Rear end problems?

Oh... I thought maybe you were talking about Medicaid....

--scott

And I'm telling you once again that Germany is a better example of Hachi's position than your. Germany's system is failing. It cannot be sustained under its current structure, and everybody has said so. Germany says it will take YEARS -- perhaps stretching into a decade or more -- to adress the problems and implement changes.

Germany is an example of how badly something gets screwed up when the government takes over.

YOU are the only one I've seen make mention of a specific government, Germany. Whether or not you buy into the idea that Germans have a private health care system, it has a system on the brink of collapse and it is taking government intervention to prop it up.

You ought to do a Google search on GERMANY'S HEALTH CARE SYSTEM and then check the top few hits. The system is in serious trouble. But thanks for playing.

Did the problems begin BEFORE government stepped in to "help"?

It's hard to tell, but my sense is no. Why don't you study the issue and get back to us.

The fact is, Germany has a socialized medical system that is failing. It is subsidized (at the least) by government money, and Germany itself says it cannot sustain the system as it is currently structured.

I have the same sense: The trouble began before the government stepped in. In other words, I'm agreeing with you.

Now, how can their system have been screwed up by government, if the problems began BEFORE the government stepped in? Sounds like someone's time line is tied in knots.

We can't sustain OUR system either, as it is currently structured, and for most of us, there is no government involvement.

If you had to buy your own policy with no contribution from your employer or any other source, what would that cost you? I mean YOU, in California.

Our current medical system is rotten. I jsut got a routine physical with routine lab tests. I paid nothing to the my Doctor. My Doctor and his lab billed the insurance comapny for almost $600. Theinsurance company paid slightly over $200. I am to be charged nothing else. If I did not have insurance, I would have been billed $600. This is just plain crooked.

In the last year, my portion of the the insurance premium has been over $3,600. That is to cover me and my two sons. My Employer is kicking in an even larger amout (probably over $6k). For my entire family for the last decade (10 years), I doubt we have had more than $4,000 in total medical expenses (including my sons broken hand). I estimate payment for medical coverage by me and my employer for that time are close to $80,000. Where is all that other money going? Based on the payment informtion they send me, it is not going to the doctors. I know that other individuals/families probably require higher outlays from the insurance company than my family, but still...the current system is ridiculous.

My plan is simple - either National Healtcare, or execute anyone that tries to sell mediacal insurance....

Ed

What state is this in?

individuals/families

My guess is that Ed might be in Raleigh, NC.

You confuse yourself more than anybody I've ever met.

You asked if the trouble started BEFORE the government came along. I said NO. That means I think the trouble came AFTER the government started "helping". The systerm was what it was, and the government came along and made it different, and then the trouble started. Noow the government is running out of money trying to keep the system afloat.

I am in NC.

Ed

Count your blessings. I'm in Western NY (mostly rural, a few small-to-medium cities). If I buy directly from Blue Cross/Blue Shield or their competitor, it would cost me just over $600 a month for single person coverage. There are no other insurance options here, regardless of all the wacky looking offers I've seen via email, junk faxes, etc.

This is the situation as I understand it. Germany has universal health, which some equate with socialized medicine. Let's say for starters that it is the same.

The taxation plan assumed that the working population would keep growing and would keep feeding the system, just as we figured about social security. (And if social security funds had actually been kept in a trust fund and invested, we would now have an excess estimated at $31 trillion).

Germany had to absorb the East German problems after the reunification. This was a massive expense.

Then, the working population has not been increasing as projected.

So, there is a problem that will have to be dealt with.

European style universal health really works quite well, but it is not free.. AND no government has any wealth other than what they take from the people in taxes.

The worst conceivable system is one in which the pharma companies, the insurance companies, and the medicos are all hard nosed capitalists. We would all be captives under a system like that. Doctors all want to be paid as if they were Enron CEOs. Pharma companies want 98% gross earnings. And the insurance companies want our premium payments, but they dont want to pay claims.

Now, somewhere between two extremes, there must be a way to make this work.

In Texas, I paid $800 per month for a wife and a teener son. I was rushed to the hospital by ambulance one night, suspected stroke. The insurance company refused to pay anything. On another occasion, my wife had to go in for an MRI, and we went to the hospital that this insurance company specified. They paid nothing.

All smoke and mirrors. All BS. If this is capitalism, you can have it. It stinks.

Gordon told me about the GM stuff, and that he gets it for their techs.

I t could certainly be Texas. My numbers pretty much match Ed's.

Actually, I think National Vetenary Care would save me more money than National Health Care. I've spent a lot more on vet treatment for dogs, cows, and hedgehogs than I have on me and my children....

Ed

They just ended it - it was called "Cash for Clunkers". Bring it in, shred it, all maintenance problems solved.

But as with most things government, you probably didn't qualify, even if you wanted to participate.

But, how is all this going to help me with a Limited Slip on an '88 Supra? Are they going to have nationalized car care, too? THAT I'm all for!!!!

The hell you say!!! There were only 16,000 of them made in 1988.

It did qualify. Only a L00N would 'cash on in', since they are worth more in parts.