What is the root of this BMW design flaw in all 3,5,7 series BMW trunk wiring looms?

Of course it can be. If BMW uses some hippie green insulation that isn't as pliable as other insulation, then the insulation will crack. We can't do a forensic investigation from some pics that don't show how it's mounted, how much it moves, what tensions are on it, etc. But I'd bet that area has more bending, tension, etc than the rest of it.

Volvo 240 (1984 and other years) wagons had a similar problem with their tailgate wiring, where wires would always break in the hinge - the wiring was not unlike hinge wiring in laptops. It was a very tight routing which left only a small amount of wire that could flex with the result that after a few years stuff on the tailgate would stop working...

I solved the problem by moving the wiring outside the hinge and had it hang in a loop - not as nice looking, but never had any further problems. I kept that car for 25 years...

John :-#)#

Laptops! Oy!

A cheap shot; perhaps they did have a flaw in the routing/materials of one wiring harness, but show me a comparable vehicle at the same price point that handles better. To accuse BMW across the board of poor engineering is laughable.

nate

Yes, that much is true. Someone had mentioned that having the wire in that area flex in torsion would be preferable and I agree with that statement as well. Would be simple to have accomplished by having the hole in the body offset by a few inches (actually as far as possible would be preferable) from the hole in the trunk lid, and using a correspondingly longer rubber boot. then most of the flexing of the wire as the trunk lid opens and closes would result in a slight twisting of the wire rather than a sharp bending.

The same holds true for wiring running from a body pillar into a door e.g. for power mirrors, windows, speakers, etc.

nate

handling??? easy. prelude. only cheaper. crx too for that matter.

then you don't know what you're looking at. i'm a materials guy. bmw materials are cheap and nasty. not quite as bad as frod or g.m., but real freakin' close.

and when they do retarded design stuff like fit electronic brake pad wear monitors, you bmw wash-brains think that's brilliant. except for the fact that it's on one pad, on one side of the vehicle - that's not just retarded, it's cheap and retarded both at the same time.

Both are front wheel drive cars, by definition you lose.

I'm not saying that BMW is perfect, or any manufacturer for that matter. However I think that BMW and also Porsche do an excellent job of producing good value for the money. Probably the best going, if you value performance and handling (and buy used. Anyone who pays new car prices for a Bimmer or P-car either has an enviable net wealth or is a sucker.)

Many will find this surprising but I would consider Hyundai an excellent value for a non-performance driver. Honda and Toyota actually make, overall, a good product, but are overpriced in comparison.

nate

wow, that idiocy is right up there with your trunk organizers.

and i've watched preludes DOMINATE m3's and m5's on the track. you simply have not the slightest clue what you're talking about.

no, they do a great job of brainwashing. "only a fool can't see that the emperor's clothes [your over-priced deutche-crap] isn't fantastic".

no, any one who buys into their hype is a brainwashed sucker.

they don't make them any more, but the wishbone hondas were awesome. the crx was incredibly cheap and handled superbly - my old crx could crush m3's on the twisties with skinny little tires, and i'm not a good driver. miata's handle well too. hyundai are just wishbone junk wrt handling.

On Thu, 14 Mar 2013 20:16:35 -0400, Nate Nagel wrote as underneath snip

Have to be extra vigilant to water rundown in your scenario which for the wiring longevity agree would be much better! C+

late night typo - "macpherson junk".

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A: german engineering.

the fact is, germans aren't good with automotive wiring. german designed vehicles have the shittiest electrical systems ever created.

Worse, even, than Lucas Electric, the Prince of Darkness?

Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus

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A: german engineering.

the fact is, germans aren't good with automotive wiring. german designed vehicles have the shittiest electrical systems ever created.

On 3/15/2013 3:06 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote: ...

You've obviously never come across Lucas, then...

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Having owned, driven, maintained and repaired BMW, MG and Fiat the differences among them are not all that significant

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my wife broke the inside passenger side..

i've learned to use only two fingers to pull on the handles, don't grab them.

i agree they are not very rugged... but it's about the only flaw i've found with that car (knock knock)

besides the rear door wires which i understand like the BMW is a very common spot for wires to break on this car...

and interestingly the rear door is used maybe 1/100 of the time compared to the drivers door so you would have to think there is something "special" about the way those particular wires are designed and/or built to make them break before the drivers door wires break

Mark

1) Cyndrome comments on German Wiring. 2) Stormin mentions Lucas Electric. 3) dpb says I'v obviously never come across Lucas.

dpb can't read?

Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus

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You've obviously never come across Lucas, then...

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in news:5DN0t.109897 $ snipped-for-privacy@fed15.iad:

Perhaps if you'd learn to post correctly, people wouldn't find your posts so confusing. However, given that it has been explained to you repeatedly (a) why your posting style causes problems, and (b) how to fix it, you refuse to do so -- from which I gather that you are either too stupid to understand the problem, or too obstinate to do anything about it.

Time to put you back in the killfile.

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ouch.

The bimmer handles well, and the power train is phenomenal.

However, the window regulators break on almost every BMW older than about 5 years, while the blower motor final stage resistor (FSR), aka the final stage unit (FSU) will fry itself more than once on every single bimmer ever built in the late

90's and early 2000's.

The VANOS seals are made of a material that won't last the warranty period; and the Bosch 5.7 ABS control module was placed far too close to the engine for cost reasons, which fries almost every single one.

The DISA valve, which appears to be an amazing engineering feat, is practically designed to loosen the pin, which, if the engine ingests that steel pin, will wreak havoc on the valves as the pistons pummel it to pieces (there is nothing between the DISA valve and the intake manifold!).

The almost criminal design of the DISA is dwarfed by the clearly deficient design of the cooling system, where almost every bimmer older than a few years has had a catastrophic failure of, and very many multiple failures. Thousands of bimmers every year are destroyed by owners not realizing that a single overheating episode causes cracks in cylinder 3 (e.g., in the M54 engine) that essentially turn the otherwise fantastic power plant into so much rubbish.

And, there wasn't an E39 ever built (5-series, 1997 to 2003) which did NOT have the cluster and MID pixels turn to unreadable junk within a few years of manufacture (due to the infamous "pink tape").

Likewise, not a single E39 is immune to the horrid choice of PBT plastic for the headlight adjusters, turning $1000 fiber optic Halogen H7 and Xenon headlights into veritable candles within a few years of the heat baking the plastic.

Likely not one E39 hasn't had its power steering hose leak under the fluid reservoir, and not a single E46, E39, or E38 (3,5,6 series) bimmer hasn't had the CCV valve fail on them (i.e., a PCV valve which costs hundreds of dollars to replace, frequently).

For the V8, they all have valley pan gaskets leaking, and all the bimmers I'm talking about have had their thrust arm bushings tear.

Probably not a single bimmer of the categories above hasn't had the vapor barrier leaking (due to an extremely poor choice of design coupled with lousy sealant); and half the bimmers have cables slip out of the otherwise fancy seat, causing the infamous "seat twist".

I could go on (and on), (e.g., more than half will have the windshield washer pumps leak, and a huge percentage will lose their jack pads, while a healthy percentage will melt their center brake lamp housing, and even the roundels will chip away at the car wash until nothing but silver is left).

The funny thing is that BMW DOES know how to design a powerplant.

It appears that the Germans in Bavaria simply 'care' about some things (just count the ashtrays, for example, and then compare them to the unanimously ridiculous cupholders of the E39 era) while they don't care about others.

Clearly BMW cares about handling and efficiency of the power train; yet, just as clearly, overall product quality is NOT even on their radar screens.