broken halfshaft or diff?

either the diff or a halfshaft on my 2A broke this weekend.

Is it more likely to be a halfshaft or is it possible for anything in the diff to work itself loose and thus stop working properly? i've had a slight overrun/gearchange rattle for a while now (which isnt down to the prop).

It went without any noticeable noise as i was about to reverse up a hill and I'd have expected a bang or something for snapping a halfshaft!

I just all of a sudden lost the ability to go anywhere in reverse in

2wd. According to observers the rear prop was spinning but neither wheel does. Its fine in 4wd.

Strangely after i drove it out of the way in 4wd i tried it in 2wd drive again, and found that i could go forward but not backward. After this i parked up and gave up for the day.

When i next started it I found that it would now not go forward or backward in 2wd, so drove home in 4WD.

How do you work out which halfshaft has gone? I presume that if i just jack up the rear end and then start it and leave it in gear and 2wd nothing should happen as the broken shaft will be getting all the drive?

Reply to
Tom Woods
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On Tue, 21 Mar 2006 21:19:50 +0000, Tom Woods scribbled the following nonsense:

Jack up the left corner, spin the wheel, if the prop turns, the halfshaft is ok, if it doesn't, its shot.

Lower and repeat on RH to double check. If both wheels turn and the prop does not, I would suspect a diff failure.

Reply to
Simon Isaacs

doh! so simple!

Reply to
Tom Woods

You will have to remove the six 3/8" diameter bolts from any side rear shaft and pull it out to have a look. If the first one you remove is ok then take out the other and look at that. If you struggle to pull one out then that is likely to be the broken one as they spread as they break. Usually easy to remove but sometimes I've seen them need a couple of crowbars behind the driving flange to prise out. If the diff was at fault you would probably have heard some horrible noises as you drove it home in 4wd but I've seen them where all the crown wheel securing bolts have either fallen out or broken and they have not made any noises driving home in 4wd. Not uncommon for a 2A gearbox layshaft to break soon after a halfshaft if the Landrover has had some hard use.

HTH Martin

Reply to
Oily

Try Simon's solution first ;-) Erik-Jan.

Reply to
Erik-Jan Geniets

Should a halfshaft make a sound when it goes?. im suspicious of the diff since it lost reverse before forwards..

yep, will definately try simons method first! sounds a bit easier!

it did make a few metallic rattles on the way home in 4wd, but nothing louder than i'd consider normal for a landrover!

turning sharp corners in fwd was also very wierd but i presume that is just the UJ's in the front halfshafts binding - and why they changed to CV's in permenant 4wd cars.

Reply to
Tom Woods

It's also possible you've lost the layshaft at the rear - on the 2a it falls in & out of alignment, first & reverse throw it out immediately, third may give forward movement a little, fourth will give full drive but clatter as the layshaft wobbles about inside the box.

Halfshafts do tend to go with a slight bang, followed by the engine racing as the load is removed. Diff's tend to make lots of noise if anything goes wrong in there. Halfshaft is the most likely to have gone, typically at the diff end so you'd have to remove the diff just to get the broken stub out.

Karen

Reply to
Karen Gallagher

Ive got a series 3 gearbox which is fairly nice and quiet and well behaved.

It made no noticable noise.

I drove down a steep hill and stopped facing downwards resting the front of the landy against a tree! (i dont trust the handbrake), leaving it running while i unloaded the back.

I then got back in and put it in reverse to move away and it just didnt go anywhere when i revved it. I initially thought i'd just knocked the transfer box into neutral or something or hadnt got it in gear.

Reply to
Tom Woods

This is, of course, assuming that the handbrake is not on, the main box is in neutral, front wheel drive is not selected and the broken halfshaft or whatever is not driving through friction as there is no load (or shouldn't be in this situation) on the prop?

If both wheels turn after the left one is lowered to the ground and the right one lifted then it would be a miracle. :-) Now why should no drive to the prop on the left side mean broken halfshaft and no drive to the prop on the right side mean diff failure? If you had a broken halfshaft on one side it wouldn't matter which side you lifted, you wouldn't be any the wiser as the one with the intact halfshaft would just turn the diff gears but still not turn the prop, just the broken bit in the diff. Now I was only trying to help but you will *have* to remove one or both shafts to be absolutely sure! Now I know a little bit more about landrovers than computers so if you explained to me why my post didn't appear to have been sent, then I would be inclined to believe you.

Martin.

Reply to
Oily

It sounds like i'll have to remove them both while fixing anyway even if i can work out exactly which one is broken!

I was just hoping that there would be an easy way to test it that i could do without taking anything apart ;) - will give me a clue what im up against!

Reply to
Tom Woods

As you say you will have to remove them both if you need to take the diff out to get at the broken bit. I have two pieces of 3/8" stainless bar about a metre long and one of them with half cut away to a 'D' section for 3 or 4 inches of its length, the second piece is to recover the first. With both shafts removed and the flattened piece inserted through the diff carrier past the centre shaft and carefully positioned, a calculated sharp knock with a lump hammer will send the broken piece flying out of the diff into the axle casing at the other side where it can easily be hooked out with a bit of looped welding wire and the diff flushed out to remove any unwanted bits, only recommended if you are in a hurry. Taking the diff out is only a pain if you are doing it on your back.

Martin.

Reply to
Oily

I've had a halfshaft shear in a IIa, the only reason i noticed was because it got halfway round the corner and then it wouldn't speed up. A slight thump was all i noticed, no more than the sort of bump you'd get from dropping the clutch in a bit too sharply. Dropped the 4wd in and carried on.

Yes, the steering does tend to pull a bit in odd ways if driving on just the front of a Series. The lack of CV joints means than when going round corners the wheels do not rotate at a constant speed, due to the nature of a UJ - it's angular velocity is not constant when operating at an angle, which is why you need to have a second one at the same angle to compensate at the other end - which you havn't got on the front axle.

Alex

Reply to
Alex

On Wed, 22 Mar 2006 00:11:15 +0000 (UTC), "Oily" scribbled the following nonsense:

difficult to explain. You check one side, and then the other. The theory (and practice IME) is that the side with the snapped halfshaft will no turn the diff because the wheel and diff no longer have the physical link connecting them.

You always check both sides to confirm.

Lets say the left hand wheel does not turn the prop, but the rh does, I normally suspect a halfshaft failure on the LH.

If the LH does not turn the prop, and the RH dopes not turn it either, it normally indicates something more severe.

I have diagnosed several halfshaft failures this way when in comps, and also identified a crown wheel failure in the diff by this method, in that the diff turned for a bit, then didn't, then turned for a bit then didn't when both corners were checked.

Reply to
Simon Isaacs

It is more likely to be a half shaft - but last time this happened to me it was the shaft the pinions in the diff centre turn on broke, resulting in a a few teeth off the sun and planet wheels, but no extraneous noises or drive. Happened driving up a rough stony hill close to the limit of adhesion in 2wd, but as the 2a was empty I don't think the damage was done then. I was able to start off driving the front wheels only, as there was more weight on the front wheels. JD

Reply to
JD

Hi Tom

If your nearish W.Yorks I have half shafts and diffs available for a small donation to the 110 suspension lift fund.

Icky

Reply to
icky

Not difficult to explain, always remove to check. Where's the theory (or practice) in that? Neither will the unbroken halfshaft turn the diff, only the diff gears, but not the diff carrier, crown wheel, pinion or prop because the broken bit on the other side will spin but not the full shaft.

Absolutely

Only possible with a locked or limited slip diff or if the bits have jammed it up.

Or just a broken halfshaft.

Ahhh.. Enlightenment, "when in comps" were we using LSDs etc?

Martin :-)

Reply to
Oily

And I'll be travelling from Yorks to Lee's green-lane thingy on the

8th....
Reply to
Tim Hobbs

Hi Tim

Having driven it in a broken state, and if it is a shaft... In my experience you will have been VERY lucky if shards of half shaft haven't Knackered the diff anyway. I thing I have found useful to prevent it happening a week after you've put it back together is to put the strongest magnet you can find into poly bag(s) and run it round the casing before you re-assemble. Its amazing what you can find.

Best of luck

Reply to
Uncle Geoff

I've not had chance to look at it yet. Thats the plan for tommorrow.

It is however leaking out lots of oil through the outer hub seal on one side at the rear and i had virtually no leak before - so whatever has happened has disturbed the hub.

Icky - i might take you up on that half shaft, and Tim on the lift down for it!. There might still be a shaft in the garage at my old house - I shall be checking that out at the weekend.

If i cant get this fixed before Lee's big day out then my landy isnt coming - hopefully i can find a substitute chariot otherwise i will be asking people nicely for lifts ;)

I've been thinking about the landy, and if this had happened 2 days earlier - before my MOT - then i'd be parking the landy up and leaving it to fester till either the end of the summer or next year when i hope to have more time and tuits to work on it!. Its now holding up work on the 101 and the house!

Reply to
Tom Woods
.

No problem, 'ping' me if you need them (or any other series stuff) got a few now redundant boxes of spares all very cheep!

Icky

Reply to
icky

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