Any way to prove the speed of a Subaru in traffic court?

Where you testing when going uphill but got ticketed when going downhill?

Do you have tires of larger diameter than the stock tires (for which the speedometer is gauged)?

Tried putting in high octane fuel instead of the normal grade?

Wind against or with you during the test?

Did you turn *off* the A/C during your test?

Was the cop's radar in a moving car at the time he took the measurement? Was there heavy winds at the time? What were the weather conditions at the time? Any other cars around you, especially driving in the opposite direction (and big vehicles, like a semi)?

If you decide to show up in court, be sure to notify the court or the officer that you want to see the calibration record for the serial number of the unit that he clocked you with (so you can tell when it last got calibrated). Hell, just showing up in court often means you win simply because the cop won't show up.

you would not think of driving without a rear view mirror, yet some people still drive without a fuzz buster :)

No I got ticketed going up hill.

No, standard tires.

No. just ran the normal regular 85 octane I always run.

No. It was a clear mild day when I was ticketed and when I've tested.

No air conditioner used at either time.

Cop was stationary using LIDAR.

No.

clear and mild.

Very light traffic both ways. Only 2 cars going in my direction and very few going opposite.

What I am trying to find out is if there is a way a Subaru tech or other Subaru expert could somehow calculate what the top speed a 2000 Outback could go with a non modified 2.5 engine could go on a mile long steep grade of a certain percentage? I just can't think of a way to prove my car couldn't have been going that fast barring having the cop or judge drive my car and try to dupicate my speed (which I know will never happen). I know there are many ways I can try and defend my self in court but I know that if the officer shows up, it is very hard to beat a speeding ticket especially when LIDAR is used.

If it were me (and I have done this) I would simply show up at court and offer to plead guilty to a non-moving violation (you' d have to look up your state's statutes and find one). That wil probably work, save you the points but you'd still have to pay the fine.

Dan D '99 Impreza 2.5 RS (son's) Central NJ USA

Which is illegal EVERYWHERE I drive.

Too bad you didn't have the circumstances I had about 28 years ago.

I was rallying a 1973 Renault R12 (1300cc) up around Peterborough Ontario. NAVEX rally- unprepared car - perscribed average speed 43MPH IIRC, through loose sand on forest roads. (The Renault was the lowest powered car in the series but managed a 4-3-2 finish for the 3 years we campaigned it) I came sliding into the checkpoint, timed to the second, with no penalties after something like 40 miles since the last checkpoint. About a minute later, just before I was ready to pull out for the next stage, a Police cruiser pulled up behind me and the officer jumped out madder than a wet hen. He claimed he was going to charge me for 85MPH in a 50 zone. I looked at him and just about cracked up. He asked what was so funny. I said the car wouldn't do 85 wide open downhill with a tail wind, and I could prove to him EXACTLY what my average speed had been for the last 40 (or whatever) miles. I told him I had averaged 43 MPH, and would admit to possibly having hit 50-55 MPH once or twice for a very short stretch, but more importantly to cornering at close to 40MPH. If he was doing 85 trying to CATCH up to me, and cornering with his LTD at about 2MPH, I could see that, but no way was he doing that to KEEP up with me. I referred him to the check-point marshall and told him We'd see him in court if he wanted to lay the charge.

At the end of the rally the checkpoint crews were having a good laugh. The poor copper had NO IDEA where he was - whether he was even still in Ontario or not. They had to give him detailed directions (they gave him the rally instructions) to get him back to the highway, where he was WELL out of his local jurisdiction.

Buy, bum, borrow, beg or steal a GPS unit. Lyle.

I usually travel with a GPS unit that records my speed every 20 seconds or so. This would be good evidence to show the traffic court, except I am usually speeding by at least a few miles and hour. It would allow you to make sure your speedometer is accurate (mine is right on, but a Ford Fairmont I once had was over by about 10%).

The "my car doesn't go that fast uphill" defense would have worked for my 1986 Subaru GL wagon and a 1966 VW bug I once had.

If I were you, I would show up in court and, if the officer appeared with accurate data, ask for a reduced speed. Because anything under 10 MPH is not reported to the insurance company, you might try "70 in a

Hope this helps,

Bill

You could have someone video tape you driving up the hill. Show the road, show your foot to the floor, show your speedometer.

However, if the speed you do attain on tape is over the speed limit (even by a few miles an hour), be prepared to accept another ticket based on the video evidence you are going to submit.

Jon

We had a local high school kid here get a ticket for speeding. He claimed that he was accelerating from a red light, and the car wouldn't get to that speed in that short a stretch. A little physics got him off, using the distance the cop stopped him at from the light and the specs on the car. So, you can get off, but it takes some doing. You'd have to work out the formulas and the cars specs and do the math.

Try the same experiment with a friend in the car, and bring them as a witness. Offer to let anyone in the court drive your car up the same hill. If anyone can reproduce the speed the cop clocked offer to pay double the fine and take double the points. Only an idiot, or someone who is absolutely right will do that. Problem is, they can say you rigged the car for the test.

Were there any other cars around? It's easy to lock radar onto the wrong car, and radar will tend to pick up the larger vehicle or the faster vehicle.

BTW, if the cop doesn't show you automatically win, and it happens all the time.

At the time of the stop I aked the officer to do that and he declined saying that he wasn't allowed to do that. Then he added, I know you wre speeding, LIDAR doesn't lie.

One solution I've been thinking about is taking my car in for service at this Subaru mechanic near there and have him test the car up the hill. Then get a letter from him confirming the top speed of the car.

Might help. Remember the statement the cop made (they write down everything you said), and do some research on that particular gun. None of them are perfect, and the manufacturers explain that in their literature. What you need to do is put some doubt into the officer's statement. Right now it's you against a number on a radar gun. Generally that's not a very strong case unless you said something to the cop to nail it down. "I don't know how fast I was going," is not a good thing to say. If you didn't know it gives a lot of credence to the officer's statement.

Good luck.

Hi,

Reminds me of a story told by a friend's wife. She was in college (~40 yrs ago?) and had a "tired" Renault Dauphine (some of you guys will remember those!) Got a ticket for going too fast UPHILL.

She went to court, handed her keys to the bailiff, and told the judge "Your Honor, I was ticketed going uphill. Here are the keys to my car. If you can get it to go as fast DOWNHILL as the officer claims I was going, I'll be glad to pay the fine. Otherwise, I'm not guilty."

It was a small town, and the judge knew the hill well. He asked what kind of car she was driving. When she told him, he started laughing and dismissed the case right then and there!

Rick

I had one. Was in a carpool for summer school, and there was one hill where everybody had to get out of the car to make it. Fun car. Good mileage. No power.

You had a Dauphine Gordini? That guy worked miracles with Renaults...

did you try on reverse gear - it usually got better ratio :-)