putting "synthetic motor oil" into Google gave 4,500,000 hits so I won't = go into it further.

I've had such good experience with cold weather starting using synthetic, that I am putting it into all my 4 stroke landscaping machines. They're 1 pull starts now instead of 3 or 4. Something about cleaning the valve seats and gunk off all the moving parts....

My engines purr now. On full synthetic. Tomorrow I put it into my snowthrower. 0W20

I've even been experimenting with the idea of using it in place of 2 cycle engine oil that mixes directly with gasoline! I will have to do a few experiments in a glass to see how well it mixes and stays in solution with gas. IF it mixes and STAYS MIXED ( i.e. doesn't settle out / stratify during a few days ) I'm going to use it in my 2 cycle engines also ;-\

Lg

I started using it in my old lawn mower last year. It seems to run good but is kind of smokey. I think two cycles are supposed to use a single visc. oil? i.e.:

30w ? I usually get the green stuff in the small bottle.

======================================================================

Then it is getting burned along with the fuel. Maybe it cleared out the carbon seal between the piston rings and liner sleeve. Now you have blow-by. Just a thought.

On my lawnmower, no smoke. Just runs like NEW, or maybe better. Definitely a noticeable difference in engine performance.

Oh I have tons of 2 cycle motor oil. More than I will use in a lifetime. The *issue* is my Huskvarna equipment costs as much or more than a monthly car payment...and I have the idea that I can prolong the engine life with Mobil 1. THAT might get a little smoky, as the fuel+oil enter the combustion chamber together. But I will test it out on a cheap Ryobi engine first to see how it goes...Like a gas leaf blower. I'm not about to put my Husky chain saw at risk to save a couple of bucks.

THEN AGAIN, Husky chain saw 2 cycle engine oil is INEXPENSIVE. Mobil

1 is liquid gold. So...I don't know. It's a toss up. Engine Life vs expense of consumables vs cost of a new saw or rebuild. It's an iffy experiment at best left to the cheap Ryobi testing machine.

I buy a gallon of 2 cycle engine oil at a time, and certainly have enough to last me. This is just an idea...like an *experiment.* Because of the high rpm these 2 cycle engines run at, they get freaking hot! I'm thinking Mobil 1 might stand that better than regular 2 cycle oil, and even though it costs more, might do a better job at keeping the insides of the engines CLEAN.

I dunno yet. It is just springtime and I am just getting everything fired up.

Lg

I hate to see anyone use any oil mixture in a 2-cycle engine except the ones that are

specifically formulated for that purpose. What's the advantage in using any other

product than the one specified with the correct lubricious factor that can be

bought ready prepared in qts. / gallons at a reasonable price.

mho v=83e

longer engine life.

0W20 certainly covers the viscosity of OEM 2 cycle engine oil.

I've broken crankshafts on 2 cycle engines ( no easy task! ) and gone through a lot of early retirements of worn-out equipment. I think going to a better grade of oil might help solve these problems. There is No Question that in a 4 stroke, full synthetic is giving me better performance...probably from cleaning out the crap left behind by dino oils turning to goop and molasses on parts.

Specially formulated for that purpose? It isn't in the interest of the engine mfgr. to keep your engine running forever. They can't make any money that way.

Lg

Stick with the KY mate.

I used Mobil 1 on a new Briggs and Stratton engine, just after break-in was completed. The thing started burning oil immediately, and gave up the ghost.

I asked the lawn tools guy about it at a local retailer, and he said that it was a mistake, and that B&S had put out warnings about this. (Hearsay. I never saw anything in print about this.)

I rebuilt the engine with B&S parts, and it held for a while, but finally returned to its worn out self. Trashed it.

Whatever the cause, no more synthetic for me in that type of engine.

Ooops ;0

Mark sent me a nice email saying that syn oil for a 4 stroke is not designed to burn so don't try to run it in a 2 cycle, but Bombardier brand 2 cycle is full syn and that is OK to use, along with Amsoil 2 cycle. So...Knowing you have a B&S, that was most likely a 4 stroke.

Funny, it runs my Techumseh engine like a champ ( lawnmower...6hp ).

4 cycle of course. What could be the reason?

I have a 4 stroke Toro snowthrower I am about to change out to Mobil 1

0W20. I don't see how that can run any worse than it runs now...it is 25 years old! I'm going to empty the sludge ( er, dino oil ) from last winter and fill it with 0W20 Mobil 1 and run it for a *while.* Village noise ordinance prohibits my starting it up before 9 a.m., but by the time I get things sorted out ( just woke up ) it should be time for "LIFT OFF"!!! ---or---

OMG! Somebody call the Fire Dept!!! 8-)))

You can't _do_ anything to that Toro that I haven't already done, except run over it with a garbage truck. If it burns to the ground...I've done myself a FAVOR! I get to buy a new one ;) ;-\

If it improves ( you know it sounds like Ned Clampet's Model T on Beverly Hillbillys ), then I win. I figure my chances are 50-50 between a crash & burn and a _CLEANING_ of the insides of what we used to call an engine.

THIS should be interesting after reading about your experience, as I believe that is a 4hp B&S sitting on top of the augers. I have taken it apart and put it back together again so many times it is like

*family.* Well, I'll get back with the results. I think I'll take a fire extinguisher out to the worksite just so I don't burn my house down if something goes wrong.

Otoh, let's be optimistic. Maybe I'll get Lucky.

Lg

======================================================================

HLS! What's UP?

My Toro 4 stroke purrs like a pussycat on Mobil 1 ! Not a _trace_ of smoke, and this is a 25 year old engine! Not only that, it's a Briggs and Stratton I do believe.

Hell, the *stuff* that came out of the sump after 1 winter looked like Oklahoma Crude. I'm flying this on Mobil 1 from now on.

Next up:

2 cycle *experiments*

Lg

Most of it is just the modern version of snake oil.

The companies went to court so that they could charge 'synthetic' oil prices on regular old oil they changed slightly so basically the word 'synthetic' now means anything they can sucker you into buying.

There are very few 'real' synthetic oils on the market. The rest are just price gougers.

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail >

Most of the synthetic oils are specifically designed for improved flow characteristics. This is a good thing in engines with ordinary pressure oiling systems. (It can be a disadvantage in that because it will flow more easily, it will turn small leaks into big ones).

On engines with splash-plate oiling systems, like most small 4-cycle engines, it's a disaster because the stuff runs right off the plate rather than getting picked up and flung properly. The improved flow characteristics mean that the oiling system fails completely and the engine quickly tears itself up.

The engine manufacturers often have warnings about this. I know that Harley-Davidson does.

As far as using synthetic oils in a 2-cycle engine, I don't know what the real story is. My suspicion is that all of the synthetic oils are going to burn with a lot more ash than castor oil or the other oils designed for 2-cycle use. And I would not be surprised to find the combustion products are more stinky and toxic too. But since synthetic oil formulations vary all over the place, it's hard to really know.

I will say that Royal Purple makres a 2-cycle engine oil, called "RP 2-Cycle TCW III" that claims to have lower friction than conventional oils but the low-ash characteristics needed for 2-cycle use. I have never used it, though.

--scott

OK, I ran my 4 cycle engines, 6hp and 4hp, yesterday to mow the lawn, and the 4hp today in the driveway for a burn-in burn-down test. At least

20 minutes at varying speeds. Nothing unusual, except a complete absence of smoke, which I normally get with dino oil, and it didn't appear to be overheating either.

When I put the machine in gear, it pealed rubber in the driveway as I struggled to hold the 425 pound beast in one position. Plenty of power, no meltdown.

That is my experience. With Toro and Techumseh. Is Toro really a B&S engine? I'll go look for a label:

Sorry...It's another TECHUMSEH engine ;-\

So far, Mobil 1 works in Techumseh engines ( lawnmower and snowthrower ) both 4 stroke.

I get my engines mixed up. I have dozens in the barn. Most not in service for one reason or another ( some have broken gas tanks that aren't made anymore...I haven't had the inclination to replace them with something else ).

Lg

Depends on what your requirements for "synthetic" are. Does it have to be from non-petroleum sources? Are you reaching for a certain level of performance? On some oil analysis message boards, this question can elicit dozens of not so simple answers. The simplest way I can explain it is that the line between "synthetic" and "conventional" motor oils was blurred by Castrol North America years ago. The base oil they consider "synthetic" might be sold as "conventional" by other marketers.

Many motors oils were labelled as "full synthetic except for additive carrier oil". Typical motor oil additive packages come in a regular petroleum oil base.

Some are. Some are reasonably priced. The only problem these days is that "synthetic" is used more as a marketing term than a truly descriptive term. Mobil chemists wanted to use the term "synthetisized hydrocarbon" - the early version of Mobil

1 was called "Mobil SHC".

Hmmm. Pretty strong words there, but you aparently have quite a bit of knowlege about motor oil composition. Just exactly is a synthetic oil.

Be careful, using the wrong oil in a 2 stroke will plug the exhaust up tighter than a frogs asshole...

There used to be an opinion that a "full synthetic" oil must contain only base oil that contained polyalphaolefin, ester, or some other non petroleum base oil, or a blend of these oils. Mobil is currently using alylated napthalene in some Mobil 1 formulas.

"Synthetic" (regarding motor oil) used to imply that the base oil was "built up" from from smaller molecules. These days there are petroleum oils that are "hydrocracked" to produce a more uniform product with better properties than ordinary distilled base oil. Most of what is sold as conventional oils these days contains some or all of its oil of this type. Some oils marketed as "synthetic" have more severely hydrocracked oils. There general opinion is that these can make a very good product, although the performance ceiling might be higher with non-petroleum oils.

There's a lot more than base oil that determines how well an oil will work. A good portion of finished motor oil is the additive package. Almost all these materials are man-made, although few will market them as "containing synthetic additives".

My favorite "synthetic" marketing story is about Valvoline SynPower. They seem to have gone overboard touting the benefits of "synthetic" fluids, from fuel injector cleaner to brake fluids. Many of these products are similar to those from other manufacturers who don't try to market them as "synthetic". My favorite example is the SynPower DOT 4 brake fluid. Its performance characteritics are supposed to be higher than the minimum DOT 4 standards, and is close to DOT 5.1 without the extremely high price. I looked at the label, and all the ingredients listed sounded just like brake fluid "glycol and glycol esters". I called up the Valvoline 800 number and asked them what made it "synthetic". The answer was simply that they used "synthetic" as a performance differentiation term, but that all common glycol brake fluids are synthetic. It's like saying that a plastic bag is synthetic. It is, but does that make it special in some way? Now even Prestone is marketing is basic DOT 3 brake fluid as "synthetic". It's all attaching a buzzword that implies high performance even if it's the same old product that they've been selling for years.

I use havoline straight thirty wt. in lawn tools, and change on an annual basis, never any problems.

mho v=83e

The way I see it as a consumer, "synthetic" motor oil is a glorified blend of dino-juice and a man-made lubricant from a petroleum base, which in some cases might be the better of the lot.

It's probably a problem for the refiners to utilize all the "ends" created during the refining process, and the users are the "scapegoats".

I think most any "approved" motor oil for the case in point, will - serve the consumer well when used according to instructions. Just my ideas.

mho v=83e