You know what is stupid about building the cheap cars with crap
reliability? That's the first impression many young buyers get of a car
company! If you buy a Cobalt when you are 18 and it's a piece of crap
why in the world would you consider GM when you have a little more money
to spend? You are gonna look elsewhere because of the bad experience.
GM doesn't seem to get that.
That expression has been revised. It's now " fool me once, shame on
shame on you. Fool me you can't get fooled again." (I'm a fan of
George Bush, but that was still funny, and embarrassing. I guess the
Who helped with the re-write of the clichι.) :)
Bill of Farmville
(To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
If I were in the market for a large vehicle (minivan or truck) I'd head
straight for domestic dealers. The Japanese haven't mastered those
all-American vehicles. I see *so* many ancient Ford trucks on the road;
sometimes rusty, but still spry. What's really cool is when the owner has
invested in detailing them. Nothing cooler-looking, IMO; especially if it's
yeah. That's right. That's why Honda spent FIVE YEARS selling Odysseys
at list price plus. That's why GM has ABANDONED the minivan market,
period--and told the world so.
Face it: the Americans made their mark selling big, rwd, body-on-frame
vehicles. When it came to changing that, to selling small, efficient,
front-drive vehicles, the Americans fell flat on their faces. Still do.
The Americans turned on the marketing machine to solve their problem:
they convinced stupid people that the "SUV" was the way to go. This
allowed them to continue to build and sell big, rwd, body-on-frame
vehicles that they knew how to build and sell.
That they were selling this to the former station wagon market, and that
they abandoned the station wagon--well, that's the hand they'd rather
you not look at. Just like a magician, they want you to look at the
other hand, the one holding the leather-clad truck.
So Suzy Stupidmom is convinced that she needs a full-size truck with a
built-on cap and leather seats to transport her Precious to daycare.
When the world can no longer support that model, what will the American
They can fuck off and die.
I still see quite a few of them on the road, though hubby swore them off
because they were just too "middle-class" for him, whatever that means. I
think he just doesn't like the cliche.
Right, but the only way to rebound in that market, which is probably most of
the vehicles sold, they simply *have* to think outside those lines.
We never bought into the SUV thing - hubby considered a king-cab type
vehicle, but decided it was just not practical for a then-growing family of
four. He still may get a truck when the kids are out of the house. (he'd go
domestic for that)
Yeah - that was quite a fiasco. Wal-Mart sells the cheapest gas in this
area, and if you buy it with a gift card, you get another 3 cents per gallon
off of the already rock-bottom price (probably because they figure if they
get you in the store to buy the card, you'll pick up something else)
I don't know that it's the moms that bought the big trucks. I seldom see
women driving those. Minivans I see are almost always driven by women.
But Chrysler still dominates it, as it has done since inventing the
segment in 1994.
Horse shit. Don't equate "American" with "Cadillac." The last
body-on-frame Dodge or Plymouth was built in 1959. The last
body-on-frame Chrysler product was the 1967 Imperial, all the others
having transitioned to unibody in '60.
Yeah. Right. That's really funny since both GM and Chrysler had a full
range of front-drives nearly 10 years before toyota quit trying to sell
rear-wheel-drive "economy" cars.
I am not sure what you mean by a full range of FWDs. Oldsmobile sold
the Tornado, a large FWD car starting in 1966 (1966 model) and the "X
Cars" starting in 1980 (1980 models). Chrysler sold the Omni and
Horizons starting in 1978. The "K"cars showed up in 1980 (1981
models). Why are you leaving out Ford? The Fiesta, sold in the US
starting in 1977 (1978 Model) was also FWD. The US Escort was a FWD
car introduced in 1980 (1981 Model). Interestingly, Ford had plans to
do a small FWD car for the US in the early 60's but Lee Iacocca killed
that because he felt it would not sell in the US.
I left out Ford because I couldn't remember when the Esquirt came out (I
don't count the Festiva, it was a pile of junk, and imported from Asia
anyway). But yeah, Ford had the Escort, Taurus/Sable, and Tempo/Topaz by
the mid 80s. That's a compact, a midsize, and a fullsize, or a "full
range" of cars and Toyota really didn't make the jump to FWD until
Actually, I hate FWD in many ways (as Some-O will certainly remind me
;-) but I was challinging the statement above which claimed:
>>>When it came to changing that, to selling small, efficient,
>>>front-drive vehicles, the Americans fell flat on their faces.
I did not say Festiva - I said Fiesta. The Fiesta was from Europe. The
ones sold in the US were assembled in Germany. My sister got a new one
in 1978, and I bought it from her in 1984. I drove it for 3 years. It
was a great little car (the car had around 150k miles when I sold it).
As for the Festiva (they were built by Kia). I never owned one, but
one of my Mother's neighbors does. He drives about 120 miles per day
to and from his job. He has been doing this for years. His Festiva has
over 250,000 miles and has been completely trouble free. I can't see
how it gets the pile of junk rating. Did you have a bad experience
with one? As far as I am concerned it is no where near as good as a
Fiesta, but I think it must be pretty reliable judging by the one I
have knowledge of.
Basically the VW created the minivan in 1950. They didn't call it that, of
course, but the Type 2 is one of the most compact people and cargo carriers
for its size at the time. There were a lot of attempts to copy it, such as
the Fiat Multiplia, but none so successful. They make something called a
Eurovan today, but it's a far cry from the original Microbus.
Charles of Schaumburg
Yep, the first compact pickup. Got taken out in the tarrif 'Chicken Wars'
in the 1950's. VW sold only the Microbus in the US after that, but still
sold the pickup and the rest of the line elsewhere.
Charles of Schaumburg
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