Are any Toyota products sold in US not made or assembled in US?

Try looking in the right place for what you need to find and that is definition for the first number of the VIN.. The places you looked do not tell you WHY a Camry made in Japan has a 'J' and not a number '4,' like those only assembled in the US? WHY does a Corolla made in Canada have a 2 and not a 1?

mike

Mike,

Just point us to a reference that supports your claims. I am 100% certain that the first digit has nothing to do with domestic content. But you could prove me wrong by giving us one credible refernce. Is that too much to ask?

Ed

Are there certain percentages known for certain plants? The last time I subscribed to techinfo.toyota.com, I downloaded several pages from Toyota Technical Training that decode the Vehicle Identification Number for each model year. The only listing for the first digit is:

2005: World Source: J = Japan 1 = NUMMI 2 = Canada: TMMC 3 = Mexico: TMMBC 4 = USA: TMMK 5 = USA: TMMI & TMMCA

That used to be true, until on Oct. 12, 2006 when the Toyota Camry Hybrid began to come off of the TMMK line (Kentucky).

Saying "look in the right place" without ever citing the reference makes your explanation difficult, if not timpossible to confirm. If you want to demonstrate that you are correct, provide a relevant reference. If you want people to continue to doubt your credibiltiy, keep saying "look in the right place because I don't do my kids' homework," WBMA.

The explanation I have seen from Toyota is that the first character identifies the plant, and the info from 49 CFR 565 does not confilct with that explanation.

I suppose I should sumarized what I do know about WMIs (World Manufacturer Identifiers). These are the frst three digits of current VINs. The WMIs area actually assigned by the SAE, NOT, the US governement. This is explained at

. The first digit indicates the country of origin:

1, 4, 5 = US 2= Canada 3 = Mexico J = Japan SN-ST = Germany etc....

See

for amore extensive list.

Fords assembled in Canada, like the Crown Victoria, get a "2" as the first digit. Toyotas assembled in Canada also get a "2" as the first digit. In neither case does this indicate that some percentage of the parrts were also built in Canada (or North America). Fords assembled in Mexico, like the Fusion, get a "3" as the first digit. Again this does not indicate that some percentage of parts were made in Mexico. Toyotas assembled in the US could have a 1, 4, or 5 as the first digit, just like a Ford assembled in the US. You might want to play with the Toyota VIN decoder at

Some examples

1T1 = Toyota Passenger Car Assembled at NUMMI 4T1 = Toyota Passenger Car Assembled at TMMK (Toyota Kentucky)

Here is a list of the domestic contnet of 2004 vehicles -

It is my understanding that the current V-6 Mustang only qualifies as having

60 to 65% doemestic content, yet they still get a "1" as the first digit.

Ed

The first digit is determined by Final Assembly Point.

You are confusing the NA parts content, with US content.. We know 2 , 3, J K etc indicate the county of origin. However for those made in the US 1 4 5 are assigned. Knowing that, logic tells you there must be a reason WHY there are three numbers for the US rather than just one. ;)

mike

Nor does it explain WHY the US has more than one number. ;)

mike

I have post the place to look a half dozen times.

mike

NO - you have made very hazy references and I have looked very hard. Nothing support your claim. Be specific, or admit you made it up.

Ed

Mike,

So you have created this whole fantasy based on faulty deductive reasoning? I thought as much. You have no proof at all, so please stop making this claim.

I believe the different numbers are assigned because different "Ford" or "Toyota" entities are considered the Manufacturer or because the manufacturer wishes to differentiate the various products.

Here are the Ford NA WMIs:

VIN Code Vehicle Manufacturer Make Type

1F6 Detroit Chassis LLC, USA Ford Basic (Stripped) Chassis 1FA Ford Motor Company, USA Ford Passenger Car 1FB Ford Motor Company, USA Ford Bus 1FC Ford Motor Company, USA Ford Basic (Stripped) Chassis 1FD Ford Motor Company, USA Ford Incomplete Vehicle 1FM Ford Motor Company, USA Ford MPV* 1FT Ford Motor Company, USA Ford Truck (Completed Vehicle) 1L1 Ford Motor Company, USA Lincoln Incomplete Vehicle - Limousine 1LJ Ford Motor Company, USA Lincoln Incomplete Vehicle (Hearse) 1LN Ford Motor Company, USA Lincoln Passenger Car 1ME Ford Motor Company, USA Mercury Passenger Car 1MH Ford Motor Company, USA Mercury Incomplete Vehicle 1ZV Automotive Alliance International (USA) Ford Passenger Car 2FA Ford Motor Company of Canada, Ltd. Ford Passenger Car 2FD Ford Motor Company of Canada, Ltd. Ford Incomplete Vehicle 2FM Ford Motor Company of Canada, Ltd. Ford MPV 2FT Ford Motor Company of Canada, Ltd. Ford Truck (Completed Vehicle) 2LM Ford Motor Company of Canada, Ltd. Lincoln MPV 2ME Ford Motor Company of Canada, Ltd. Mercury Passenger Car 2MH Ford Motor Company of Canada, Ltd. Mercury Incomplete Vehicle 2MR Ford Motor Company of Canada, Ltd. Mercury MPV 3FA Ford Motor Company Mexico Ford Passenger Car 3FD Ford Motor Company Mexico Ford Incomplete Vehicle 3FT Ford Motor Company Mexico Ford Truck (Completed Vehicle) 3FN Blue Diamond Trucks S. De R. L. De C. V. Ford Truck (Completed Vehicle) 3FR Blue Diamond Trucks S. De R. L. De C. V. Ford Incomplete Vehicle 3LN Ford Motor Company, Mexico Lincoln Passenger Car 3ME Ford Motor Company, Mexico Mercury Passenger Car 4F2 Ford Motor Company, USA Mazda MPV 4F4 Ford Motor Company, USA Mazda Truck (Completed Vehicle) 4M2 Ford Motor Company, USA Mercury MPV 5L1 Ford Motor Company, USA Lincoln MPV - Limousine 5LM Ford Motor Company, USA Lincoln MPV 5LT Ford Motor Company, USA

I can't find a complete list of the valid Toyota WMIs but I do know:

For the first digit:

1 = USA: NUMMI (USA, California) 4 = USA: TMMK (USA, Kentucky) 5 = USA: TMMI & TMMCA (USA, Indiana and California) 2 = Canada: TMMC J = Japan

For the second digit:

N = NUMMI T = Toyota

For the third digit:

D,G,K,X,1,2,7 = Passenger Car A,B,M,4 = Truck B = Truck E,L,3 = Multipurpose Passenger Vehicle (SUV)

5 = Incomplete Vehicle

Ed

You can try decode VIN at VINchecker:

regards g

Mike claims that his friend, a former Ford engineer told him about this system or a link to web info on this system.

What do you mean "no proof?" There is lots of evidence. Like the fact that the digits are 1, 4, and 5. If Mike's claims were correct, don't you think that they would be 1, 2 and 3? Makes more sense.

But the reality is that at first, only 1 was assigned to the US. Later, when it was clear that the US was running out of WMIs (World Manufactor IDs; every manufacturer which makes more than 500 vehicles gets one), 4 and later

5 were assigned to the US. Don't forget, Ford, AMC, GM, MCI, Thomas, Seagrave, Catapiller, American Indian, Chyrsler, Mack, White, and a whole bunch of vehicle makers get these, as well as some off-road vehicles (off-raod vehicles have their own VIN system since about 2001). All the digits and 21 letters are used (l, o,q, z and one other letter aren't used because they look like other digits or letters), so that means that only 31 x 31 or 961 possible WMIs exist for the first digit 1, same for 4 and for 5.

So the reason why Ford, GM and Chrysler have 1's is that they were making vehicles when the US was assigned 1s. When Toyota and Honda came along, as well as Mercury and Lincoln trucks and SUVs, they got 4s and 5s. That's why nearly identical vehicles coming off the same assembly line have different first digits for the VIN.

This also explains why there is no relationship between the first digit of the VIN and domestic content.

Don't worry about Mike. He has been spewing this garbage for ages in alt.autos.ford, too. He keeps telling people it is in the Commerce Dept. web site. The Commerce Dept. doesn't regulate VINs, the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration does. That's part of the Department of Transportation. You would think if Mike is right, it would be in the US Code or another site would mention his conjecture. But that isn't the case.

And he keeps making up new stories about where he got his information from. Oh well. At least his imagination is active.

Jeff

You mean you posted something like "look the US Commerce Department website" about a half dozen times.

You have never posted the exact URL.

Please post the exact URL.

Jeff

The US has more than one number because there are so many different US manufacturers, like Ford, GM, Chrysler, Toyota, Honda, Hyundai, American LaFrance, Seagrave, Mack, Winabego, American Indian, Honda, Catapillar, many of which have more than one WMI (the first three letters/digits are assigned to specific manufacturers). In fact, there are so many manufacturers, the US is running out of WMIs:

If the first digit meant something else from the get-go, wouldn't it make more sense that we got 1, 2 and 3, instead of Canada and Mexico getting 2 and 3?

Jeff

Funny how Ford chose to use only 70% US content for Ford MPVs. And they are often built on the exact same assembly line by the same workers (who do not have USPS vehicles without license plates). You would expect that if the first digit of the VIN acctually meant something about content that Ford, Lincoln and Mercury vehicles would all have similar content, not some