I really love my Camry, but occasionally I get buyer's remorse and think I shoulda dropped an extra 10k for the intro Lexus IS 250 or ES 330. Would anyone know if these '06 Lexus models were selling at invoice (or perhaps under invoice) like the '06 Camry was last year?
I bought the Camry for about $1,200 under invoice. Do you think the same would have been possible for the '06 intro Lexus models?
Also, would you happen to know if the size of the interior space is about equal between the '06 Camry and the IS 250? I mean the intro Lexus isn't a small-size sedan like the intro BMW 3 Series model is it? (Looks like the IS 250 is three-quarters of a foot shorter in length than the '06 Camry LE.)
Why the remorse. What features are you looking for that the Lexus has but the Camry does not?
From my experience, it's been much easier to negotiate with a Toyota dealer than a Lexus dealer. That's probably because the Lexus dealers enjoy exclusive markets for the most part.
As far as their interior dimensions, you can research this yourself. Go to both their websites and compare their dimensions. From my understanding, the IS is smaller in the interior, partly due to being a rear-wheel drive.
At least in the previous generation, the IS was a completely different car from the ES, and I can't imagine there was much overlap in the people who bought them. The ES is a very nice car, but it stresses comfort, and even Consumer Reports notes that nobody could call it very sporty or fun to drive. The IS, otoh, was deliberatey and proudly "rough around the edges." Its interior and exterior styling were from the "in your face" school. It was very fast, and very nimble, but it was tight inside, had a miniscule trunk, and had a fairly stiff ride. It had rear-wheel drive and (most shipped) with
17" Z or W-rated performance tires that stuck like glue but wore out quickly and were actually dangerous in snow. The ES was competing with the C-class Mercedes while the IS competed with the 3-series BMW.
My sense is that for better or worse, Lexus filed down most of the rough edges in the current IS250-350. The styling is still somewhat more aggressive than the normal Lexus, but this time the car is based on a shortened GS chassis, rather than its own chassis. As a result, the ride is smoother, but interestingly, although Consumer Reports gave the IS250 its nod as the best car in its class (including the new
3-Series, the Saab, and others), they also noted that it's no longer very sporty.
However the IS300 had Toyota's venerable 3-liter straight six which goes back to the Supra in the early 80s. It was heavy (cast iron block), and used a lot of gas, although allegedly it took to turbocharging very well, and was easy to soup up to put out 400-600 hp from its stock 215 in the IS (and 220 in the GS, since the GS had room under the hood to install dual exhausts). The current IS has a new-design 3.5 liter V-6, which puts out nearly 100 hp more than the old IS did, and actually manages to get better mileage. So while the new IS350 isn't sporty, it certainly is fast.
Personally, I like a "driver's car" and don't mind that my 02 manual tranny IS is a bit rough around the edges. In fact, I like it. Unfortunately, Toyota, even when they set out to build a sporty car, seems unable or unwilling to assemble anything other than marshmellows on wheels. If I had to replace the IS today I don't know what I'd do, since you can't get a stick shift in the 350, and I think the car's too soft anyway. I might consider the 3-series BMW, but their reliability doesn't even come within artillery range of a Toyota's, and their current styling is even uglier than the IS. So I've resolved to keep my IS300 until the wheels fall off, or at least until someone comes up with a car that is reliable, sporty, and doesn't look like it was designed by either a committee or someone who's spent their entire life watching anime cartoons.
You're very smart to have bought the Camry instead of the ES. Better transmission at a lower price for an almost identical car. Only thing you might miss is the coffee in the Lexus service center and loaner car (if they have one), but you would pay much more for the Lexus service. I speak as an embarrassed ES owner. Put that $10K that you saved into a retirement account and let it compound and you'll be even happier. After having had the ES for about 2 years now, I have to admit I was an idiot for buying it in favor of the Camry. To my defense, when I went into the local Toyota dealership to look at the Camry, they didn't have one in the showroom or any in stock!!!! I needed a car asap so went with the Lexus. What an putz I am.
Both the Lexus models are too new for those big discounts.
Nope.
Really small back seat in the IS.
Want a near-luxury bargain? Acura TL can be had for near invoice. Of course, at this point your best deal is to hang onto the Camry. Put a set of good tires on the Camry and it will feel like a different car; way cheaper than actually buying a different car.
I was going to suggest an Acura too. I am very impressed by my 2 new Honda's and if I wanted to go upscale I would definitely look at the Acura. The Honda's remind me of how precisely Toyota's used to be made.
Also don't go to dealer service departments...find a local mom and pop garage that works on your vehicle type and use him. Who do you think pays for that "free" coffee, loaner car, service reps, car wash and etc the dealer service department has ???? I use a local chap who works only on Honda & Toyota products. I drive an Acura 3.2 TL but the argument is still the same.
I just don't get that. Why not offer a sport-package with a 6 speed manual on the IS350 ? I think they are missing out on many potential buyers. I testdrove the is250 because I want a manual and I thought it was a dog and way too mushy. I do like the looks a lot better than the is300.
I don't get it either. It just looks to me like Toyota is just not interested in building a truly sporty car. It's a shame-- my IS300 was the only Lexus I'd even think twice about purchasing at any price. The rest of the line is just a bunch of old men's cars. I thought they were going in a good direction with the original IS, but i guess that's not where they want to go.
The ES330 (2004) model was the worst piece of crap I have ever owned. It had the fly-by-wire system, it's acceleration lag was as long as 2 seconds(lots of complaints on nhtsa.gov). I understand the new ES has these issues resolved.
Thanks for everyone's advice. I feel much better now about buying the '06 Camry rather than splurging on a Lexis ES330.
Hmm, maybe I can buy a fake "L" badge at AutoZone and put that on my Camry's front hood... You know like the fake Car Alarm blinking light that you can put on your dash. You used to be able to buy those at AutoZone. Next time, I'll look for the "L."
Say doesn't Lincoln's emblem just look like an upside-down "L?"
I went to the dealership in Fairfax and was quoted 1500 below the invoice on the ES350, its a nice Ride but I'd rather have the piece of mind buying the Camry. its too bad the Camry has a funny Nose.
Wow! That sounds like a great price. Are you sure that's a 2007 ES350 or are you talking about a 2006 ES330? Or do you mean $1,500 below sticker for a 2007 ES350?
That would be a great price for a 2006 ES330.
I can't imagine that the 2007 ES330 is selling for $1,500 below invoice after being introduced only about a month or 2 ago.
We're lucky here in mid-Missouri. A hundred miles away in Saint Louis,
there are two independent Lexus dealerships separated by only 7 miles.
I hope snipped-for-privacy@AOL.COM will confirm for us that a Fairfax, Virginia dealership quoted him a price $1,500 under _invoice_ and not $1,500 under _MSRP_ or "sticker." Anxiously waiting.
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