Ford is buying the 6 speed automatic transmission sold in V6 Fusions from Aisin-Warner, a company mostly owned (and controlled) by Toyota. Toyota buys all its automatic transmissions from A-W (well since they mostly own A-W, I guess they are buying them from themselves). The Fusion 6 speed and the Camry 6 speed are from the same family. Ford also buys parts for the Escape/Mariner hybrid from A-W. But then there nothing new here, at times in the past Ford has even bought hydramatic automatics from GM and sold 3 speed manuals to GM.
Well any privately driven "luxury car", "performance luxury sedan" or not absolutely requires "enough power" to effortlessly go and stop otherwise it cannot be a luxury car.
Ok, isn't that what I meant, or are we not on the same boat?. The ES and and the V6 Camry share the same power train, the difference will be on the luxury items on the Lexus. Its true, "luxury" vehicles have that "get up and go" that you refer to. What would you consider enough power to be? Is a 0-60 mph of 6 or 7 secs is fine and anything higher than that is not enough power, thus less luxurious? Or anything faster than a Corolla is good enough for you. Comparing two luxury cars, would the slower car mean that it would be less luxurious than the other?
Well then you have to change your perception. Lexus ES 0-60 is 6.8 secs (lexus.com) Camry V6 6.5 secs by edmunds.com (6.1 by road and track) Quicker is not more luxurious.
Eye of the beholder... If you can't step on the pedal and ditch some punk in a cheap shitbox Camry who is screwing with you on the open road, you are hardly driving around in a luxury car.
I don't have to change my perception, regardless what Toyota and whoever else wants, I don' consider a Lexus a luxury car. A shitbox Camry with more options does not a luxury car make. The German Opel GT coupe was the "poor man's Corvette" and The Lexus is still the "poor man's luxury car".
The MB E350 have the same 0-60 of the Camry of 6.5 secs. MB is 268Hp Camry is 268Hp. Top speed, I have no idea. No matter what open road, we all abide by the speed limit in the US. The C350 can go from 0-60 in 6.1 secs. Is the C class more luxurious than the E-Class? Oh and the IS350 can do better at 5.3 secs. Is the MB the rich man's luxury car? Then why is it the MB slower. These are numbers and not "eye of the beholder", as you said quicker is more luxurious all thing being equal.
If that is what you feel about the Lexus, its fine with me. Luxury cars have the getup and go, But faster is not necessarily more luxurious.
So now you two are talking about quality. Earlier it was "faster is more luxurious", now quality is more luxurious.
There is no *real quality* German vehicle. All car companies have quality issues at some point. There have been more bad reviews on BMW and Mercedes combined than Lexus. And there are more awards for the Lexus since it was born on 1989.
Best of What's New: Best Car. Lexus LS 400, Popular Science (1989) First Place in luxury sedan comparison test. Lexus LS 400, Car and Driver (December 1989). The Lexus flagship triumphed over competitors from Audi, BMW, Cadillac, Infiniti, Jaguar, and Mercedes-Benz. Best Imported Car of the Year. Lexus LS 400, United States Motoring Press Association (1989) * #1 in Vehicle Dependability. Lexus LS, J.D. Power and Associates Vehicle Dependability Study (1994-2007). The Lexus LS has received this award for 13 consecutive years, more than any other manufacturer. In 2005, J.D. Power's survey found just 90 problems per 100 LS 430 sedans, the first time in the survey's 16 year history for a vehicle to average less than one problem over three years. In following years, the Lexus LS repeated this feat, averaging just 88 and 94 problems per
100 vehicles in 2006 and 2007 respectively, an industry standard.
#1 in Initial Quality. Lexus LS, among large premium cars, J.D. Power and Associates Initial Quality Study (1995-2006). With the fewest number of defects after 90 days of ownership, the LS has achieved the highest overall ranking in initial quality among large premium cars for 10 consecutive years, and among all cars for seven consecutive years. In 2004 and 2005, the Lexus LS 430 was second only to the Lexus SC 430, and in 2006, the LS 430 regained the overall lead.
Highest ranked vehicle in reliability. Lexus LS, Consumer Reports Annual Car Reliability Study (1997-2006). The Lexus LS has been among the most reliable vehicles in Consumer Reports surveys for over a decade. The independent publication determined that a nine-year- old Lexus LS is more dependable than a brand new Mercedes-Benz, owing to the wide disparity in reliability scores between the top-ranked LS and below-average German makes
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, and there aremore for the ES, GS and IS. If I'm not mistaken, Lexus is taking on the acclaimed Mseries BMWs with its F series models which is soon to be released.
I'm not after the rich mans car or semi-rich mans car, all I think its the smarter choice. Lower price is not lesser quality.
Ok I will, This is already going way off the original topic. I drive a
4cyl camry so you get the idea I cant afford any luxury brand. BTW, It has shifting problems... That I have to live with =)
I do not like Lexus in general. I dont single out hating brands. I like the IS over the 3 series but prefer the Audi A5 and BMW 5 series over the ES. Audi and Subaru for the SUV over the X3, X5, including RX and GX. But it wont be easy (understatement) for me to afford those brands, And so I wont be buying the LS for the rest of my life. GS450h remains my practical dream car. What I like about the GS is it has CVT and not the reportedly hit-or-miss 6spd transmission they share with the camry.
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