OT: One Canadian perspective on "free healthcare"

Thu. 10/11/07 01:11 PM

Got this from friend in Canada

"I am forwarding this email I received from a buddy in Canada. Please take the time to read it so you can do whatever you wish....research, verify, etc., but please read it. " I saw on the news up here in Canada where Hillary Clinton introduced her new health care plan. Something similar to what we have in Canada. I also heard that Michael Moore was raving about the health care up here in Canada in his latest movie. As your friend and someone who lives with the Canada health care plan I thought I would give you some facts about this great medical plan that we have in Canada. First of all: 1) The health care plan in Canada is not free. We pay a premium every month of $96. for Shirley and I to be covered. Sounds great eh. What they don't tell you is how much we pay in taxes to keep the health care system afloat. I am personally in the 55% tax bracket. Yes 55% of my earnings go to taxes. A large portion of that and I am not sure of the exact amount goes directly to health care our #1 expense. 2) I would not classify what we have as health care plan, it is more like a health diagnosis system. You can get into to see a doctor quick enough so he can tell you "yes indeed you are sick or you need an operation" but now the challenge becomes getting treated or operated on. We have waiting lists out the ying yang some as much as 2 years down the road. 3) Rather than fix what is wrong with you the usual tactic in Canada is to prescribe drugs. Have a pain here is a drug to take- not what is causing the pain and why. No time for checking you out because it is more important to move as many patients thru as possible each hour for Government re-imbursement 4) Many Canadians do not have a family Doctor. 5) Don't require emergency treatment as you may wait for hours in the emergency room waiting for treatment. 6) Shirley's dad cut his hand on a power saw a few weeks back and it required that his hand be put in a splint - to our surprise we had to pay $125. for a splint because it is not covered under health care plus we have to pay $60. for each visit for him to check it out each week. 7) Shirley's cousin was diagnosed with a heart blockage. Put on a waiting list . Died before he could get treatment. 8) Government allots so many operations per year. When that is done no more operations, unless you go to your local newspaper and plead your case and embarrass the government then money suddenly appears. 9)The Government takes great pride in telling us how much more they are increasing the funding for health care but waiting lists never get shorter. Government just keeps throwing money at the problem but it never goes away. But they are good at finding new ways to tax us, but they don't call it a tax anymore it is now a user fee. 10) A friend needs an operation for a blockage in her leg but because she is a smoker they will not do it. Despite paying into the health care system all these years. My friend is 65 years old. Now there is talk that maybe we should not treat fat and obese people either because they are a drain on the health care system. Let me see now, what we want in Canada is a health care system for healthy people only. That should reduce our health care costs. 11) Forget getting a second opinion, what you see is what you get. 12) I can spend what money I have left after taxes on booze, cigarettes, junk food and anything else that could kill me but I am not allowed by law to spend my money on getting an operation I need because that would be jumping the queue. I must wait my turn except if I am a hockey player or athlete then I can get looked at right away. Go figger. Where else in the world can you spend money to kill yourself but not allowed to spend money to get healthy. 13) Oh did I mention that immigrants are covered automatically at tax payer expense having never contributed a dollar to the system and pay no premiums. 14) Oh yeh we now give free needles to drug users to try and keep them healthy. Wouldn't want a sickly druggie breaking into your house and stealing your things. But people with diabetes who pay into the health care system have to pay for their needles because it is not covered but the health care system. I send this out not looking for sympathy but as the election looms in the states you will be hearing more and more about universal health care down there and the advocates will be pointing to Canada. I just want to make sure that you hear the truth about health care up here and have some food for thought and informed questions to ask when broached with this subject. Step wisely and don't make the same mistakes we have

Jim, Little River, AK

Reply to
Roadrunner NG
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A good idea...research that is.

Snopes is undecided at the moment, but this letter is suspect:

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Reply to
witfal

Doesn't matter if the letter suspect or not. I've heard this basically same story from other Canadians.

Reply to
dbu.

Wouldn't it be better to have actual evidence rather than speculation?

I've heard similar stories from my relatives in Ontario, but to have the ammo to blast Hillary's inanity, I'd rather have hard facts at hand.

Reply to
witfal

This is pretty interesting and sounds a lot like what tegger said last week. I just have a couple of comments. jor

Well, this is new information. I was under the impression that Canadians had no out of pocket expenses.

In my own experience (admitedly limited) this is a typical approach here too.

Now this one I have experience with. This is typical in U.S. emergency rooms as well.

Reply to
jor

Wouldn't it be better to have heard this first hand from the horse's mouth as I have.

Reply to
dbu.

Re-read my second paragraph. I did hear this first-hand, from my relatives.

I'd still rather have cold hard facts, not anecdotal stories, if I were going to battle her nonsense.

Reply to
witfal

I'd rather read the text of the law which dictates how the Canadian system operates. You can't always trust customers (aka "patients"), or even administrative employees who may not know the rules as well as they should.

Reply to
JoeSpareBedroom

The letter itself may be suspect, but the items are true across the socialized medicine countries. You have to wait in line for urgent medical care. Many people die waiting for critical operations or treatments. I have sleep apnea, apparently since childhood and I am NOT obese (5'9",

180lbs, 120 out of high school). Here in the US under company sponsored medical insurance I got my CPAP in about 1 month after my appointment was made (the day the appointment was scheduled, not the actual test date). It included the customary humidifier to prevent dried sinus passages and dry mouth. In Canada and England it can take almost a year for the testing and another year for actually receiving a CPAP. Forget the necessary humidifier! They are not allowed to give you one! You will have to purchase one on your own, probably from the US! And BTW, read Hillary's plan. It will be against the law to purchase heath care!

Mike D.

Reply to
Mike Dobony

You're a moron.

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Reply to
ToMh

I read that glossed over marketing sales brochure and it's nothing but a snow job. There's no plan.

Reply to
dbu.

If there was a plan, would you approve of it if it was a good plan? Or would you dismiss it as socialized medicine?

Reply to
JoeSpareBedroom

The problem is if you wait for hillarycare to become law then it's too late. Do you think for a moment they will tell you how the "plan" is going to work once she has passed it into law. No. You will find out after the fact. Then, you will also find out how much they'll modifiy it. First get foot in door, then comes the cold hard facts.

Reply to
dbu.

If you can't get the text of a law before it's passed, you have your own legislator(s) to blame for that. Sometimes they don't even read what they're voting on, and that's true of both parties.

Reply to
JoeSpareBedroom

I guess my ezperience of five years ago is atypical. I had an attack of pancreatitis, and was seen by an ER doctor within five minutes of my arrival, and was admitted to the hospital in less than an hour. Note: this was the "Emergency" section of the hospital, not the "Urgent Care" section, where dozens of colicky babies, victims of cut fingers, sprained ankles and other minor delights are left waiting for hours.

Reply to
mack

Really? Then show me a real plan from one of the Republican candidates . Gulliani's plan is far more cryptic than Hillary's.

Reply to
ToMh

What kind of plan you looking for? What would be a plan which is acceptable to you? Tell us your requirments.

Reply to
dbu.

time to read it so you

saw on the news up here in

similar to what we have in

here in Canada in his

plan I thought I would

First of all: 1) The health

Shirley and I to be covered.

the health care system

taxes. A large portion of

expense. 2) I would not

system. You can get into

you need an operation" but

lists out the ying yang some

the usual tactic in Canada

the pain and why. No

patients thru as possible each

Doctor. 5) Don't require

for treatment. 6) Shirley's

be put in a splint - to

health care plus we have

cousin was diagnosed with a

Government allots so

to your local newspaper

9)The Government takes

health care but waiting

but it never goes away.

anymore it is now a user

is a smoker they will

friend is 65 years old. Now

because they are a drain on

care system for healthy

second opinion, what you

booze, cigarettes, junk food

money on getting an

except if I am a hockey

in the world can you spend

did I mention that

contributed a dollar to the

to try and keep them

your things. But people

needles because it is not

but as the election looms

down there and the

the truth about health

broached with this

I AM a Canadian of 61 years. The comments in this post are essentially true. Details do vary across Canada, but, for the most part, the post is a good summation of our Canadian system. The key thing is to get in whatever queue as soon as possible...before your condition becomes critical.

Reply to
sharx35

to blast Hillary's

Nonetheless, after 61 years in Canada, warts and all, I still prefer the our Canadian system. Probably, though, because it the shit REALLY hit the fan, I could afford to go elsewhere, outside Canada, for the necessary procedure, rather than die in the queue. So, far, though, when acutely ill, I've always gotten almost immediate care.....so the queues haven't really harmed me personally. The ONE reason why I don't, as a retired person, move to the U.S. would be the cost of proper, full medical care. I couldn't afford it, frankly, so, I am restricted to shorted periods in the U.S..

Reply to
sharx35

A Canadian consulting with his doctor.

Canadian: Doc, I have a problem, every 8 o'clock in the morning I take a poop.

Doc: There is nothing wrong with that.

Canadian: But I wake up at 9 o'clock.

Reply to
EdV

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