Tires not holding air?

A lot of tire valves are made in china nowadays.That might have something to do with your leaky tires. cuhulin

Some evening (when it's a little cooler out) after driving around for a while until the tires are good and hot, take a small brush and brush a liberal amount of water and dish soap solution around the bead areas and the valve stem (both on the filler valve area and the seal at the rim) and see if any bubbles form. It may take a little while since the leak is very slow. I've had leaks before where the filler valve had worked loose just enough to leak out the way you describe, but I've also seen leaks around the bead area, but usually on older rims than you have.

I've had one fail like youu are suggesting.....but all four at the same time?

Ed

LOL, no, not all four. But maybe with the extreme heat of the Florida trip, maybe the stems loosened some? Those aren't the tires that cam on the Fiesta, are they? Or did it come with Kumho's on it? It would be awfully hard to prove, but maybe some damage from the installer? Still hard to make it all four tires/rims though.

Good luck with it. Let us know whatever the resolution is.

Kumhos are the original equipment tires on 2011 SE Fiestas. The car has the Ford valve stem attached style of pressure transducers with the replaceable rubber valve stems. I have had the same style on two other Fords and never had a problem with the stems or tires - but then I never drove back and forth to Florida in 100 degree July weather with those vehicles.

The Kumho tires seem decent. At 15K they still look good, don't bump and seem grippy enough for NC weather (little snow!). But this realtively fast air leaking has be baffled. I guess I need to check them at least weekly (they never have "looked" under inflated).

Ed

there's a very limited number of possible causes, so let's consider:

• tires. they're multi-layer, and there are several features designed to help air retention. one is the bead that contacts the rim. another is the butyl rubber liner that decreases air permeability. if either of those have been cheapened, and if you look, you'll see those tires are made in china, they will indeed lose pressure faster than you're used to.

• valves and valve stems. the mold seam sealing surface is crucial to airtightness, and it's easy to screw up with a poor quality molding machine. same for the seal bands on the valve.

• the rims. while unlikely, rims, especially cheap cast aluminum, can be porous.

you could also of course have a flat - a staple on the freeway will explain the single "flattest" tire but still be hard to spot.

but the reason they're all losing air so fast, for my money is either tires of valves. you can have the latter replaced cheaply enough. if it's the tires, and it's bugging you bad enough, you'll have to replace them. get stuff that's not made in china where they cut corners and use unskilled labor, and you'll be fine.

If they are OEM tires go back to the dealer and see what they have to say - the car (and tires)is stil under warranty.

A 2011 having this problem should have the first step of taking it back to the dealer and having them check it out. Having ALL of the tires drop evenly suggests a fault that should be covered.

All the suggestions given to you are viable that you should check out, but I'd personally *lean* towards the valve stems...at least as the first and cheapest thing to go after. I had the same problem as you, although not with the OEM tires. every time I'd check, they all would be down. I let it go, and then one day I came out and one tire was completely flat. I took it off the car and brought it to a tire shop and they said the stem was no good. Put it back on the car and no more problems...from that tire. The other three kept losing air. So I took the car down to the shop and they replaced the remaining 3 stems and I haven't had a problem since. Funny thing was, the guy asked if I got the tires (set of 4 Michelin) from BJ's. Surprised, I said 'yes' and he said he had gotten a lot of people with the same issue in lately. He said they must have gotten a bad/cheap batch of stems. With yours, I suspect the car and tires are still under warranty? Bring it back to the dealer and let them take care of it. Heck, you may even get a new set of tires out of the deal...They might also have experianced a bunch of customers with the same issue as you...

The Ford warranty covers the tires. The amount covered depends on the mileage. I am past the 12,000 mile mark (100% covered till then), but in theory Ford will cover 60% of the cost of the tires, if the problem is the tires (at least till I hit 24,000). And the tires may have a manufacturer's warranty as well. But, I suppose I'll need a little more history before I try to get Ford to do anything. I'll monitor the tires for a couple of weeks and if they still seem to be losing pressure at an unusal rate, I'll visit the dealer. I can't imagine this will be an easy sell, but you never know.

Ed

"C. E. White" wrote in news:j30t9b$u9d$ snipped-for-privacy@dont-email.me:

It's /very/ unlikely to be the tires that are leaking unless there's a puncture. And it's even less likely to be a puncture if all four wheels are exhibiting pressure-loss at the same time. Unless there's some kind of obscure manufacturing-defect, of course.

Your most likely culprits are the wheels (porous alloy; poor sealing at rims), or the valve stems (core; at hole where stem goes into wheel).

This is why you get the warranty that came with the car...

If the tires had this problem from new, I'd agree porous wheels could be the problem, but I doubt four wheels developed similar poroisty after 10,000 miles of use. I just don't picture anything I've done with or to the car could increase the porousity of aluminum wheels (Ford OEM).

The valve stems are a possibility. Ford uses TPM sensors that incorporate replaceable rubber valve stems. The same sort of valve stems were used on two other Fords I've owned and never gave a problem. It is certainly possible that the stems are at fault, but it just seems unlikely that all four would fail at about the same time and lead to similar leage rates. I suppose the stress of the trip to Florida could have affect the stems but I think it is more likely to be the tires.

I am focusing on the tires becasue I wonder if the stress of the trip to Florida (hot temperatures, bumpy / lousy I-95 road surface, continuous driving for 9 hours in each direction, etc.) might have damaged the inner structure of all the tires (and since I've never had Kumho tires before, I am suspious of them). I've checked in the Fiesta forum and no one else has reported a similar problem. Googling leaky Kumho tires get no relevant hits, etc. I think going back to the dealer is the samrt move, but I want to monitor the tire pressure for a few days to confirm they are leaking at an unusal rate. I can't imagine what the dealer will want to do to confirm slowly leaking tires or wheels or valve stems....... But whatever, if the problem presists, I'll get the dealer involved.

Ed White

yup - But I would think that porous alloy or sealing would possibly give you different rates of leakage, even if it were a problem on all 4 rims. You might lose air, but I would think it would not be even across all 4. A problem with the valve stems during manufacturing might me a little more feasible. From something as simple as a batch of stems where the assembly process (either automated or manual) did not torque/tighten the metal plunger into the stem correctly (which is something the poster could easily check if he has a valve stem tool) to a manufacturing defect in the rubber itself (which is what was wrong with the batch that BJ's got in my previous posting) where it was gradually dry rotting on the inside of the rim, allowing the rate of air loss to gradually increase over time.)

But I agree - Just take it in...That's why he has the warranty...Shouldn't even have to think twice on a car this new.

Who knows, they may have had the problem on numerous other vehicles and know EXACTLY what the problem is, and fall all over themselves fixing it for you. Then again, you MAY be living in the "real world"

- where even if they HAD seen dozens of them, they'd deny it.

I had 4 valve stems (without TPM) fail within weeks of each other - they just cracked and let go - all at about 15 months, give or take.I've owned dozens of vehicles - and serviced hundreds more, with "exactly the same valve stems" without ever having one fail (well, the odd one on customer vehicles over the years - but none on mine) - yet with the cheap chinese crap currently on the market i DID have ALL 4 fail in a short period of time (first one on a trip to the east coast, second just after I got home, third in my driveway a week later - and the forth the same day when I checked it to see if it was shot too - just wiggled it a wee bit and the air started leaking.

Take the tires and rims off and throw them in the shallow end of the swimming pool - and watch for a tiny stream of bubbles. Pourous casings were a not uncommon problem not too many years ago on several brands and models of tires - the solution was to install a Michelin Airstop radial tube. (gee, I wonder why THEY were marketed??)

Get your soap bubbles out and see if you can find where it is coming from.

The valves may be the answer.

I have also had tires leak VERY slowly at the bead....so slowly that the tire companies couldnt find the leak with soap. But, as the pressure drops, the sealing force decreases greatly and then the leaks become obvious. In a few cases, I have had to dismount the tire, sand down the bead area, and paint it. In a few cases, I have found moisture inside the wheel, and some corrosion where the wheel disc is welded to the rim.

These may be hard to find, but not impossible.

"C. E. White" wrote in news:j31008$ig9$ snipped-for-privacy@dont-email.me:

Consider the other half of my "porous wheels"comment: Poor assembly-line technique that results in rim leaks.

Unless there's a design or assembly fault.

Can't see that being an issue unless the tires were defective. Modern tires are extremely tough, and are highly tolerant of very significant abuse. Tires are old technology: All the bugs were worked out ages ago.

Kumho and Hankook are excellent-quality tires. The Koreans have tires down pat.

What did Ford change for 2011? new designs? new suppliers? new plant? new equipment? new process?

VERY good idea. Keep as accurate records as you can. Remember, engineers will be studying your records, so you must be as precise, as organized, and as detailed as possible.

If you can go into the dealer with substantial and credible evidence, you will be able to help them to help you solve your problem.

And, if this is a brand-new problem, your research may even be able to help cause a TSB to be issued. You'll be famous!

You may even discover...Devil's advocate speaking here...that your original thesis is incorrect, and that the tires are not actually losing any air at all... You never really know, until you have extensive and accurate records to work from.

It involves water. But wonder not: This is their problem, not yours. If Ford is the conscientious automaker they wish buyers to think they are, their engineering staff will have developed numerous techniques to find defects.

Some automakers are wonderfully anal about detecting and correcting faults. You'd hope Ford is one of those.

You paid for that warranty as part of the purchase price of your car. Time to start collecting on what you paid.

theoretically, but manufacturing integrity is just as susceptible to "economies" as it ever was. thinning/omitting the air liner saves money, regardless of "old" or "new" technology.

label engineering and marketing. look at the tire walls for country of origin - most are made in china.

frod is right behind bmw in terms of their relentless pursuit of production and design objectives and quality control. however, the targets they so carefully and rigorously meet are not those you would suppose.

life limitation is, and has for many years, been the hold grail - their largest r&d spend by a considerable margin. it's cheap and easy to make reliable stuff. it's cheap and easy to make unreliable stuff. it's very hard to make cheap stuff that's reliable only for its design period, then reliably and predictably fail. in terms of engineering challenge, this is probably the only thing about the industry that's got any real intellectual horsepower behind it. getting stuff to work? that's century old news.

Riiiight. If they can find them in the service manager's round file. What I'd do is just tell the service manager I'm tired of shoving quarters in the local tire pump every couple weeks. If he's smart he'll tell his crew to tank the tires. and fix any leaks. If he's real smart he'll tell them to fix any found leaks, and also break them down, clean the rims and put on sealer, and replace the stems, cleaning and sealing there too. Then CE will be a happy camper and maybe buy another Ford. I had this done last year for 2 slow leakers on my Lumina, but they were about 4 years old. And it cost me $44 at Just Tires. Went a full year without air loss before I got new tires. Worth it not having my wife nag me every other day to check her tires, and use my lousy brad nailer tank to pump them up when needed. Alloy rims, but I've had the same issue with steel rims. Just "regular "stems. First thing I'd suspect with new tires is the new-fangled stems. But that might be all wrong. I'd fully expect the dealer to set this right on CE's car. And maybe banging on hot, bad Florida roads did disturb the rim seals. But that's should be Ford's problem, not his.

--Vic