6 years ago, I had a new 1600 engine put in my 66 after my original 1300 began losing oil pressure. It's a brazillian engine and I noticed today while removing the heat exchangers that there was no thermostat. I live in California, so it doesn't get that cold out here, but is there a way to get a thermostat installed in these engines. Just doesn't make any sense why there would be no thermostat.
...................After six years in a mild climate, I'd leave it alone and start saving for the next engine. Just be sure that the next one has the flaps, thermostat & tin that are OEM and functioning properly. I'd stay away from vendors and engine builders who don't think that thermostatically controlled flaps are necessary.
I've heard all the arguments but I don't use them myself and have never missed them. I could go on but my advice is to "forget it". If VW of Brazil didn"t need it, you won"t either.
well then those living in brazil should not worry about it, but everyone living where they *did* come from the factory equipped with a thermostat and flaps should "worry" about it...
------------------- Chris Perdue
*All opinions are those of the author of this post* "Sometimes you're the windshield, sometimes you're the bug"
I did extensive research on using Thermostat and flap. First of all the Brazilian engines were running Fuel Injection. The computerized FI will properly warm up the engine. The same for the later model air cooled Porsches. On T-1 carb engine it tests are on the side for using them as to not using them. If you live in a warm climate all the time, you are running a basic stock engine, it should warm up fine. But even with thermo removed you should still have the flaps for cooling. Don't think the Germans forgot what happens once the flaps open. The flaps now have to direct the air to the right places to be the most effective. Like in 90 f plus temps. Not blow it all over the place. My engine designs all use thermos. Due to the fact I run T-4 engines in T-1 cars, the engine is hardly working so it needs a lot of help warming up. In temps below 40f my engine will never get over 120f oil temp without a thermo. Not good for engine life and gas mileage and the car will run rough.
By the way the guy that did not have a thermo, did you have flaps and if so were they open? I would think if it came from the factory without a thermo, they would have something directing the air. This is a learning lesson for me also.
I had no flaps at all. I have the stud on the case, so I can put a thermostat on there. Anybody know if they still sell the flaps, thermo and connecting rod anywhere?
John ain't the only guy who's found parts missing. Whilst under the Wonderbus yesterday, installing new heater boxes, I was studying all them metal protuberances and plumbing fixtures and pipes and wires and stuff, slowly becoming more familiar with all the stuff under and around the engine. I had, in one hand, the article from a recent VW Trends magazine which described the cooling bits (only a superficial article, I could use more information) and I was in the process of seeing if my thermostat was in operating condition when I discovered that I don't have one. Or the bracket. Or, near as I can tell, any of the linkage.
I did see that I am missing the bottom covers that go under the cylinders. I suppose I should order some? I live in southern California, where the winters are mild but 90 - 100 degrees (F) summers are not uncommon.
And the flaps: I'm not even sure where the darn flaps are supposed to be
-- can some kind soul point me to some good pictures? Are they visible when the engine is in the bus?
I disagree with your statement. I have driven a lot of brazilian made beetles and none had FI. They ceased production en the early nineties or late eighties, and the first brazilian card with FI were produced around 1998.
You may be refering to Mexican beetles, which had FI from the early nineties.... I don't know if they had thermostat either.
Anyway, a Brazilian beetle driven where temps go anywhere below 20oC never, ever gets warm enough for decent heater output except on the highway. Plugs are always wet with oil, and oil is never hot enough to get the dipstick hot.
Frankly I have not been real impressed. I had them do one job for me, installing the dual carbs, and they sent me home with a coil that fell out of its clamp on the way home, and a fuel line to the right carb so loose it was spraying fuel.
I'm going to see how they set up the timing tomorrow. If I can figure out the cryptic notches and dimples on the crank pulley.
That's very useful! Thank you! I'll do some more poking around my tin.
One thing that has always puzzled me. There are two ducts or hoses that take the air from the shroud on down to the heater boxes. On my shroud, the opening on the portside (left when facing forward) points straight sideways, not down/rearward like the starboard opening. There is a very poor picture at
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. The top picture. It's crooked, you need to put your right ear on your right shoulder to straighten things out. But if you look for a minute, you will see an odd protuberance that the air duct attaches to. It does not look like any of the photos I've seen of the shroud.
Not sure I'm seeing what you are describing. Are you saying that the "nozzle" on the shroud for the left-side air pipe is not the same as the one on the right?
Well JS the fact you don't have the flaps is logical. Some guys that don't use thermostats wire the flaps open. Because if you don't have a thermostat then the flaps will be closed and the engine will overheat and blow for sure. Seeing the engine is Brazilian and you do not have a thermo or flaps then I can assure the fanhousing came from the factory that way and the air is being directed correctly. Where I live in NY the thermo is a must have. Once I built an engine and for weeks tried to find out why it ran so bad. Well it was never reaching running temp. Another thing to note, engines earlier then 1972 run an 80c thermostat, while later engines run 90 c . The later cars had larger fans and need more time to warm up.
no offense steve, but it is clear you are one of the 90% of vw owners that just does not understand the cooling system on the cars we love...i went the "no thermo, no flaps" route for years because that is what i was told to do...i can tell you from experience that cracked heads are a way of life when you run without the flaps and thermo....especially in the cooler weather...(my winters usually yield temps from teens to 40's).....the vw engine *relies* on thermal expansion and heads tend to crack when being blasted with below freezing temps on the outside and the heat from combustion on the inside...inside expanding, outside not, equals cracks....overheated heads in the summer due to the engines cooling air taking the "path of least resistance"....the path of least resistance is the cylinders(aka jugs) which need much *less* cooling air than the head which has the brunt of the heat from combustion....but hey, i learned the hard(read: expensive) way, so i guess others can too....
------------------- Chris Perdue
*All opinions are those of the author of this post* "Sometimes you're the windshield, sometimes you're the bug"
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