2005 911 Details

autospies.com has some info. Also try rennlist.com - they have a 997 forum.

Thanks Steve,

Could you please explain more about the different engines in the 1998-2004 period? I am looking at used in this age group and would like to understand what you get at each level.

It seems I am looking at 996's normally aspirated and in turbo form - this include's twin turbo with the X50 option. What exactly is that X50 option? I am getting different answers to that question. Is it a factory tweeked twin turbo with different CPU chip? What block type do these models have? What displacements were available? Prices are between $65,000 and $100,000+ - why so wide a band? What should I be looking for?

Then I have looked at GT2's and GT3's. They cost way more at $135,000 to $150,000+ for a couple of modified GT2's. I have driven twin turbo GT2's and looked at (1) GT3 that was normally aspirated. Do these two models share the same engine block as the 996's. What about displacements?

Sorry for all the questions but I am getting quite confused and don't want to get it in the you know what when I buy one of these lovely auto's. I have owned all kinds of vehicles and nothing drove live the 2003 GT2 twin turbo!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Unreal performance - more than I expected.

Disclosure - I was hawking in on buying a Viper and have driven all the under $200,000 exotics until the Porshe test drive. No way I'll buy anything else! Now I want the Porsche and I have to admit that I'll still be ungrading to a newer Vette because I still love that ride and can hardly wait for the C6 to replace my C5 (the Vette is the best performance value on the planet IMO).

Not a troll comment at all - I just throw that in to let you fella's in on how far afield my Porsche test drive took me. The Porsche is the most refined and still brute car I have ever driven and smokes all the competition IMO and I'm so glad I can afford one. Could you all please tell me all you can about the 2001-2003 models so I can feel comfortable and go out and buy one? ;-)

Thanks in advance, Spencer

well, it looks like the 4S and turbo models will not be revamped until 2006. weird. you would think they would revamp all models at the same time.

what is the 997? i read about the current model being referred to as the

996. what do these numbers signify?

-- berj

I can't speak as to the Turbo, but there will be a new 3.8 litre motor for the Carrera S, and I was told that there would be a 4S sporting the same engine. In addition, I have a feeling that Porsche will prduce a few extra 996 Turbos to keep them around.

They're "Type" numbers, which signfy the generation of the car. Cars built from

1965 to 1989 were Type 911s, except the Turbos which were 930s. More recently, there has been a 964 (1990-1993), 993 (1994-1997) and 996 (1998-2004). The 996 has enjoyed a longer run than the 2 generations that preceeded it, but there were revisions in 2001 that brought a more powerful base engine and a slightly redeisgned front end. The Boxster is a 986, just for reference. Mazda has used a similar system. The Miata is internally the MX-5, and has been badged as Miata, MX-5 Miata, MX-5 MazdaSpeed (the new Turbo model) and was badged as Eunos Roadster for a time in Japan (there was also a really neat Eunos Cosmo GT Coupe' powered by a 3 Rotor Wankel that would've made a great competitor to the SC400 if only it'd been sold in North America). They also built an MX-3 and an MX-6, which were badged as such, just as Porsche badged the 924, 944, 968 and 928 with their model numbers, rather than inventing another name for them.

Thanks Jim,

I'm getting all the answers and they are making sense to me when I see it all laid out in chronological order - good deal. A few more questions and I will have at least the basic model situation understood.

These are the models I am seeing under $100,000 - ok, normally aspirated and with different options but the older ones have the 3.4 and the newer ones have the 3.6 liter. Thanks .........

These are the purist form of the 911 style model and the most like a race car - correct? Does the M96/76 then designate the use of titaniem push rods, valves and other such goodies? Is yes, is this exclusive to the GT3?

The 456 HP RWD is what I drove - how would this compare to a Turbo Carrerra AWD? Does this M96/70S engine use titanium and other exotic materials in the engine than the 996 turbo Carrerra engine?

Any websites that I can go to read in depth on this 96-02 model year 996. GT2, GT3. I want to really get a better handle on all the skinny before I shell out the money.

Thanks, Spencer

The 996 is the current production 911 through the 2004 model year. The

997 is the next 911 due as a 2005 model year vehicle this coming September.

996 revisions were in 2001 for 2002 model year vehicles.

The engine is laregly the same. It's a 3.6 litre flat six with DOHC and 24 valves. In 2001 Porsche made some minimal physical changes to the engine (mostly to the induction system if memory serves me) and made some software revisions to get more power. 1998-2000 models had 296Hp while 2001-2004 models have 320Hp. In 1998 when the 996 debuted with the 296Hp motor, Motor Trend ran one from 0-60 in 4.7 seconds and I've heard confirmation of that number from elsewhere. A well driven 320Hp models should be able to pull off at least that time if well driven.

X50 is a $13,000 option package that gets you an upgraded intercooler, upgraded Turbos and new software. It pushes the TT's power output to 450Hp, making it capable of 0-60 in 3.6 seconds with the 6-speed. You'd have to buy a $440,000 Carrera GT to get a Porsche that was any quicker in a straight line.

All of the 911 variants use a 3.6 litre, DOHC, 24 valve flat-six built around the same block. Modifications are made depending on which version of the 911 the engine is going into.

Between 1998 and 2004 only the 3.6 has been avaliable in the 911. A new 3.8 litre motor will be introduced with the 997s, but it will only be sold in the Carrera S.

That, I can't answer. There are any number of factors that effect a car's value. Try talking to the different sellers.

The GT2 and GT3 represent the ultimate Porsche road car - sans the Carrera GT. They are based on the only two 911 variants that are still regularly raced and are produced in very small number and to very exacting standards. They will always command a higher price.

They share a block. But the GT2 is twin-turbocharged and certin internal modifications were made to help it cope with the pressure. It's also got upgraded radiators, intercoolers and Turbochargers over the TT. The GT3 is naturally aspirated and tuned to make an astonishing 106Hp per litre. Again, certain things like the cams will be unique to this version of the motor.

I'm amazed anyone pays for the Viper. You can get a Corvette Z06 for a lot less money, and there are other cars - better cars, in the same price bracket.

Which is why I wrote "...there were revisions in 2001..."

The 996 normally aspirated cars were introduced with 296 HP originally, then 300. These were 3.4 liter engines.

The 2002 and later 996 was a 3.6 liter with 320 HP and an improved torque curve. For the 2003 and later model year U.S. cars could be had with an optional 345 HP engine (X51). The 2002 and later engine shared only about 20% commonality with the 3.4 it replaced. The 345 HP engine is a 3.6 with different intake and exhaust manifolds, modified cylinder heads and camshafts, and increased valve stroke.

The current U.S. GT3 is a normally aspirated 3.6 liter producing 380 HP, rear wheel drive only. It features suspension and brake enhancements over the standard Carreras

The current Turbo Carrera is an all wheel drive 3.6 producing 415 HP, the X50 option takes it to 444 HP. The X50 is primarily larger compressors, turbines and intercoolers, and a slight increase in boost pressure.

The current GT2 is a rear wheel drive 3.6 producing 477 HP; earlier model years made 456 HP.

While the Carreras all sport 3.6 liter engines in current production form, the Turbo engines are designated M96/70; GT2 is M96/70S; GT3 is M96/76 and Carreras are M96/03. There are subtle bore/stroke differences and dimensions between them.

Got it. I took it to mean you were putting the revisions on the 2001 cars.

No problemo. =)

You're right, I miffed my history in my response to the original poster. I had forgotten that Porsche had been using the 3.4 in the first few years of the

996. However, keep in mind that the 3.6 is at 320Hp, not 300.

I've got one word for you: Rennlist. Stop by

and visit the 996 board. It's the largest grouping of current 996 owners on the net and you'll get answers to all your questions. One the newsgroups, we seem to have more 993 and older owners. Emanuel

The 3.6 is 320, but the 3.4 was rated at 296 initially, then got bumped to 300.

i am a bit confused because i spoke to a dealer recently about ordering a

2005 4S. he says he knows nothing about what the 2005 4S will look like, but that the Carrera and Carrera S will be redesigned for 2005. he is "hinting" that the 4S will not be changed to the 997 for the 2005 model.

how can i confirm this?

-- berj

Chances are that Porsche will release a new C4S in the new 997 skin and powered by the same 3.8 litre, 365Hp flat-six that'll be in the 997 C2S. There's no way to confirm this yet because Porsche isn't talking about it, but it's expected - probably a year after the 997s debut. Of course, it's not as though the current model is bad...according to R&T the C4S cabrio posts a 4.6 second 0-60 time, and the coupe is faster....

The 3.4 was used in 911's until 2002, then the 3.6 was used.

JR