Gas vs. Diesel ???

So, Diesels get better mileage but cost more up front. Also, at least here on Oregon, the cost of Diesel fuel is slightly higher than mid-grade unleaded (but not as high as permium unleaded).

What I'm wondering is, has anyone ever published the arithmetic of either the "Total Cost of Ownership" (i.e., over 'x' number of miles including fuel costs) or the "Cost Per Mile" of VW diesels vs. VW Gas models ?

- FM -

Reply to
Fred Mau
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Diesel is more expensive in the US???

It's 20 cents per litre less right now where I am living in Canada.

68.9-71.9 for diesel depending on the station, and 88.9-91.9 for gas.
Reply to
Rob Guenther

In general diesel averages about the same as unleaded. During the summer it is usually cheaper and during the winter higher. It is about the same as heating oil and out of a gallon of oil, you get a given amount of diesel/heating oil and a given amount of gasoline. Changing the % cost extra.

Prices vary depending on the local tax situation (State in the US).

In addition to your cost of fuel calculation you need to factor in maintenance cost differences. It is hard to get all the numbers right. I suggest that, for me anyway, diesel is a little less expensive and even more so as the cost of fuel goes up. Which is one reason more diesels are being sold in some countries of Europe than Gas fueled cars.

Reply to
Joseph Meehan

As of this writing, in Portland Oregon, at both a Shell station and a 'discount' station near me:

'Regular' Unleaded = $2.29/gal; Mid-grade unleaded and Diesel = $2.39/gal; and Premium = $2.49/gal.

- FM -

Reply to
Fred Mau

Following up on this, I have NO idea why Diesel is more than 'regular' gas. I know enough about refining to know, with a simpler production, that Diesel SHOULD be cheaper than gasoline. But then, I can't explain why gas is the price it is anyway, especially here in Oregon: A year ago, we were generally consistant with the national average, now we're generally 20c/gal higher than the national average.

I'm baffled as to why. There haven't been any major formulation changes since the late '90s (That was the excuse used in summer '00) . There are no major refineries 'down' at the moment (That was the excuse in summer '01) . There is of course the Iraq situation, but we haven't bought any significant amount of oil from Iraq since before Gulf War I in '92 anyway.

- FM -

Reply to
Fred Mau

I just returned to Indiana from Florida. In Cocoa Beach Florida, diesel was about the same price as regular unleaded. In Georgia, diesel was about $.30 cheaper than regular. In Indiana, diesel is about $.25 cheaper. I think the per-gallon tax is the same for gas and diesel in all three states, so I don't know why diesel is more expensive vs gas in Florida than in Georgia or Indiana.

Rob Guenther wrote:

Reply to
kokomoNOSPAMkid

- FM -

If "cracking" processes can be used to get exactly the right amount of gasoline, diesel, heating oil, etc., then gas should be cheaper than diesel, because it takes less crude to make a gallon of gas because it is shorter molecular chains. Since diesel seems to be cheaper most places, that probably means the refineries are configured to make too much diesel, or not enough gasoline relative to demand.

Reply to
kokomoNOSPAMkid

I am a recent purchaser of a Jetta Wagon TDI and haven't figured the exact difference in maintenance costs, but they are definitely higher for the diesel. The TDI requires synthetic oil, the oil filter is more expensive, and you need to drain water from the fuel filter every oil change. Also, the fuel filter is more expensive and probably needs to be replaced more often than on a gas engine. Then there's the timing belt which you DEFINITELY don't want to have break on the diesel, since the belt's breaking will destroy the engine. Still, the saving in fuel with the TDI is enough to way more than cover the extra maintenance, even at the low prices of fuel in the US, and it is just fun to get

45-50 mpg in mixed driving while my friends with 12 mpg SUV's are whining about the price of gas.
Reply to
kokomoNOSPAMkid

The math for me is fairly simple except for the fact that diesel is cheaper than gas now but more expensive in the winter. Where I live diesel is $1.60 Gal US and gas is $1.80 or more. I drive 40,000 miles a year. My car gets 50 mpg. 800 gallons of diesel. If I had the same car with a 2L is would get 30 mpg. 1333 gallons. 1333*1.80=2399

800*1.6=1280 In 40,000 miles the $1,200 premium for the diesel has paid off. I assume maintenace for the two is about the same. You need to do sparkplugs and timeing belt at 100,000 miles for the gas engine. Timing belt for the diesel.

The summer/w>So, Diesels get better mileage but cost more up front. Also, at least here

Jim B.

Reply to
jimbehning

Demand Fred, Demand. Simple economics.

Reply to
Biz

Here in NE Ohio, Diesel tends to be slightly less than unleaded regular

Reply to
Biz

It depends on your local fuel costs.

Calculate the fuel cost per 1000 miles for the VW diesel vs. VW gasoline cars in question. Find the difference. Divide the price difference between the two cars by the difference in fuel costs per 1000 miles to find out how many 1000s of miles the payback is.

That assumes that the insurance costs and other ownership and operating costs are the same, and the diesel option has no resale value gain. Such assumptions may or may not be true in your area.

Reply to
Timothy J. Lee

At the Shell (?) station I usually go to (close to home; 24hrs.) it jumped to 72.9. It's been below 70 since I've been keeping records (I purchased my TDI in May 2003).

I was not pleased.

Reply to
David Magda

snipped-for-privacy@hotmail.com writes: [...]

I tend to be quiet when the subject of gas prices comes up in conversation. :>

Reply to
David Magda

Reply to
Rob Guenther

Diesel hit 80 cents (Canadian) per litre in southern Ontario just before the Iraq invasion in 2003. That was the highest I've seen locally in 25 years of diesel driving...

Actually I am quite pleased. In Kitchener/Waterloo diesel has gone from 66.7 to 72.9 in the last few months. It was 57.9 last summer and fall. In comparison to what has happened to gas prices, it's a laugh! And the higher fuel prices go the better a deal it is driving a diesel.

Reply to
Al Rudderham

Wow! You'll are getting hosed up there. Diesel is 30 to 40 cents cheaper per gallon in Missouri.

Reply to
Numan

Interesting. Here in upstate New York, Diesel is running about 30 cents a gallon cheaper than unleaded regular.

Reply to
Jeff

I had to fill up today. My TDI cost 1.699 per gal. Un leaded regular was 1.899 per gal. at the same discount station. With upper 40's in the city and over 60 mpg on the road, I am not complaining about the price of fuel.

Reply to
Joseph Meehan

But that also means that *more* refining is necessary to produce gasoline than to produce diesel. I would imagine there must be marginal costs involved.

-- Mike Smith

Reply to
Mike Smith

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