Which oil filters are best?

In case you missed my other post:

Now please tell us how you came to know proprietary information about the design, construction, bidding out, selction of manufacturer for Ford, GM, Chrysler, Toyota, Nissan (and presumably all other car manufacturers in the world). You must be one busy guy to have gained access to so much insider information for so many multinational corporations.

When I buy an OEM filter, I know I am getting a filter that meets the vehicle manufacturer's requirements. And I have news for you, Wix, FRAM, and Purolator don't make all their own filters either. They out source filters from each other and from third parties and sell to each other and third parties. And if you think that filter companies aren't building to the lowest spec and cost, you aren't paying attention.

If you trust FRAM, you should pay more attention. For my 1997 Expedition FRAM lists a standard PH2 Filter. WRONG! This filter has the standard hard rubber anti-drainback valve and is prone to allowing the oil to drain back to the base. When this happens you get a significant period of timing chain rattle while the oil pressure builds back up. Motorcraft only recommends the FL820S Filter for this application (and they only sell FL820S filters in this size). This filter has a superior silicone antidrainback valve. FRAM does sell a filter like this, but you have to know that you need to buy the more expensive TG2 Tough Guard Filter instead of the PH2 Extra Guard Filter. I have cut the Motorcraft FL820S and FRAM TG2 Filters apart, and their is no doubt in my mind that the Motorcraft Filter is superior AND it costs less. Another thing that bothers me about FRAM is that it is very common for them to cross reference the same filter to multiple filters from other suppliers or have different cross references than the manufacturer.

Ed

According to

only one drainback valve leaked, the Vic brand's, and it was judged to leak only insignificantly.

I've had only one noticeable filter failure, when a Motorcraft in my VW ruptured at the bottom seam 25 years ago. But I have no evidence that any filters were better or worse than average because I've found no correlation between them and the oil tests I've had done annually.

GM does that as well, not only for non-GM engines but also their own, and if you check filter catalogs you'll probably see that GM will recommend one particular filter for several of their engines where NAPA, Wix, Fram, and Lee will specify 3-4 different ones. One example is their PF56, which GM recommended even for 1980s VWs with much higher than normal relief pressure. Lee and Fram filters for the same applications had different relief pressures (or at least the Fram's valve was a different color plastic) and numbers and sizes of holes.

Does anyone know what brand of filters the large fleet owners use? Like NY or LA cabs or police cars that get heavy duty use. It seems they would use a proven brand that is affordable. I dont think they could afford to gamble on low quality or unpredictable filters.

Duhhh.... Because its NOT proprietary? Because that is and has been standard practice in the parts branch of most automakers for years (GM until recently has been a farily notable excption- when AC/Delco was their parts arm they actually had all the infrastructure to make most parts). In the case of filters, the answer is even more transparent because the filter manufacturers use assembly methods and materials that make their filters obvious at a glance (after you get used to what to look for) and you can tell who made it regardless of what's on the label. Have you actually READ that oil filter study on the MiniMopar site?

You don't have to know insider information or even be particularly inquisitive to understand standard business practices. You don't have to have insider information to know that most car companies do not own a facility set up to produce filters! Or refine oil to make ATF, engine oil, gear lube, etc. Or to develop and produce coolants. ALL those things are done by contract.

Or just be observant when you buy. LOOK at the part before you install it- that's how people realized that Mopar filters had been changed from Dana to Fram a number of years ago.

So you actually think that the carmaker's name on the filter you get in the parts department guarantees that the filter sold there is in ANY WAY related to the one that came from the production line, other than meeting a bare miniumum spec that isn't actually tested all that closely as the supported vehicle gets older and older? You do realize that some carmakers have completely separate supply chains for manufacturing versus aftermarket support, right? And you do realize that even in the cases where the supply chains aren't separated entirely, the supplier for parts for cars a few years old isn't necessarily the same as the one that was used when the car was manufactured? Right?

Agreed. Those should be the LAST choice, right after dealer parts.

So does a Fram listed for that application. But Fram is inferior to Wix or Purolator (or just about anything else).

There are only about 4 major manufacturers of filters. If you can exclude getting one made by Fram (which you can do by buying Puorlator or Wix), then you're OK. The problem with buying OEM is that Fram might just have gotten the OEM contract.

I "trust" Fram to always make junk, and often sell it under various brand names. But the major manufacturers that sell under their OWN names don't buy from each other. If it is a Wix, you can bet there isn't a fram filter inside.

They use the cheapest possible filters. In Washington DC, some of the city vehicles get oil changes without the filters being changed, in order to save money. Of course, this is the town where folks get injured, getting hit by ambulances with bad brakes.

--scott

For which claim? That the DC city vehicle management is incompetent? I can probably come up with some Washington Post articles on the subject.

Fleet managers in larger fleet operations are probably paid a LOT more than the DC city government pays anyone.

There were LOTS of major lawsuits against the DC city government for this sort of thing. Exploding manholes, police officers with nonfunctioning vehicles, city busses with drivers that refused to go into bad neighorhoods.

Ummm... they were having enough trouble trying to get city employees to be paid with checks that weren't bad.

Remember this is the city that bought computers for everyone in the parking enforcement offices, but didn't provide any software or training. After six months or so of having nonfunctioning computers on their desks, people started taking their computers home (with the blessings of management).

--scott

Depends on the vehicle but most NYPD vehicles get either Baldwin or Wix. The patrol cars get oil/filter changes every 3 weeks. NY State police upstate get WIX (99% of there work is done in NAPA supplied shops) They also run full synthetics in them.

Now the State Employee cars are a different matter. Those are no longer in house vehicles, they are all leased and the service contracts go with them to the leasing dealers. Used to be that all the State vehicles were owned and maintained in house.

The Wifey's office has a GSA car. They are told by GSA when to take it to the "authorized shop" for it to be serviced. The schedule works out to about the "light duty" maintenance interval for the given vehicle. They do the bare minimum to keep it on the road. The lease expires around 50k and it gets auctioned off.

I know of only 2 independent tests, this one done 11 years ago by a Finnish auto magazine:

and a Consumer Reports review published in their 2/1987 issue, with a follow up a few months later.

While obsolete by almost 20 years, below are the CR results. The first score is for single-pass fitration efficiency for 20u particles (A =

88%+ removed, B = 72-88%, C = 60-72%, D = less than 60% removed), the second score for dirt capacity when the oil pressure drop across the filter reached 80% of the allowed maximum.

Fram:

PH25 A/B PH30 A/B PH43 A/B PH46 A/C PH8A A/B PH3387A A/B PH2870A A/B

Lee:

LF24 C/A LF25 B/B LF16 C/B LF42 A/B LF1 B/B LF1HP A/B LF40 B/B LF17HP B/B LF213HP B/C

AC:

PF24 C/B PF25 C/A PF34 C/B PF20 C/C PF47 B/B (British made: B/A) X21 D/A

Kmart:

K5 C/B K3 C/C K9 C/C K29 C/C K1 C/B K11 C/B K26 C/B

Motorcraft:

FL9 C/A FL10 C/B FL300 C/A FL13B B/B FL1A C/A FL321 C/B FL268 C/B FL401 C/B

Purolator:

PER33 B/B PER49 C/B PER51 C/C FC064 C/B PER1A C/B PER111 C/B FC01 B/B FC0252 C/C

Sears

45172 C/B 45173 D/B 45176 C/B 45202 B/A 45170 C/B 45191 B/A 45177 B/B 45194 B/A 45197 B/A

Hastings: D/? (less than 50% removed, worst efficiency of all tested).

Mopar 3549-957 B/B

Toyota 15601-44011 B/B

Nissan 15208-H8916 D/B

2 months later, CR finished testing Lee Maxifilters and rated them equal to the Frams. The Frams tested were orange "Wear Guard," while currently available orange Frams are "Extra Guard" and claimed by Fram to be better.

Yes but that isn't what someone running fleet cares about. Cheap filters work well when they get changed often. Cheap filters fail when they get old and plugged. It's that simple. Regular maintenance means the filter never gets old and plugged. Just because some fool puts a dirty old engine with a dirty old oil filter onto a racetrack and subjects it to high oil pressure and it fails that doesn't prove any thing to someone running a fleet. Someone running a fleet buys and installs a huge number of oil filters and never sees one fail. They simply don't fail as long as oil can flow thru them freely. If nothing is restricting the flow there is nothing to cause them to fail. Your imagination is running wild. A fleet manager doesn't get into a silly discussions with an administrator about what filter to buy. He makes that decision himself and he isn't going to waste money he can use elsewhere on a filter that will hold up under catastrophic conditions that his fleet is never going to experience. A cheap filter works as good as an expensive one under the conditions his vehicles experience. The purpose of a filter is to remove dirt. Once it has accomplished that task it should be thrown away. Paying extra money for a filter that has the capability to survive well beyond the limits of the task it is designed for isn't something a fleet manager is going to care about.

-jim

which was the answer given to the question asked.

-jim

Although maybe dated, at least this is data. Anything could have happened in the intervening years,BUT real numerical data is far preferable to the 'cut them open and hypothesize' group.

Of course not. But neither would I base oil filter purchases on vague observations and prejudice.

NOBODY has published any oil filter data in the recent years which is worth a tinker's damn.

Fram looks bad...so what? Only a relatively few companies make filters in the USA.

Hard cold specifications have not been set by the manufacturers. If they had, then this debate would not be ongoing.

You dont really know whether Wix is better than Fram, or whether Mobil1 is better than toilet paper.

You have your ideas, your preferences, your prejudices, but you have very little hard fact.

SHOW ME THE FACTS! (and with all due respect, I dont think that you have them. I know I dont have them.)

THE FACTS ARE THAT CAR MANUFACTURERS SPEND A LOT OF TIME AND MONEY DESIGINING AND DEVELOPING COMPONENTS FOR THE CARS THEY SELL. ON THAT BASIS ALONE I WOULD PUT MUCH MORE TRUST IN THE PRODUCT DESIGNED UNDER THOSE CIRCUMSTANCES THAN SOMETHING FROM THE LOCAL DISCOUNT AUTO PARTS STORE OR FLY-BY-NIGHT WEB-BASED SELLER.

Pistons, yes. Blocks, yes. Intake manifolds, yes. Transmissions, yes (if they don't decide to buy a Borg-Warner or a Getrag gearset). But not alternators, starters, power steering pumps, and DEFINITELY NOT OIL FILTERS. They pick a design that fits and meets minimum performance criteria. In SOME cases they'll put out a spec for a new design to industry and await responses, then pick a vendor.

But WHEN was the last time a new oil filter form-factor, let alone a filter with new FUNCTIONAL characteristics appeared on the market? Hell, half the vehicles on the road can still use the good old Wix 15515/ Motorcraft FL1-A,/ AC PF-2 that's been around from the 50s, and still more can make use of the "shorty" version of the same filter.

The companies that have a vested interest in making filters that actually WORK better are the ones that make the filters, and some of them (not all) do try to develop better filter function.

ON THAT

I agree on a fly-by night company, but that's not the issue. The issue is 'by a filter of unknown origin in a dealer box, versus a Wix or Purolator from a parts store?'

Again, where do you get this nonsense. Seems to me I asked before, but I will ask again. Please share with us your background that would allow you to have access to the design, contracting and purchasing decisions made by the major automotive manufacturers.

That's ass-backwards. There is no heavy weight entity overlooking the individual makers of filters sold at retail. The car manufacturer is looking over the shoulder of the company making filters for use in their cars out of self-interest.

Chances are I will go with the dealer.

Fact, not nonsense.

I answered before. Its not a secret.

Now its your turn: I ask you directly to show me any evidence at all that Ford, GM, or DiamlerChrysler (or any other major you choose to name) owns an assembly line that is even capable of producing an oil filter. You seem so confident that Toyota makes filters.. YOU prove it.

It absolutely amazes me to think that a person can be born, grow up, and reach a level of maturity so as to be able to type without having the most simplistic understanding of how major corporations do business. Or (obviously) without ever opening the hood of a and seeing the Nippondenso alternator, Sanden AC compressor, Gates hoses, Dayco belts, Stant radiator caps, Robertshaw thermostats, Bosch fuel injectors, etc. etc. etc. To actually believe that a carmaker in the 21st century (really from about the mid 20th onward) wastes its resources doing R&D and production on expendable parts is so incredibly naive that I start to wonder if you're just trolling.