freon replacement for '90 Volvo GL? - - help a poor girl

I would check at a local shop to see which refrigerant it really takes. R-12 can be as much as $40.00 a quart the last time that I checked on my old 89 BMW. It should probobly take between 2-4 quarts to recharge you're system. Good luck.

That is correct, it would have been filled with R12 from the factory.

You don't just refill it, unless you like wasting money. You find the source of the leak, fix it, and then look at your A/C charge-up options.

Sure, if you don't mind taking the risk that it's not really R12. Could be propane. Could be natural gas. Either will cause cold-ish air to come out of the vents and turn your car into a time bomb without a "time remaining" display.

Known as "instant compressor death". Volvo offers an R134a retrofit kit for the 240s. It includes not only all the components needed to ensure chemical compatibility so the compressor doesn't die and the system doesn't leak dry in weeks, but also the hard parts to make it worth your while so the less-efficient R134a doesn't reduce this already-weak A/C system's performance to uselessness. I see these kits go by on Ebay fairly often.

Yes -- the $40 kits work to make sure you will shortly have to make much more extensive and expensive system repairs.

DS

Evacuate the system then charge it with 134.You can put 134 in on top of R-12. It still works. At less than $3 a pound you can recharge it many times before you reach the cost of replacing a single O-ring at a shop. If a recharge lasts 2 or 3 months do it that way. If it leaks out in a day or a few weeks then you have what we call a BIG hole. Then you need a repair.

You canNOT. The two refrigerants and their oils do not mix, R12 O-rings do not seal R134a, R12 filter-dryers are not compatible with R134a, and doing this is not only illegal, but also extremely stupid, for it guarantees no shop will touch your A/C system without hefty surcharges -- if they'll touch it at all -- *WHEN* this mix destroys it.

DS

Wow! Now I don't feel so bad about not getting any replies to my two recent posts! Could have gotten one like THAT! ;-)

from Randy & Valerie __ __ \ \ / / \ \/ / \__/olvo 1993 960

It is however fairly easy to convert to R134a using Volvo's kit, I procrastinated for about 2 years with my 740 then finally made the plunge and was amazed how smoothly it went.

I just had mine converted to R134a for $175, which included the cost of the actual Volvo conversion kit. It was actually CHEAPER than having it charged back up with R12, since freon is soooo expensive.

-jeff

Huh? How the hell do you recover the refrigerant when it's all mixed together?

nate

Rod Gray wrote:

Not talking about recovering it Nate. Obviously a lot of people misunderstood the question and the reply. The info was to help those who can't afford an expensive repair right away. At less than $3 a lb. it is cheaper to keep recharging it if it lasts a few months before you have to do it again. The original post was help a poor girl. That was my intention.

Thank you for all your helpful advice. I decided to bite the bullet and get the system serviced and re-filled with R12 if there were not significant leaks.

To my surprise, the service center found no leaks in the system and while worn, still servicable. It was filled with R12 at a firefighter's dicount of $2 an ounce and the total bill was less than $75.

My guess is that the former owner simply never had the system re-filled and the original R12 just slowly leaked out or evaporated.

Thanks again for your kind help.

The local Volvo dealer recently quoted over $500.00 to convert my 740 Turbo to R134a. I was floored! I'd rather sweat like a pig than pay rip-off prices for a simple conversion job. I would like to use the factory approved Volvo kit but can't stomoch this form of daylight robbery the dealer wants to inflict on me. Are there any alternatives?

The kit was less than $100 CDN last time I bought one a couple of years ago. If you have a few wrenches and sockets, you can install all except the drier, then take it to a shop where they can install the drier and evacuate and charge. Or just take the whole kit to the shop and have them do it. This doesn't need to be done at the dealer.

He DID say to evacuate the system first. The incompatable compressor oil is another story though, as would be the o-rings.

He said EVACUATE first.

No refrigerant mixing is involved. But most of the old oil MUST be replaced with the proper type (PAG/Esther?)

The chances of anyone finding out what one does in the privacy of one's own garage is just about zero. (Oh, and I know people who still service A/C the old fashioned way, venting refrigerant to atmosphere. No way am I turning anyone in, for any amount of money.)

Here's what he said:

That's just plain wrong on every single stated fact.

DS

No, THIS is what he said.

"Evacuate the system then charge it with 134.You can put 134 in on top of R-12. It still works. At less than $3 a pound you can recharge it many times before you reach the cost of replacing a single O-ring at a shop. If a recharge lasts 2 or 3 months do it that way. If it leaks out in a day or a few weeks then you have what we call a BIG hole. Then you need a repair."

And he's still wrong. R12 oil (mineral based) is not miscible in R134a as it is in R12. Therefore, the mineral oil is swept by the flow of refrigerant to the lowest point in the system, where it remains. The overwhelmingly usual result is an oil-starved compressor which grinds itself to death, spreading shrapnel through the system and winding up costing the vehicle owner *considerably* more money than an R134a retrofit done correctly or even an expensive charge-up with R12. Furthermore, R134a is a Hydrofluorocarbon. R12 is a Chlorofluorocarbon. Aside from the physiochemical incompatibility between R134a and R12 oil, the reason a complete system flush and oil change is prescribed by *EVERY* automaker -- including the two falsely claimed to condone the "R134a on top of R12" procedure -- is that the "Hydro" part of Hydrofluorocarbon and the "Chloro" part of Chlorofluorocarbon combine to make Hydrochloric Acid, which does a dandy job of eating many metals commonly found in A/C systems, especially aluminum. Most condensers and evaporators are aluminum, as are a great many expansion valves, hardlines, and compressors.

Y'understand?

DS