Autoelectrics problem MB C320

hello all,

I have been lurking in this newsgroup for little while. Last year, a family member wanted to sell a 2001 model C320. It was a four-year-old car, but only had 14,000 kilometres on the clock (used as a weekend car to weddings and parties etc...). He asked me to advertise it for him, but since the depreciation made the car a huge bargain, I bought it off him.

It has now 22,000 km on the clock. Last week, it developed a problem whereby 4 errors appeared on the dash: 1- brake pad wear fault, 2 - fault with ABS, 3 - fault with ESP, 4 - fault with BAS.

The car would then lock into the one gear that it was in at the time (it can be first gear or any other gear that it was in at the time). Initially, stopping the car and restarting the car would see the errors disappear and the car would be drivable (which made me think that the engine heat may have helped improve on some of the electrical connection). However every day since then, the problem would take longer to disappear. Today, I had to limp home from work in second gear at 60 km per hour all the way home.

I did take the car to Mercedes-Benz for a diagnostic. It was hooked up to a computer, and I was told that the fault lies in the ESP control module.

Now here is the cruel part, the part can be replaced as a second-hand unit for about $2500, or a new unit around about $4000 !!!!

Now for all the mechanics in this group, is this a common fault, and is this a reasonable repair bill? Could the component be removed and repaired by an electrician for less?

This is my first foray into a luxury car, previously being an owner for eight years of a Subaru WRX. The Subaru did throw a fault in the odometer, which cost me $1300 to replace. However, after this experience, I'm thinking of going back to Japanese quality (now looking at the Lexus IS range - much prefer the value of the Liberty range but the missus does not like the interior :-((( ).

Although the car is now five years old, the low kilometres makes the experience very bitter. Do you think, that time can be blamed for the unreliability, and should I get rid of the car? In fact, the six CD stacker died only six months into the ownership (and still remained broken). I did find information on the net that the 2001 MB C class can be quite unreliable (apparently especially so in the electrics), but I would have thought that that I could get more mileage out of the car before things like this happen.

Although I was told that due to the low mileage, that MB will consider giving me a special price for the part. This is not yet confirmed, however could this be expected from the manufacturer?

Cheers

Reply to
x_d
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Sorry to digress, but I am not at all surprised by this story. Why do people think Germans make the best vehicles when you frequently hear stories like this?

I recall reading an article that talked about Mercedes rushing a bunch of new technologies to the market not so long ago - 2001 era would be about right, and finding chronic reliability problems shortly afterwards.

Occam's Razor says that (basically) the simplest solution to a problem is the most likely answer. In terms of automotive design, I feel the Germans could learn a thing or two from applying simple design now and then. [Ford probably could too when it comes to the design of their current V8 (why have double overhead bump sticks when you have an engine so chronically undersquare that spinning beyond 5000 rpm requires massive feats of metallurgy?)]

As for your particular problem, I'd be stirring up some action from Mercedes. Start with a dealer and then work up to the state distributor. Once it's fixed, sell the bastard of a vehicle and get a Subaru. Tell your missus she can have the car she pays for.

Brett

Reply to
The Interceptor

The wood-ducks, thats who, they dont sell the car per-se, they sell the image and ego boost instead

German cars have taken a nose dive in quality BIG time, esp. Benz [the other German brands have never been at that level anyway] they fail just as well as any other brand.

Frankly they where never that good anyway, the Germans where to busy making propaganda making people *think* that they are better than they actually are.Its ok Holden does that too;-)

The difference when a Krut car fails u need to sell your kidney to pay for the repair.

You want quality, buy Made In Japan, its the best PERIOD [J.D.Powers anyone], hard to walk away from Japanese quality/engineering etc

I still like the 450SEL, it was the last of the super bullet proof Benzs

OUT!

Reply to
auscars

Actually this is a simple fix. Our E320 had this quirky error message that would disappear upon restart... Error Messages would say BAS Failure, ESP Failure,... visit workshop... then we also had a SOS Malfunction... visit workshop.

The solution was very simple... change that battery. Weak battery gives computer false readings hence false errors.

Reply to
Tiger

In article ,

Utter nonsense.

Thet explains all the 20, 30 and 40 year old Japanese cars you see all the time.

*cough*HVAC*cough*. There's a few later chassis - up to and including the 126 - that still gave the DIY mechanic a fighting chance.
Reply to
Richard Sexton

I see plenty of 20 year old Japanese cars around - probably moreso than cars from any other country, and as for 30 and 40 year old cars, how many do you see regularly from any country?

Marco

Reply to
Marco

Does it have a genuine service history that's up to date? If so, you'll need to battle with the dealer who serviced it. The advisors themselves are usually pretty willing to hound MB Aus. for some sort of concession, something like they supply the parts and you pay the labour (meaning the dealer still gets paid the usual). Make a big enough song and dance about it and they will definately come around. If the history is non-genuine, get ready to be made an example of...........

Keep us posted?

Reply to
jackbadger56

"Marco" wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com:

[...]

Well, in Central Indiana, you see a bunch of 30,40 and 50+ year old American cars being driven. And dare I mention Cuba where a '57 Chevy is still thought of as being a new car?

Reply to
Kurt

So they're as cheap as the average Holden or Falcon then? (That's average Australian family hacks to you). They might be cheap to repair in your part of the world, but down here they're horrendously expensive.

Why anyone would *want* one is beyond me, as they've always been one of the most over-rated heaps of shit on the planet in my opinion.

-- Regards, Noddy.

Reply to
Noddy

I dunno I was looking at a late 80's MB 280SE it was in great nick beautiful black exterior. But then again I thought if I did buy it the first thing would go would be that little 2.8 litre 6 and in goes a V8 but of course without telling you what V8 would be in there. :-)

Reply to
Dan---

Disconnect the battery then disconnect and reconnecting the plugs that connect to the module, if your lucky it be just a bad connection. Have a look at the plugs pins when its disconnected and check for any signs of corrosion.

Daryl

Reply to
D Walford

hmm... a few have suggested that the battery is the problem, though I have to admit I don't see the logic in this as the battery itself seems to have adequate power to start the car and does not seem weak with the lights on.

When MB did the computer diagnostic hook up, the technician said (though not witnessed) that he took the electrical connector off the ESP control module and cleaned it. He said that there is no guarantee it would help.

As for disconnecting the battery, I am too afraid to disconnect the battery just in case in a modern car, other electrical system/alarms may need code resettings. Last time I did that to another car - to change the battery, the stereo and alarm played up.

And if it is the battery, wouldn't MB not suggested that is where the fault lies, replace it and not suggesting that I should get a $4000 part? Or are they more business minded than they are looking after potential repeat customers.

Anyhow, I may consider getting a new battery just to test this theory.

Thanks also to Tiger, and also Oz for the tip.

Cheers.

Reply to
x_d

Yes it does have a full service history.

I live in Brisbane QLD, and I have approached both the MB Fortitude Valley and also the Mt Gravatt service centre.

The central service centre is very flashy but their customer service is not up to the same standard as the Mt Gravatt branch.

They stated that I might get a 25% discount for the part but has anyone ever got a part of that price free when a car is out of warranty (but low mileage?)

Cheers.

Reply to
x_d

doesn't mean it's actually any good ( yes I know it sounds odd)

but he didn't disconnect the battery resetting the whole system

you might have a pin code problem with the radio , so what...

you really are naive... 4000$ sale or 100$.. now where do you think the service manager will go considering the wont warraenty the work until fixed.. it might work.. .. oh look we did all that work and replaced tha battery just in case , now it's fixed..

sound familiar ?

Reply to
atec77

I can imagine that if the battery is old, the voltage might drop after starting, causing the fault codes. Especially if the car has been left overnight.

What I will try tomorrow morning is start the car and let it sit for 5 mins to give the battery some charge before restarting and drive off.

This is more a response to Daryl's suggestion of cleaning the contacts to the ESP control module.

My time means money. If I have to take time off work to drive to MB to get the codes resetting, it is worth hundreds of dollars (I am in a service industry, if I don't see clients, I don't make money, and I work 6 days a week, exactly when MB service departments open). Of course I can get a relative to take the car but I would then have to borrow a car, too much hassle.

Of course I can understand the business model. But I wonder if this is going to alienate potential repeat customers when their products appear to be inferior, leading to a lifetime (and including potential family and friends recommendation) of product avoidance. I can imagine the short term gain may offset long term benefits for the company. As I said, I am already thinking of trading it in for a Lexus (which has had far better quality satisfaction)

No wonder TopGear always seem to rubbish the MB brand, saying that they always break down.

Cheers.

Reply to
x_d

MB dealer in USA diagnosed the E320. That was their solution and it worked. Battery did not seem weak either. Starter was fast and normal. Nothing to indicate bad battery... but that was their answer. I know the battery was original and 5 years old.

Reply to
Tiger

Again, what do you have to lose in an original battery and a new battery compared to several thousand dollars of misdiagnosed part?

Reply to
Tiger

Yes I will get the battery replaced tomorrow. Seems that your MB dealer in the USA knows of the problem. I wonder if they have notified other MB service centres around the world about it. And if so this should have been the initial fix offer.

For me, it would seem that either this has not taken place, or the technicians are not keeping up to date, or the MB service department in Australia is trying to rip me off.

We shall see after tomorrow I guess if this will fix the problem. I did check with the original owner. The battery was replaced when one year old due to a problem. The current battery is 4 years old.

Cheers

PS - thanks heaps for your input :-))))

Reply to
x_d

Just old Mercedes and detroit iron. It's rare here to see a Japanese car older than 10 years.

Reply to
Richard Sexton

You're just giong to the wrong people. Seek out John Greene or Davide Frada. The diesels are as chea to maintin as a Holden (and break less) the gas ones probably a bit more dear.

Reply to
Richard Sexton

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