Re: Industry crisis sees US car dealerships cut loose and left with nothing to sell The shrinkage of General Motors and Chrysler's dealer networks is putting more than 100,000 jobs in doubt at car yards in towns and cities across America

"HURRY, HURRY!"
Get Your Chinese Cars Now While They're Still Cheap!"
-------------------- "As Detroit Crumbles, China Emerges as Auto Epicenter"
By Kendra Marr Washington Post Staff Writer Monday, May 18, 2009
America's auto titans are dismantling their global empires. But across the Pacific, it's as if the global economic forces that have pummeled Detroit never struck. Chinese auto sales are up, and this year China is projected to displace Japan as the world's largest car producer.
Now, the auto world is buzzing that China's auto industry may try to pick up the pieces of Detroit -- at a bargain.
Chinese companies have tried to dampen speculation, issuing regulatory filings that deny bids to buy Ford's Volvo or General Motor's Saab. But there's little doubt among analysts that Chinese automakers are interested in the United States and that Detroit's automakers are interested in them.
Buying up iconic brands such as Hummer or Saturn could supply Chinese automakers with the technological expertise to help them leapfrog past long-established competitors, said Kelly Sims Gallagher, a lecturer at Harvard University's Kennedy School of Government, who wrote a book on Chinese automakers.
"That's where Chinese firms are weakest," she said. "They have world- class business and manufacturing capabilities now. What they still lack is technological know-how, systems integration, being able to design new vehicles from scratch and get them to a manufacturing line."
China still suffers from its reputation of being a copycat manufacturer. An acquisition could lend clout to some of the nation's 100 car companies that are largely unknown outside their home country.
Such a deal would be "off-the-shelf legitimacy that you can purchase," said Aaron Bragman, an auto analyst with IHS Global Insight.
The global auto industry is restructuring. Italy's Fiat is on the verge of taking control of Chrysler. Last year India's Tata Motors, already famous for its $2,000 Nano, acquired Jaguar and Land Rover.
And China's auto sector has emerged as a threat to the long-standing pecking order. Earlier this year, Geely Automobile, one of China's largest private carmakers, purchased an Australian drivetrain transmission supplier, a leading gearbox manufacturer. Weichai Power, one of China's top diesel engine manufacturers, acquired a French diesel engine producer. Another Chinese company, BYD, which counts Warren E. Buffett as an investor, launched a mass-market plug-in electric car, ahead of GM's anticipated Chevrolet Volt.
Detroit's annual auto show in January was somber, but Shanghai's show dazzled attendees with throngs of models, rock bands and light shows. This year, Nissan skipped Detroit and attended the Chinese event in April. Mercedes-Benz, BMW and Porsche all unveiled new-vehicle models in Shanghai.
"The center of gravity is moving eastward," Dieter Zetsche, chairman of Daimler, told reporters at the show.
"When we look back 20 years from now, the year 2009 is likely to be viewed as the year in which the baton of leadership in the global auto industry passed from the United States to China," Jack Perkowski, a Western transplant and former chairman of a Beijing auto parts company, wrote in his blog "Managing the Dragon."
Some of China's bigger manufacturers, such as Chery Automobile, have trumpeted their intent to export Chinese-made vehicles to the United States in the next few years. To get there, they'll need to revamp their products to meet stringent U.S. emissions and safety standards.
That's no simple problem. Previous plans to ship Chinese cars to U.S. soil have crumbled. A company called Brilliance missed its goal of launching U.S. sales in 2009. BYD said it would introduce its cars to Americans in 2010, but has pushed their arrival to 2011. Other potential contenders have gone out of business or are struggling to stay afloat.
In 1994, Beijing released a plan to triple auto production by 2000 and reduce imports. The government lured foreign producers to bring their technology overseas and invest in Chinese auto parts firms. It aimed to modernize domestic manufacturing by creating joint ventures with foreign automakers such as GM.
As a result, China's auto sales took off in 2000. In 2002, they crossed the 1 million mark. More recently, the numbers have taken a hit in the economic crisis, forcing companies to curb exports to countries such as Russia and Vietnam.
But after the industry pressed Beijing for a bailout late last year, the central government responded with subsidies and slashed the sales tax on small, fuel-efficient cars, spurring demand. And analysts say the expansion of the country's web of roads and highways -- part of an economic stimulus package -- coupled with a growing middle class could fuel more sales for years to come.
In April, China's vehicle sales jumped 25 percent, compared with a year earlier, to a record monthly high of 1.15 million units. It was the third consecutive month that China has surpassed the United States in sales.
GM, which has two joint ventures in the country, also hit a monthly record in April with its sales jumping 50 percent from a year earlier. The automaker plans to import cars from China starting in 2011, according to a GM plan circulating in Congress.
But in the United States, auto sales fell 34 percent last month. And GM, which has received $15.4 billion in U.S. government loans, says it is likely to file for bankruptcy protection.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/05/17/AR2009051702269.html
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And once the American auto industry disappeared, the Chinese auto will go through the same process as the weaker companies will start losing money and failed. Within a few years, there will only be a handful of auto makers left in China, too.

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True. Innovative will be bought up, lagards will die. And autos like cookies at Walmart with a Walmart price tag.
Someone once said, in China to get their interest they think at least a million units a month to get any attention. Lower costs of government, lower costs on utilities, lower costs on labor and using the world for supplies they will make them considerably cheaper for sure. Give them a few years, and the quality will soar to levels GM could not even imagine.
The most humane thing for GM right now is to put it under and quit adding to the suffering.
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Especially because they don't have to worry about niggling things like pollution controls and worker's rights.
-- Walt
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wrote:

I don't argue that. Lets list them all.
- management costs, grossly excessive and the waste! - questionable moral and ethical issues of management. - pension costs, out of reality. - health costs, stupidly high. - taxes on utilities, property, companies, absolutely out of line. - wages of workers out of control. - wages need to be artificially high for ultra high tax load. Gross is great, net sucks. - union conditions for poor productivity and quality, absolutely anal. - polution and government monitoring costs, crazy stupid. - legal and HR costs, crazy stupid. - companies spend more on BS and hype than real product development. - most of their suppliers have the same problems above.
Add in that not just auto took a wealth hit. The whole country did. And in doing so they have less to spend. Which means they 1) buy less autos and 2) will buy only cheaper ones on average.
Which makes the profitable sale of a GM or Chrysler virtually impossible. And it is irrational to think it is possible.
So do you say to North Americans that they need to be a closed market, extort the consumer that can't pay more to pay stupid prices for autos? So many will not be able to afford to drive any more just to keep union workers and inept management in fantasy land?
Or do you let it go offshore so more people can afford a car so they can go to work and have a life?
Face it, Detroit auto is dead, all that is left is twitching nerves of debt. And I suspect any debt-junkie style managed company like GM & Chrysler will follow. The business needs to be cleaned up without the taxpayer blood sucking.
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<snip>
I think it is damaging to my country and hypocritical of us to instill a host of environmental and human rights controls on our native industries when we know damn well that offshore industries won't follow those controls. There is a certain level of environmental degradation and human misery that we've come to accept as necessary to maintain our way of life, but these things make us uncomfortable when they exist in our own communities - so rather than rethink what's accepted, we export the pollution and sweatshops to the rest of the world, out of sight and out of mind. The economic impact of losing our manufacturing base is, I believe, the least of the problem.
-- Walt
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You're missing the point. Point being liberals don't want other countries to be brought up to the same standards as the U.S. They want the arrogant,evilllll United States to be brought down to the third world level. The slick talking teleprompter reader in the Whitehouse and his puppetmasters in congress are HELL bent on doing as much irreversable damage to this country as they possibly can before they're kicked out of office again.
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wrote:

<snip>
I think it is damaging to my country and hypocritical of us to instill a host of environmental and human rights controls on our native industries when we know damn well that offshore industries won't follow those controls. There is a certain level of environmental degradation and human misery that we've come to accept as necessary to maintain our way of life, but these things make us uncomfortable when they exist in our own communities - so rather than rethink what's accepted, we export the pollution and sweatshops to the rest of the world, out of sight and out of mind. The economic impact of losing our manufacturing base is, I believe, the least of the problem.
-- Walt ----------------------- I hate to say it but the damage to our countries was done over the last 30 years. Time after time suits in the executive offices right down to the union lines blood sucked. Everyone ignored economists because it isn't what they wanted to hear. Denial of reality; as the wealth was traded for debt because it was easier than the truth.
Buffett for example tried to make changes and was stonewalled by incompetant and corrupt executive and board members. Numerous other shareholders tried to put the brakes on GM. While executives fraudulently drove the company past bankruptcy where no company has ever gone so far in the hole.
This is corruption, and it is bringing the whole system down one brick at a time.
Not one person is in jail (yet). Not even arrested or whatever.
Until integrity, honesty, rationality and morality make it back into the board rooms the downward spiral will continue. As the carnage isn't over at all.
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There was something magical to you about 1979? What changed in that year that made it a watershed in your mind?
-- Walt
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wrote:

There was something magical to you about 1979? What changed in that year that made it a watershed in your mind? ==================================================================================== He turned 22, and finally gave up on his attempt to graduate high school.
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Any idiot can graduate from high school in the U.S. It is a requirement to graduate.
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wrote:

=====================================================================================
Any idiot can graduate from high school in the U.S. It is a requirement to graduate. ====================================================================================== That may be true, but "Canuck" isn't your ordinary idiot. He's like an empty house. You can ring the door bell all you want, but no one's home.
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wrote:

=======================================================================================
I don't fit the mould of a UAW/CAW auto wanker. Not only made high school with honours did engineering as well. Grossly over qualified for CAW/UAW membership or GM employment.
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wrote:

Nothing special. The point was the real problems started a long time ago in US auto. Long enough in fact that not a single Detriot auto manager has ever been with a properly run business culture ever.
Because this is about a failing culture. And union rant, strong arming, spiking and the usual BS isn[t going to float this time.
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Impossible. Although I don't live in America, I have been there for several years during my studies, and I see that cars are part of the American way of life. Americans can't exist without cars, because of the long distances people have to travel, and the lack of public transport throughout the larger part of the country. Car manufacturers are facing a financial crisis, true, but Americans still need cars. The production will change drastically, aiming towards more efficient engines and longer-lasting vehicles, together with a reshuffling of priorities within the management. The American auto industry will never vanish. The Chinese auto industry will never catch up or take over, because China entered the race with America too far ahead in development and marketing. The main problem, as always, is the supply of fuel - that will eventually vanish, and so far the alternatives have not exactly been promising.

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You said you want to buy GM car. Have you changed mind?

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