Awful Customer Service

My 2004 Passat had a vibration when I applied the brakes. I brought it into the dealer. I was informed that the rear rotors were warped - but the rear brakes were still good. I was advised to change the brakes and the rotors as they are considered wear items. At 24,000 miles I was a bit surprised. This is a car driven on country roads and meticulously maintained. I instructed the dealer to go ahead. When I got home I consulted my warranty and as I expected, it says nothing about rotors being wear items. I explained this to the dealer but he would not budge. Needing my car I paid the $500.00 + repair and figured I had a good case with VW customer service. After explaining the situation in full I waited 30 days for a response (several interim phone calls). I received my response Friday. The repair would not be covered under warranty citing "outside influence" as to the cause of the premature failure of the rotors. I asked for a specific explanation of what that meant and of course, I didn't get one. There is no way those rotors should warp while the brakes are still good in normal driving. I've written a letter to Dr. Neumann - Pres. of VWOA. This is definitely the last VW product I'll ever purchase. I've had 6 starting with old Air cooled to the NB and Passat. VW Customer service has gone from good, to bad, to ridiculous. Well designed cars, spotty workmanship, poor service. Just figured I'd rant. David

Reply to
D&LBusch
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I hate to say it, but the dealer is correct and you would likely hear the same story from any dealer, not just VW's. You can save some serious money by having an independent mechanic do the work.

Brakes and in modern cars the rotors are wear items. 24,000 is early but it is going to be impossible to "prove" it was your driving or some sort of malfunction. (An exception to that might be if one side is worn and the other not.) So relax, take a big breath, have it checked by an independent mechanic and see what they say and have your brakes made good. BTW brakes don't seem to last most people as long as they use to.

I have owned 7 cars and I went over 100,000 on each. I have only had to replace brakes on two my 1965 Sunbeam Imp and my 1970 VW Beetle and both were between 80,000 and 100,000 miles. when replaced. I would not be surprised if my current NB will need them sooner, but they all had over 50% left at 30,000 miles.

Reply to
Joseph Meehan

hi, have a 2001 passat, drive it 'normal' 24k sounds early to me. normally you should have the rotors replaced @ 60k. I would suggest you have someone check the adjustments I believe they are adjusted wrong. an independent shop would be good. but dont go to the is 10minute places most of them dont know! when you replace the rotos you shouldalso replace the pads since they run together this way you also avoid having bad pads (or a small stone in them) and messing up the new rotors. remember, if you replace rotor(s) replace the pads and replace both rotos if one is bad / messed up.

the rotos should not be more as 100$ + 50$ for pads total 150-250 should be ok @ an independent place.

good luck

Reply to
Sebastian

I call BS on your dealer's "explanation." It is a known problem with B5.5 Passats(2001 to 2005) that the rear rotors warp prematurely. The ones on my '03 GLS were warped at 19K miles when I bought it used. I did the brakes and rotors myself with aftermarket parts and it cost about $150.

Go to

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and run a search to find that others have experienced this very problem.

Reply to
u_s_s

I call BS on your dealer's "explanation." It is a known problem with B5.5 Passats(2001 to 2005) that the rear rotors warp prematurely. The ones on my '03 GLS were warped at 19K miles when I bought it used. I did the brakes and rotors myself with aftermarket parts and it cost about $150.

Go to

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and run a search to find that others have experienced this very problem.

Reply to
u_s_s

BS or not...it's irrelevant...they won't be under warranty either way.

...as you found (not under warranty).

Pretty much, brakes wear because that's how they stop the car. Unless the rotor does something like crack in half, VW isn't going to cover it.

I'm not saying that the wear caused the warping and that it's acceptable either, but unless the rotor fails, there's not going to be a way around paying out of your own pocket.

The best thing to do here though is not pay dealer prices, do it yourself (or an independent mechanic) and in this case don't use VW OE parts (obviously there's a problem with them).

Reply to
Matt B.

Yes, brakes do stop the car and they do indeed wear. But rotors warping at

20K miles is not normal for most any make or model--except for the Passat. How many street vehicles have you owned where the pads or rotors needed replacement at 20K miles? Even the worst of drivers get 40K or so out of them, even on new vehicles, and it is not unusual to get 60-75K miles out of pads and rotors (I recently did a 2001 Ford Escape at 60K miles and it could have gone another 10K).

If you do a little research, you'll find that many have reported that VW does indeed cover warped rear rotors on a B5.5 Passat under warranty. My point was that this is a known problem with these cars, not caused by the owner/driver, contrary to what the dealer tried to make the OP believe. The OP should push his dealer to cover, and let the dealer know that he/she is aware that this premature failure is not unique to his/her vehicle, but rather that many others have also experienced it. I've used this technique in the past with my VW dealer (I'm on my third VW, BTW) and this has worked for me. For the record, I had a clutch hydraulic cylinder replaced at 26K (just out of warranty) and a heater core replaced at 11 years/ 100K (both of which were common failures for the particular model and the dealer initially denied warranty coverage).

If your dealer will not cover, call VWOA and escalate. Many times they will elect to cover when the dealer does not. You also have the option of a BBB complaint, VW participates in their customer mediation program. Read the manual, it gives you all the pertinent information.

This is something the OP should get experience doing, as he/she will probably need it when the heater core and/or timing belt fails at 50-60K on the car, or the oil pickup cokes up, resulting in a complete engine failure, or the tie rod ends go, etc., etc., etc. Without a little dealer management, you can sink big $$$ into these cars. But you should never accept the dealer's first line of "not covered under warranty." Sometimes it is just enough to tell them to not do the repairs, you're coming to pick up the car.

And BTW, I did not ask VW to cover my rear rotors under warranty, even though I was aware of the problem. I elected to do the brakes all the way around with better quality aftermarket parts (Brembo rotors and Axxis/PBR pads). But believe me, if I had decided to do so, my local dealer would have covered the rear rotor repair under warranty.

Reply to
u_s_s

Reply to
none2u

My understanding is ATE is the OEM pad/rotor combination on B5.5 Passats. . .

Reply to
u_s_s

Are the bearing seats integral with the rear rotors on that car? If so,would you re-use bearings?

Reply to
Tom's VR6

I think this issue has come up before--premature wear on B5,B5.5 cars. I learned from a knowledgable source (dumb term, but that is what he is--had a lot of vw/audi products in his garage and other insider knowledge) that this occurs on those cars (and similar Audis) because of a relatively crappy caliper (pad carrier) design.

We went through two sets of rear pads/disks on our '99 passat wagon

1.8t in less than 50k, where the 2nd time the RR was worn to nothing and the LR looked okay (normal). (I've had quite a few VWs, but only a '95 GTI that also had rear disks, but has no problems with premature wear.) We would also experience a squeak from the rear while driving (even at highway speeds), which would go away with brake or parking brake actuation. There was also a lot of drag--the rear wheels did not spin freely.

The bottom line is corrosion and rust on the pad carriers prevent the pads from moving back out from the disk after actuation. The only remedy is yearly (or more often) cleaning and lubrication of the pad carriers. After several years of dragging brakes they now are fine.

Reply to
Frank

I suspect this problem is due to a manufacturing or assembly problem. A 'warped rotor' is not wear. In the most straightforward case, the wear is caused by a rotor that did not run perfectly true (had some axial runout) when it came from the factory. Also, even if you have an uneven bit of corrosion after you park the car this is only small and should randomly be in a different spot each time you park.

I recommend you try to put this bad episode behind you and if it happens again do your arguing with VWOA before paying the bill or taking the car in. Your case would then be better because a VW dealer did the 1st service.

Also, I just checked online and you can buy the stock parts for the rear brake job for $92.39 Plus shipping. Add about $5 for the grease and anti-squeak chemicals and you are still under $110 for the parts for this brake job. even if you allow the dealer a 100% markup this is $210 for parts. The job is so simple I expect it can be done in under

1hour by an experienced person. You do not touch the bearings when doing the rear brakes unlike some cars. I do not know how the dealer justified $500 unless there were other problems.

BTW, I have a 2001 Passat GLX and just did my rear brakes about two weeks ago at 65k miles. Mine were not 'warped', they had just worn out after 45k miles. They had been replaced by a dealer service at around

20k (due to the pulsing feel) as part of the deal I worked when I bought the car used.

I am undecided about buying another VW. The only thing I will possibly consider is TDI. If they did not have that I would not consider them at all - mostly because I have a 1995 Passat GLX that has not wore well over the years.

my two cents.

D&LBusch wrote:

Reply to
Mark

That has never been the case for me. Rotor pulsing has always developed after a few thousand miles of use.

The biggest causes of rotor warpage are frozen calipers which cause the pads to drag and overheat the rotors, dragging parking brakes which do the same thing, and over-torquing the lug nuts -- or lug screws, in the case of our beloved Vee-Dubs. I also suspect that a lot of the cheap rotors being imported from China nowadays are not made from the best-quality iron, and will warp when they shouldn't.

Reply to
Brian Running

I have a 2002 Passat and have had many problems. At 24k VW should replace the rotors.. Unfortunately, VWoA does NOT stand behind it's product's nor does it care what the dealers try to pull. I really like my Passat but it will be the Last VW I ever own..

Reply to
Stan Dupp

Reply to
Lost In Space/Woodchuck

Brakes are normally only covered for 1yr/24k miles but was surprised to see your dealer & VW didn't help out. Have you asked your dealer they you would like to talk with the area VW rep?

Reply to
Lost In Space/Woodchuck

They USED to stand behind their products, up until about 2-3 years ago. I suspect a focus on the bottom line has resulted in VW looking at ways to save a few bucks, and pulling a fast one on their customers (or saving a bit on materials) is one way they are doing it. VW has the highest manufacturing costs of almost all car manufacturers (strong unions, I guess) so there is really a valid concern as to whether they will exist in the same form 5-10 years out.

it is sad, the B5 Passat generated a lot of positive press towards VW and resulted in new customers outside their usual customer base. But mediocre reliability and erratic dealership service seems to have driven many back to Japanese makes. Given that Audi scores high in customers satisfaction (and their vehicles are very similar to VW), it seems VW only has themselves to blame for lower sales and market share.

BTW, the "new" Passat (which looks like a Camry or a Mazda 6) runs $35-40K in any sort of decent trim. At that price, you're in Infiniti or Acura company, and VW can't keep up on reliability. Upscaled themselves out of the market, I suspect. Thank god Golf and Jetta can still be had for a decent price...

Reply to
u_s_s

No they didn't, they've always been asshats. Remember the A2s and Corrados with the exploding heater cores? I personally know of one Corrado which NHTSA said had been recalled but VWoA flat out refused to cover a heater core replacement on it. They never did redesign the damn thing properly either.

nate

Reply to
Nate Nagel

That's odd -- I took my '85 Jetta in for unrelated service and they went ahead and replaced the heater core free of charge, without my asking. Hell, without my even knowing there was a problem.

Reply to
Brian Running

I guess the point from these two posts is that VW dealer service is somewhat erratic.

Reply to
u_s_s

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