Stuck on Ice

I was stuck on the ice on my steep driveway in my 2002 Inpreza. One front wheel & one rear wheel were on dry spots, but the wheels on the ice kept spinning. What happened to transferring power from "the wheels that slip to the wheels that grip"? Was my car malfunctioning, or is there something else I should know? FL

Reply to
FL
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You don't have a limited slip diff.

Ron

Reply to
Freedom55

Then what good is AWD?

Reply to
FL

Yes, apply a little brake along with throttle and away you go.

Reply to
Danny Russell

My advice. Your next Subie should have LSD. To my knowledge only the WRX variants of the Impressa line have LSD.

This was a factor in my decision to buy a 2005 Outback Wagon.

Ron

Reply to
Freedom55

You should have opted for the limited slip differential...then it would have crawled up in two wheel drive. My VR4 has limited slip in the center and rear diffs and it's a friggin snowmobile. The good news is you can get an aftermarket limited slip (Phantom Grip, ETC) for very little money. TG

Reply to
TG

Thank you

Reply to
FL

What kind of transmission do you have, the manual or automatic? Typically the superior base-level all-wheel drive system comes with the manual transmission. Subaru actually has about three or four different all-wheel drive systems, more if you count their variants.

The base-level manual tranny AWD system is superior to the base-level auto tranny AWD, even though the former is a completely mechanical system (no electronics whatsoever in it) while the latter has electronics. Then in the higher-end models you get the more sophisticated electronic AWD systems, such as the OB VDC or the STi, which are in a league of their own.

I guess another question to ask is are you sure you had some tires on dry spots? If it was that icy in your area, then chances are likely that all four wheels were on some form of ice. When all the wheels are on ice, you're not going anywhere, AWD or not.

Yousuf Khan

Reply to
Yousuf Khan

Or simply apply less throttle in the first place. You might also want to try starting in second. Most people's inputs in ice and snow conditions are much too vigorous. Imagine a raw egg between your foot and the throttle.

David Betts snipped-for-privacy@motorsport.org.uk

Reply to
David Betts

Does the 2004 OBW have LSD? Didn't know there was a choice.

Reply to
pickle

Responding to your last point: If all four wheels were on ice, and spinning, I would expect the car to slide backwards when the throttle was released.

Reply to
l.lichtman

I had something interesting happen last winter, and I tried it a couple of times to make sure it wasn't just some kind of fluke -- in fact, it was kind of fun. Maybe somebody could shed a little light on it.

OK, it was my first winter with my new Baja and I couldn't wait for snow season. When it finally did snow I had a great time. There was a shopping mall nearing completion near my house and the empty parking lot was a sheet of ice so I had to see how the Baja would handle that. I slowly rolled out to a point where all four wheels were on the ice and came to a complete stop. I was able to give it a little throttle and get forward motion without any problem which it more or less what I expected. I also found that if I was at full stop and gave it a bit more throttle, the car would actually, "spin" in a tight circle. I don't mean turn in a circle but it was almost like there was a spindle in the middle of the car and it would spin like a propeller thought clearly not THAT fast. I'm not talking spinning so fast as to make you dizzy, just a slow tight rotation. As I said, I tried it a couple of times and thought, "Hey, that's cool" and that was the end of it but nobody else I've talked to about it has seen this happen. I figured it was an AWD thing where I guess say, your front drivers side wheel is turning and your rear passenger side wheel is turning that might happen. Does that make sense? Is that how the system even works? Am I crazy . . . insane? Has anybody else experienced this. Thanks.

Reply to
phillystyle

I had something interesting happen last winter, and I tried it a couple of times to make sure it wasn't just some kind of fluke -- in fact, it was kind of fun. Maybe somebody could shed a little light on it.

OK, it was my first winter with my new Baja and I couldn't wait for snow season. When it finally did snow I had a great time. There was a shopping mall nearing completion near my house and the empty parking lot was a sheet of ice so I had to see how the Baja would handle that. I slowly rolled out to a point where all four wheels were on the ice and came to a complete stop. I was able to give it a little throttle and get forward motion without any problem which it more or less what I expected. I also found that if I was at full stop and gave it a bit more throttle, the car would actually, "spin" in a tight circle. I don't mean turn in a circle but it was almost like there was a spindle in the middle of the car and it would spin like a propeller thought clearly not THAT fast. I'm not talking spinning so fast as to make you dizzy, just a slow tight rotation. As I said, I tried it a couple of times and thought, "Hey, that's cool" and that was the end of it but nobody else I've talked to about it has seen this happen. I figured it was an AWD thing where I guess say, your front drivers side wheel is turning and your rear passenger side wheel is turning that might happen. Does that make sense? Is that how the system even works? Am I crazy . . . insane? Has anybody else experienced this. Thanks.

Reply to
phillystyle

Just like the Hummer H1 (the real Hummer, not the soccer-mom H2 Hummer), you have open diffs in the front and rear.

The technique as described in the H1's operation manual is that is if a situation occurs such that both the front and rear differential become overloaded, a light application of the brake pedal will allow manual re-distribution of power.

Open diffs have the advantage of greater directional control in sudden slippery situations. LSD's can tend to sometimes trade foreward thrust for lateral movement (fishtail).

Tires are the most important factor for winter driving. Lousy tires suck with RWD, FWD, AWD, 4WD, LSD, etc.

Reply to
Danny Russell

have open diffs in the

The *real* real Hummer (the guv'mint model) has Gleason Torsens, front & rear. That puppy don't _wanna_ get stuck, you really gotta work at it!

Reply to
CompUser

Negative on the AWD thing. I used to have a rear wheel drive Celica that would do that. It was great fun to go down an empty road and do a spindle turn at the end for a 180 in the opposite direction.

Reply to
pickle

Steve, in a C&D H1 mag review several years back (I don't have the issue anymore), I clearly recall the author outlining the proceedure for using the brake as a means of redistributing the power to all four corners. The scenario was such that would put the vehicle in a position where opposite corners were not in contact with the ground (rock crawling). This was demonstrated to them by an AMG rep who accompianied them throughout the test to help show off the vehicles capabilities. Maybe that's a weakness of the torsen, I don't know.

Reply to
Danny Russell

anymore), I clearly recall

redistributing the power to

position where opposite

demonstrated to them by an

vehicles capabilities. Maybe

To be honest, I don't know if the milspec HMMWVs still have the Gleasons or not...my understanding of that goes wayyyyy back ;-) As far as brake application to get things mixed around, that sounds right to me. Now, just to mix all *that* together, one of the claimed advantages to the Gleason Torsens (again, going wayyyy back here) was that they'd actuate/redistribute even if the "slipping" wheel had zero traction, eg one wheel was up in free air, like your rock-crawling scenario. The other lockers/LSDs (Detroit Locker is the only one that comes to mind at the moment) of the time required *some* degree of drag/friction on the slipping wheel, or they wouldn't function...which suggests that some brake action in that kind of situation would be good medicine.

Reply to
CompUser

I found out by accident that if you put the emergency brake on and apply the gas only the front wheels spin. The rear one remained locked.

Reply to
Richard

Sounds like a quick way to destroy your viscous coupling.

Reply to
Jim Stewart

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