WSJ Article- GM Prices Have Remained The Same..

Odd place to post further evidence of the gullibility of the public.

The article I read said people saved on average $500 per car. Plus they did not have to negotiate.

This is further evidence of the gullibility of the public. They pretty much went out in droves for a repackaged deal that they could have had in any of the prior several months of '05. They would have just accomplished it with larger rebates and other incentives.

Or to put it another way People are sheep. And a GM at any price is still junk...

Charles My Scooter Addiction

That may be your opinion but it is not that of the majority of new vehicle buyers, according to the latest J D Powers Vehicle Dependability survey of four year old models. Far more buyer chose GM products, at a rate of more than three to one of those that chose Toyotas. GM led in more classes than any other brand and Ford was second. Toyota came in third.

GM also did better in more classes than Toyota in JD Powers recent Initial Quality survey, as well.

mike hunt

Art wrote:

You know how most of these guys think around here. It is the perfect place to post about the gullibility of the public.

Mike will you still be raving about GM quality and market share when they are in bankruptcy? LOL

I'm not raving about anything, simply posting the facts that are available to anybody willing to do the research. GM is by far the largest vehicle manufacture in the world. If the vehicles they build were the junk you guys seem to think they are, they would not be number one and selling MORE vehicles today than any time in their history..

mike hunt

Art wrote:

Re: WSJ Article- GM Prices Have Remained The Same.. Group: alt.autos.toyota Date: Wed, Jul 6, 2005, 4:30pm From: snipped-for-privacy@mailcity.com

-----I'm not raving about anything, simply posting the facts that are available to anybody willing to do the research. GM is by far the largest vehicle manufacture in the world. If the vehicles they build were the junk you guys seem to think they are, they would not be number one and selling MORE vehicles today than any time in their history.. mike hunt ----

They have to keep banging that 'largest vehicle manufacturer in the world' drum because they know the clock is ticking on that one.....Kinda like the way the band kept playing on the sinking Titanic....8>)

I don't believe GM builds "junk" either. Terminology is used loosely now-a-days. Most of the car mfgs build good decent stuff. One would have to have lived in the seventies to know what junk was.

By comparison to the seventies we're in hog heaven. GM will be around for quite a while.

What is that supposed to mean? GM is selling more vehicles today than ever. Their SHARE of the market is indeed down from the 50% the had in the sixties but it is an ever growing market with many more players. Toyotas share is up but they have only around 10% of the market. Toyota advertises they are the number on car BRAND, but GM and Ford sell far more cars. The number one VEHICLE however is not a car, it is the F150. The next five top selling vehicles in the US are trucks, as well. The growth in the market over the past fifteen years is not in cars it is in trucks and GM, Ford, and Dodge individually sell more trucks than Toyota sell cars and tucks combined. Do a little research, WBMA

mike hunt

Charles Pisano wrote:

It appears to be your direction in market share, up or down, that determines how you can price your cars. Being the number 1 automaker and losing money at it is not a good long-term strategy.

Gas is at $2.14/gal today. How long will the top selling vehicles be trucks?

So where does that leave Toyota? Toyota's car line isd a mess. Except for the Prius it is a collection of dull second rate designs. Like GM and Ford they have poured far too much money into trucks and SUVs (at least in the US). If the truck market crashes do you really think Toyota won't suffer (again, I am alking US market)?

Ed

Don't you do any research before you chose to post on a subject or do you just like to express your opinion? I have no interest in opinions since we are all entitled our own. GM lost money in one quarter, because it introduced so many new models, not because of poor sales.

Toyota advertises that it offers NINE models that get 30 or more MPG. GM offers NINEteen, more than twice as many.

In the eighties trucks accounted for around 30% of sales in the US and gas was much less expensive than at any time all through the years that the ratio of trucks to cars grew to 55%. Toyota also grew it truck availability for the same reason, that was were the growth was. Toyota truck sales are only a blip on the sales carts however.

mike hunt

dh wrote:

GM and Ford have been designing new car models over the past five years. Since 2004 GM has twelve new car models on the market or coming to the market. Ford has replaced two models, the Taurus and Sable, with four. The 500, Montego, Fusion and Milan while adding the Freestyle and Zephyr. In the mid nineties ALL manufacture were putting their design money in to trucks. That was were the growth was. GM, Ford, Dodge, Toyota and Nissan all introduced new, better, larger trucks. GM, Ford and Dodge trucks dominate the market. The rest are 'also rans.' Honda was so far behind the curve on the demand for trucks they had to make a truck out of their van just to get a truck on the market.. The Ridgeline is selling about as well as did the Toyota T100, a couple every week.... down at the vehicle auctions ;)

mike hunt

"C. E. White" wrote:

But we all get to express them, regardless of your desires otherwise.

GM = TWELVE divisions...TWELVE!

Toyota = THREE (assuming the numbers you refer to include Lexus and Scion sales.)

How many Chevys get >30mpg? How many Pontiacs?

HUMMERS?!? ROFL

AND, with many of us stuck in bumper to bumper traffic, or otherwise running around IN TOWN, why aren't we hearing boasts of who has the best CITY MILAGE !?

...

When you're right, you're right.

------------------------------------------------ The DNC - Building a bridge to the 20th Century.

Just as I suspected, you want to present your opinion, indeed you are entitled to that. I thought we were discussing the facts abort who sell what in the US, not expressing personal opinions. I did not offer my opinion of GM or Toyota, I do not currently own vehicles sold by either of them. Our personal opinions will not change the facts that I posted, in any event.

mike hunt

n>

Don't you do any research before you chose to post on a subject or do you just like to express your opinion? I have no interest in opinions since we are all entitled our own. GM lost money in one quarter, because it introduced so many new models, not because of poor sales.

Toyota advertises that it offers NINE models that get 30 or more MPG. GM offers NINEteen, more than twice as many.

In the eighties trucks accounted for around 30% of sales in the US and gas was much less expensive than at any time all through the years that the ratio of trucks to cars grew to 55%. Toyota also grew it truck availability for the same reason, that was were the growth was. Toyota truck sales are only a blip on the sales carts however.

mike hunt

oooh, insightful, ain't we?

You guys were... I just interjected a comment about you and other people expressing there opinions and how it seems to bug you to the point of trying to tell them no one cares :-o

Since you thought so highly of these "facts" that you decided to repeat them, I'll repeat my *fact*:

GM = TWELVE divisions Toyota = Three (and only if you include Lexus and Scion)

Looks like GM is slackin off ;-)

GM is actually making a few(5-6 models to be exact) really nice cars. It's Ford and Chrysler that you have to run away from.

Take a look at the reliability ratings at the JD Powers site. GM is respectable. So is Toyota. (anything over 200 is unacceptable - that's 2 problems for every new car)

Ouch. $2.69 here in Los Angeles.