Re: Toyota Corolla May Be Recalled over Steering Problem

So isn't the same true for Fords?

I don't think the problem is that the brakes can't stop the car. I think the problem is that a sudden change in engine speed at an unexpected moment can lead to an accident. Sort of like a barking dog who startles someone who then slips and falls off a roof. The dog bark didn't push the guy off the roof, but it did set off a chain of events that led to an accident.

Ed

Reply to
C. E. White
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"C. E. White" wrote in news:hm10jv$l11$1 @news.eternal-september.org:

The argument is not mine; it is AP's.

The CA incident also involved floor mats that were 1) unsecured, and 2) wrong for the vehicle.

The previous driver of the car in the CA incident had reported a stuck pedal to the dealership's receptionist when he returned the vehicle. This driver did what the cop did not do: He simply held the pedal down until the car stopped, then used the toe of his shoe to pull the pedal back up again to stop the engine from overrevving. If anybody's at fault for the CA incident, it's the dealership, which appears to have been astonishingly negligent in their failure to deal with some very important information related by the previous driver.

You don't need people to tell you what happened; you can use proxy evidence.

For example, the sole purpose of police and insurance crash- investigation teams, or of arson squads, is to reconstruct an incident and determine the cause of it. They're remarkably accurate.

That is the allegation, yes. And a big chunk are statistically extremely likely to be simple driver error.

Reply to
Tegger

Right, but don't you think vehicle behavior that increases the likelyhood of a driver error causing an accident is a defect? The whole arguement against SUVs put forth by some was that they were defective becasue they were more likely to roll if a driver made a mistake. It is hard to draw a line between dangerous characteristics that can be rightly called a defect and ones that can be written off as "driveability" issues. I can buy slow to respond throttles as a drivability issue (anyone who drove an Autin-Healey Sprite understands slow to respond throttles). A stuck accelerator pedal or a vehicle that suddenly accelerates for undetermined reasons is over the line.

I think Toyota realized there were UA "concerns" in 2007 (or before). Maybe the people in charge at Toyota truly believed these were merely "drivability issues" and therefore felt justified in dismissing them. I can sort of excuse Toyotas for this, assuming the former NHTSA employees working for Toyota didn't use undo influence to get the investigations closed. I do think NHTSA was wrong to so easily close the investigations. I also think the people in the Toyota governement relations group were idiots for preparing a PowerPoint Presentation that claimed credit for squashing the investigations.

Just to satisfy the doemstic vehcile haters - I understand millions and millions of domestic vehicle have been recalled for defects. I can't see how this excuses Toyota. And I don't think this is an isolated incident. This is not the first "concern" Toyota has tried to sweep under the rug. It is part of the Toyota industrial culture. I understand this and it has not stopped me from recommending some Toyota vehicles to family members. I have not been particualrly worried about UA when I drive a Toyota. And I have told my freinds and family that I wouldn't worry - just don't panic.

Maybe NHTSA should have Toyota send out a sticker. Something like:

IMPORTANT SAFETY PRECAUTION

Before starting the car, you should always :

1) make sure the gear selector lever is engaged in Park 2) set the parking brake fully 3) make sure your seat belt is fastened. Unexpected and possibly sudden vehicle movement may occur if these precautions are not taken.

If you experience a sudden unintended vehicle acceleration even you should:

1) press firmly on the brake 2) move the shift control to neutral 3) ss the vehicle slows pull off the road 4) call you personal injury lawyer and sue somebody

Refer to your owners manual. for other important safety information.

Ed

Reply to
C. E. White

In message , C. E. White writes

You really are a basket case. You've been told ,I can't count just how many times, that the average Japanese person wants a car smaller than two litres and no one in America makes one. I've pointed out to you that it's illegal to own a car in Japan unless you own a parking space, what's more others have pointed out that fuel is about five times the cost it is in the US. You're just plain thick, or as someone from your side of the pond put it "Stoooooopid.

Reply to
Clive

In message , C. E. White writes

My Toyota's cruise control can either be switched of at the steering wheel or by just touching either the brake or clutch peddles. A woman on American TV today testified that her Lexus just accelerated away, despite which gear she used, including neutral, reverse and park, either she's lying through her teeth or the car had a very weird AT.

Reply to
Clive

and somebody cut her brake lines, wired the ignition to short on, disabled both tranny and brake safety switches...

Then undid all the damage including replacing the brake lines and lost fluid on the wrecked car while nobody was looking.

No way it could be a fool confusing the pedals like all those cases of unintended acceleration on audis before audi put in the interlock.

Reply to
AZ Nomad

So far, EVERYTHING about Toyota is an 'opinion piece' without anything pointing one way or the other.

Reply to
Hachiroku

I guess you didn't see where I said if Toyota comes up with a mea culpa, and doesn't do something about it then it's time to go shopping for another car.

At least one that's closer than 2,500 miles away.

Reply to
Hachiroku

I'm biding my time. The Ford thing is a Done Deal. I want to see if Toyota starts backpedaling...

and if I get a recall on my Scion...

Here's a surprise for you all...my '05 Scion is NOT as well made as my previous Toyotas. Don't breath on the sheet metal...

Reply to
Hachiroku

What year is it?

One thing I've noticed, and I don't like, is that it doesn't self cancel once you've gone below ~35 MPH like the told ones did. If you had it set for 70MPH on the highway, (er, Motorway...) and go into town, if you were to hit the lever accidently, it's off to the races. I wonder how many incidents of UA were caused by this?

Reply to
Hachiroku

Tell that to all the dead Toyota victims.

Reply to
Ashton Crusher

In message , =?iso-2022-jp?q?Hachiroku_=1B$B%O%A%m%=2F=1B=28B?= writes

Not on my car, the cruise control will not function under 27 miles per hour and if engaged whilst driving keeps the speed of that engagement not any previous one.

Reply to
Clive

In message , Ashton Crusher writes

Of which the NHTSA will only confirm 5.

Reply to
Clive

Go find one. It's a little tough after trying to avoid the 3000 highway victims every month to find one of those toyota victims.

Reply to
AZ Nomad

That's easy:

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Reply to
AMuzi

And what caused their accidents?

One guy even had enough time to call 911, but couldn't get the car into neutral or turn off the engine?

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Reply to
Hachiroku

Blame the light bulb company:

Electric Bathtub Blues

1994 Darwin Award Nominee Confirmed True by Darwin (11 March 1978, France) The singer Claude Francois, whose stellar career can be compared to that of Elvis Presley, popularized rock and roll music in France. One evening, he returned to his Paris apartment from a busy touring schedule, and ran a bath. While standing in the filled tub, he noticed a light bulb that wasn't straight, tried to straighten it... and was electrocuted.
Reply to
Hachiroku

Really. Ask them what happened.

Funny how NO ONE has produced data from the ECUs yet, and yet they point the finger.

Asshats.

Am I saying Toyota is NOT at fault? I don't think I ever have. I'm saying the people did not RESPOND TO THE SITUATION CORRECTLY. Like the woman in Congress who said "God stopped the car" after she couldn't.

There is an OFF button on the dashboard. It takes three seconds.

Reply to
Hachiroku

Too bad they didn't move to NH first, and THEN sell the car. A lot closer.

I had one of those with Fred Flinstone floorboards. It was a FUN car, but needed more repair than I knew how to do back then.

Reply to
Hachiroku

Hey! You just made me realize something! There WAS a GM car I liked! The Corvair, the 1964 Nova we had, and a 1974 Nova I had until gas hit 75 cents a gallon...then it was back to Toyota...

Reply to
Hachiroku

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