Advice on XC models please

Can the 2.4L motor be 'tweaked' to give it the power of the new 2.5L motor, or are there substantial differences between the two?

Thanks,

Jim Kelly

you may be hard pressed to beat the performance of your 850t wagon...when moving into the newer volvos...a number of volvo folks i chat with will swear by the 93-97 850t wagons for many reasons...performance, handeling, etc...if you have under 500k miles on it...you may want to consider keeping it and mod whatever you are not satisified with...unless you are just "tired" of it...then look @ the new s70r's...they look sweeeeettttt.........imho...

Perhaps so! My mechanic has alerted me to the fact that the resale value will soon drop as it goes over 200,000km (125,000miles) and that repairs may be immanent due to age and the turbo . .

The one thing that annoys me is the tailgate latch is worn and allows the tailgate to move alot, with much rattling under some conditions . . . apparently hard (or expensive?) to replace.

The suspension is too low for comfort (perhaps it has sagged?), but may be there is a way to lift the rear end a bit to clear driveways, etc? It is also very skittish on roads with loose surfaces (not often encountered and letting pressure out definitely helps).

But if 500,000 miles (800,000kms is reasonable, let's get it fixed!!)

Cheers all,

Jim Kelly.

The '93 had a bad automatic transmission. Bad year. By '94 the transmission problem was solved. However a nagging problems with the electrical system remained. Also, warped brake rotors were common.

The '98 S70/V70/C70 was basically a cosmetic uplift to the 850 model a little more power, and safety. The electrical problems persisted.

The new '99 S80 is a larger more luxurious vehicle.

In 1999, AWD debuts in the S70, V70 and C70.

In 2000, the V70XC became the only AWD model.

The '01 S60 was Volvo's new sedan that took the place of the discontinued S70 Sedan. Old problems are solved and no new ones appear.

The '01 S80 was an all new luxurious vehicle.

The '01 V70/V70XC shares its platform with the S80, Volvo's top-of-the-line sedan. As a result, the new V70 is slightly shorter than the 2000 model, but it has a longer wheelbase, wider front and rear tracks, and about 2 more inches of width and height.

Thanks Steve . . a great summary!

Jim

| The '01 V70/V70XC shares its platform with the S80, Volvo's | top-of-the-line sedan. As a result, the new V70 is slightly shorter than | the 2000 model, but it has a longer wheelbase, wider front and rear | tracks, and about 2 more inches of width and height. | | -- | Pardon my spam deterrent; send email to snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.net | Cheers, Steve Henning in Reading, PA, USA | Owned '67,'68,'71,'74,'79,'81,'87,'93,'95 & '02 Volvos. | The '67,'74,'79,'87,'95 and '02 through European Delivery. |

The one problem with earlier XCs (up to about 2002?) is the use of a viscous coupling rather than Haldex four wheel drive, so all four tyres have to be kept within a tight wear tolerance of each other or the transmission gets damaged.

This is not a problem, but a characteristic. All Subarus and most other makes used the same system. I have driven cars with this system since

1990. What happens is that if there is more tread in the front or larger tire in the front than in the rear the transmission will surge, that is a transfer of power from the front to the back in a pulsing manner. The viscous AWD units are very sensative but this characteristic is very noticeable. The solution is to rotate the tires. The pulsing goes away when the tires are rotated. I never heard of anyone letting it go to the point where it damaged anything, but that doesn't say it can't or didn't happen. The transmissions may have had some other issue that permitted this to end up as a problem.

It doesn't happen very often. It took my dealer several weeks to figure it out on my '90 Subaru. It is an insidioius characteristic since it is "normal" to always put the best tires in the front since that is where most wear occurs on AWD cars. However, you have to rotate tires frequently so that there is not much of a diameter difference. I have the dealer rotate my Pirelli Scorpions if appropriate every time I go in for 10,000 mile service and I never see this characteristic on my '01 XC. The Scorpions wear fairly evenly, front and rear.

Steve (and others),

Since you own a '2001' xc I wonder if you can clarify the differences around that era (I suspect that there is confusion as Volvo may have released new versions at different times around the world leading to apparently miss-information in reviews/opinions etc).

Did all of the new 'good' things happen at once as the model changed from the 'old 850' shape to the 'new' shape with the bulging hips and the 'frown' look in the side doors? eg Haldex AWD, 244T3 2.4L motor, 5 speed auto with 'manual' override.

Another way of putting it: if we avoid the 'old shape' are there any early models to avoid if we want the features and reliability of the current xc70 (except the 2.5L motor which is only in the last year or so). As far as I can tell, little has changed in the

2002>2003>2004 transitions, but did this extend right back to the beginning of the new shape?

Cheers,

Jim Kelly.

"Stephen M. Henning" wrote in message news: snipped-for-privacy@news05.west.earthlink.net... | Conrad Edwards wrote: | | > The one problem with earlier XCs (up to about 2002?) is the use of a | > viscous coupling rather than Haldex four wheel drive, so all four | > tyres have to be kept within a tight wear tolerance of each other or | > the transmission gets damaged. | | This is not a problem, but a characteristic. All Subarus and most other | makes used the same system. I have driven cars with this system since | 1990. What happens is that if there is more tread in the front or | larger tire in the front than in the rear the transmission will surge, | that is a transfer of power from the front to the back in a pulsing | manner. The viscous AWD units are very sensative but this characteristic | is very noticeable. The solution is to rotate the tires. The pulsing | goes away when the tires are rotated. I never heard of anyone letting | it go to the point where it damaged anything, but that doesn't say it | can't or didn't happen. The transmissions may have had some other issue | that permitted this to end up as a problem. | | It doesn't happen very often. It took my dealer several weeks to figure | it out on my '90 Subaru. It is an insidioius characteristic since it is | "normal" to always put the best tires in the front since that is where | most wear occurs on AWD cars. However, you have to rotate tires | frequently so that there is not much of a diameter difference. I have | the dealer rotate my Pirelli Scorpions if appropriate every time I go in | for 10,000 mile service and I never see this characteristic on my '01 | XC. The Scorpions wear fairly evenly, front and rear. | | -- | Pardon my spam deterrent; send email to snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.net | Cheers, Steve Henning in Reading, PA, USA | Owned '67,'68,'71,'74,'79,'81,'87,'93,'95 & '02 Volvos. | The '67,'74,'79,'87,'95 and '02 through European Delivery. |

NO. The change from 850 to V70 was cosmetic mostly but did resolve the brake problems.

The 2001 V70 was a major redisign on the S80 platform and resolved the electrical problems that had persisted from '93. It had the 'geartronic transmission' available as an option. That is your 5 speed auto/manual.

The 2002 V70 T5 AWD got Dynamic Stability and Traction Control (DSTC) which included the Haldex system.

All 2003 V70 AWDs got the Haldex. All my experience is with the USA versions. The engines depend upon your country.

Yep, just found out . . . looked at a '2001' "v70 xc awd" model (with build date June 2000 grrr!!) new shape but non geartronix (Japanese) gearbox, still missing 2nd gear (I hate that in my

850-T5 - having to ride the brakes coming down hills stinks). Manual seats, boring single-cd audio unit (still standard I believe). Couldn't find any reason to move from my 850-T5!!

Steve, your notes below seem to relate to the v70. Do they apply to the XC too? Maybe I should be looking at the non XC too?

Over and out for a few days.

Happy Christmas all.

Jim

| NO. The change from 850 to V70 was cosmetic mostly but did resolve the | brake problems. | | The 2001 V70 was a major redisign on the S80 platform and resolved the | electrical problems that had persisted from '93. It had the 'geartronic | transmission' available as an option. That is your 5 speed auto/manual. | | The 2002 V70 T5 AWD got Dynamic Stability and Traction Control (DSTC) | which included the Haldex system. | | All 2003 V70 AWDs got the Haldex. | | All my experience is with the USA versions. The engines depend upon | your country. | | > Another way of putting it: if we avoid the 'old shape' are there any | > early models to avoid if we want the features and reliability of the | > current xc70 (except the 2.5L motor which is only in the last year | > or so). As far as I can tell, little has changed in the | > 2002>2003>2004 transitions, but did this extend right back to the | > beginning of the new shape? | | -- | Pardon my spam deterrent; send email to snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.net | Cheers, Steve Henning in Reading, PA, USA | Owned '67,'68,'71,'74,'79,'81,'87,'93,'95 & '02 Volvos. | The '67,'74,'79,'87,'95 and '02 through European Delivery. |

Yes the V70 XC. I just saw a 2003 V90 XC and it had geartronic, DSTC, and haldex.

Sorry Stephen, but the 2001 V70 is based on the S60 chassis not the S80.

Cheers, Peter.

: The 2001 V70 was a major redisign on the S80 platform and resolved the : electrical problems that had persisted from '93. It had the 'geartronic : transmission' available as an option. That is your 5 speed auto/manual.

That is not what Edmunds, Kelley, and Volvo say. Also check:

"The new 2001 Volvo V70 wagon uses the exterior styling, platform and suspension of the S80 sedan, but offers two turbocharged five cylinder engines instead of the six cylinder engines offered in the S80." ...and: "The [2001] V70 is build on the S80 platform ..." ...and: "2001 Volvo V70 Cross Country ... now sports the broad-shouldered look first seen on the S80 sedan. It also shares the S80's platform. A taller ride height that gives the Cross country a substantial 8.2 inches of ground clearance, distinguish the all-road Cross Country from its V70 wagon counterpart."

...and:

"The [2001] V70 wagon now rides on a slightly downsized S80 platform, providing more refinement in the body shell and suspension." However the S60 is also based on the S80 platorm:

"While the S60 is based on the S80 platform (albeit 280 mm shorter overall and 75 mm shorter between axles) it also shares some elements with the V70. For example, front track is the same as the wagon¹s while rear track is as per the S80. Brakes and suspension are from the flagship sedan. To all intents and purposes, Volvo has made three cars ­ S60, V70 and S80 ­ on the same platform but succeeded in giving each a clear visual identity and completely different driving feel."

As you quoted Stephen "While the S60 is based on the S80 platform (albeit 280 mm shorter overall and 75 mm shorter between axles). This means that the S60 platform is dimensionally smaller than the S80 platform from which it is derived. You also quote the similarities with the V70 of the S60 dimensions. The V70 is the same width, wheelbase and height as the S60 as far as the main passenger area is concerned. Volvo may say that the S60 and V70 are based on the S80 chassis but anybody can tell that the S80 is quite a bit larger than the other two. If you still do not believe me then go measure.

Cheers, Peter.

"Stephen M. Henning" wrote in message news: snipped-for-privacy@news06.west.earthlink.net... : "Peter Milnes" wrote: : : > Sorry Stephen, but the 2001 V70 is based on the S60 chassis not the S80. : : That is not what Edmunds, Kelley, and Volvo say. Also check: : :

"The new 2001 Volvo V70 wagon uses the exterior styling, platform and: suspension of the S80 sedan, but offers two turbocharged five cylinder: engines instead of the six cylinder engines offered in the S80.": : ...and: "The [2001] V70 is build on the S80 platform ...": : ...and: "2001 Volvo V70 Cross Country ... now sports the broad-shouldered look: first seen on the S80 sedan. It also shares the S80's platform. A taller: ride height that gives the Cross country a substantial 8.2 inches of: ground clearance, distinguish the all-road Cross Country from its V70: wagon counterpart.": : ...and: "The [2001] V70 wagon now rides on a slightly downsized S80 platform,: providing more refinement in the body shell and suspension.": : However the S60 is also based on the S80 platorm: : : : "While the S60 is based on the S80 platform (albeit 280 mm shorter : overall and 75 mm shorter between axles) it also shares some elements : with the V70. For example, front track is the same as the wagon¹s while : rear track is as per the S80. Brakes and suspension are from the : flagship sedan. To all intents and purposes, Volvo has made three cars ­ : S60, V70 and S80 ­ on the same platform but succeeded in giving each a : clear visual identity and completely different driving feel." : : -- : Pardon my spam deterrent; send email to snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.net : Cheers, Steve Henning in Reading, PA, USA : Owned '67,'68,'71,'74,'79,'81,'87,'93,'95 & '02 Volvos. : The '67,'74,'79,'87,'95 and '02 through European Delivery. :

(actually the current model of the S60 is 254.0 mm shorter overall and has a 76.2 mm shorter wheelbase than the V70)

(actually the current model of the V70 is 127.0 mm longer overall and has a 50.8 mm longer wheelbase than the S60)

I did using the official Volvo numbers and it is not so:

In overall length the V70 is midway between the S60 and S80. In wheelbase, the V70 is closer to the S80 than the S60. In width, the V70 and S60 are the same. In height, the V70 is tallest.

The term chassis hasn't applied to Volvos for many years. Volvo uses the term platform which is the design term used with unichassis vehicles. Here are the official measurements. They don't tell the history of the car's design which is what we were discussing, but show the miniscule difference between these models.

2004 S80: Length 189.80 in | 4826.0 mm. | 4.8 m. Width 72.10 in | 1828.8 mm. | 1.8 m. Height 57.20 in | 1447.8 mm. | 1.4 m. Wheelbase 109.90 in | 2794.0 mm. | 2.8 m. Since 1996 the only dimension that has changed is the height, it was 56.5 in 1996.

2004 V70: Length 185.40 in | 4699.0 mm. | 4.7 m. Width 71.00 in | 1803.4 mm. | 1.8 m. Height 57.70 in | 1473.2 mm. | 1.5 m. Wheelbase 108.50 in | 2768.6 mm. | 2.8 m. Since 1999 the dimensions have not changed.

2004 S60: Length 180.20 in | 4572.0 mm. | 4.6 m. Width 71.00 in | 1803.4 mm. | 1.8 m. Height 56.20 in | 1422.4 mm. | 1.4 m. Wheelbase 107.00 in | 2717.8 mm. | 2.7 m. Since 2000 the dimensions have not changed.

The V70 was designed after the S80 and before the S60, hence it could have never been based upon the S60.

The V70 Mkll was a retrograde update after the S60 entered the new car stakes. The earlier V70 was based on the 850 estate an entirely different vehicle, although current with the first S60s..

Cheers, Peter.

"Stephen M. Henning" wrote in message news: snipped-for-privacy@news05.west.earthlink.net... : "Peter Milnes" wrote: : : > As you quoted Stephen "While the S60 is based on the S80 platform (albeit : > 280 mm shorter overall and 75 mm shorter between axles). : (actually the current model of the S60 is 254.0 mm shorter overall and : has a 76.2 mm shorter wheelbase than the V70) : : > The V70 is the same width, wheelbase and height as the S60. : (actually the current model of the V70 is 127.0 mm longer overall and : has a 50.8 mm longer wheelbase than the S60) : : > Volvo may say that the S60 and V70 are based on the S80 chassis but : > anybody can tell that the S80 is quite a bit larger than the : > other two. If you still do not believe me then go measure. : : I did using the official Volvo numbers and it is not so: : : In overall length the V70 is midway between the S60 and S80. In : wheelbase, the V70 is closer to the S80 than the S60. In width, the V70 : and S60 are the same. In height, the V70 is tallest. : : The term chassis hasn't applied to Volvos for many years. Volvo uses : the term platform which is the design term used with unichassis : vehicles. Here are the official measurements. They don't tell the : history of the car's design which is what we were discussing, but show : the miniscule difference between these models. : : 2004 S80: : Length 189.80 in | 4826.0 mm. | 4.8 m. : Width 72.10 in | 1828.8 mm. | 1.8 m. : Height 57.20 in | 1447.8 mm. | 1.4 m. : Wheelbase 109.90 in | 2794.0 mm. | 2.8 m. : Since 1996 the only dimension that has changed is the height, it was : 56.5 in 1996. : : 2004 V70: : Length 185.40 in | 4699.0 mm. | 4.7 m. : Width 71.00 in | 1803.4 mm. | 1.8 m. : Height 57.70 in | 1473.2 mm. | 1.5 m. : Wheelbase 108.50 in | 2768.6 mm. | 2.8 m. : Since 1999 the dimensions have not changed. : : 2004 S60: : Length 180.20 in | 4572.0 mm. | 4.6 m. : Width 71.00 in | 1803.4 mm. | 1.8 m. : Height 56.20 in | 1422.4 mm. | 1.4 m. : Wheelbase 107.00 in | 2717.8 mm. | 2.7 m. : Since 2000 the dimensions have not changed. : : The V70 was designed after the S80 and before the S60, hence it could : have never been based upon the S60. : : -- : Pardon my spam deterrent; send email to snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.net : Cheers, Steve Henning in Reading, PA, USA : Owned '67,'68,'71,'74,'79,'81,'87,'93,'95 & '02 Volvos. : The '67,'74,'79,'87,'95 and '02 through European Delivery. :

The S80 came out in 1996 and was redesigned in 1999. The V70 came out in 1999 and used the S80 platform. The S60 came out in 2001, the same year the V70 was redesigned and the S60 replaced the S70.

1995 850: Length 183.40 in | 4648.2 mm. | 4.6 m. Width 79.50 in | 2032.0 mm. | 2.0 m. Height 55.10 in | 1397.0 mm. | 1.4 m. Wheelbase 105.10 in | 2667.0 mm. | 2.7 m.

The S80 was never current with the S/V90. This model ceased production in 1998 and the S80 appeared in 1999. If you continue to disagree with what I say then you must just agree to differ and leave it at that.

Cheers, Peter.

"Stephen M. Henning" wrote in message news: snipped-for-privacy@news01.west.earthlink.net... : "Peter Milnes" wrote: : : > The V70 Mkll was a retrograde update after the S60 entered the new car : > stakes. : > The earlier V70 was based on the 850 estate an entirely different vehicle, : > although current with the first S60s.. : : The S80 came out in 1996 and was redesigned in 1999. The V70 came out : in 1999 and used the S80 platform. The S60 came out in 2001, the same : year the V70 was redesigned and the S60 replaced the S70. : : 1995 850: : Length 183.40 in | 4648.2 mm. | 4.6 m. : Width 79.50 in | 2032.0 mm. | 2.0 m. : Height 55.10 in | 1397.0 mm. | 1.4 m. : Wheelbase 105.10 in | 2667.0 mm. | 2.7 m. : > : : > : 2004 S80: : > : Length 189.80 in | 4826.0 mm. | 4.8 m. : > : Width 72.10 in | 1828.8 mm. | 1.8 m. : > : Height 57.20 in | 1447.8 mm. | 1.4 m. : > : Wheelbase 109.90 in | 2794.0 mm. | 2.8 m. : > : Since 1996 the only dimension that has changed is the height, it was : > : 56.5 in 1996. : > : : > : 2004 V70: : > : Length 185.40 in | 4699.0 mm. | 4.7 m. : > : Width 71.00 in | 1803.4 mm. | 1.8 m. : > : Height 57.70 in | 1473.2 mm. | 1.5 m. : > : Wheelbase 108.50 in | 2768.6 mm. | 2.8 m. : > : Since 1999 the dimensions have not changed. : > : : > : 2004 S60: : > : Length 180.20 in | 4572.0 mm. | 4.6 m. : > : Width 71.00 in | 1803.4 mm. | 1.8 m. : > : Height 56.20 in | 1422.4 mm. | 1.4 m. : > : Wheelbase 107.00 in | 2717.8 mm. | 2.7 m. : > : Since 2000 the dimensions have not changed. : > : : > : The V70 was designed after the S80 and before the S60, hence it could : > : have never been based upon the S60. : : -- : Pardon my spam deterrent; send email to snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.net : Cheers, Steve Henning in Reading, PA, USA : Owned '67,'68,'71,'74,'79,'81,'87,'93,'95 & '02 Volvos. : The '67,'74,'79,'87,'95 and '02 through European Delivery. :