How does Subaru compare to Honda, Toyota, Volvo, others?

Hal:

Regarding reliability/quality, Consumers Reports, which I believe is pretty credible, generally ranks Subaru just a bit below Honda & Toyota but above Volvo. That's consistent with my limited personal experience (5 Honda products, 6 Toyota products, 1 Subaru Outback, no Volvos but have friends who own them and I observe that they have had many more problems than I"ve had with the other cars mentioned above.)

What's a 'statistic significant sample', by the way? I'm aware of the concept of a statistically significant difference between two samples, for example (a difference so large that it is unlikely to occur by chance), but not the concept of a 'statistic significant sample'.

Regards,

Tom in PA

Hello Hal

I just bought a 2000 Legacy L. When looking for a new car - a wagon, helps with the dog... - I was considering Subarus, Volvo V70s and Passat Wagons. I also just helped my mother buy a new car.

To answer your question:

- As per Consumer Reports, Edmunds and all used car guides I looked at, Subarus are more reliable than either the Volvos or Volks, just a bit below Hondas and Toyotas (could be the AWD system being more complex, having small volume, not sure...);

- Subaru dealers I dealt with when buying were from good to horrible/want to punch the guy... Bad experience... :-/ Local dealer is nice, relaxed, but haven't yet had to have car serviced so not sure how they work. Not as high-class as dealer of previous car, 1982 Mercedes, but there was a price associated with that...;

- Parts and service cost for a Subaru is higher than Hondas and Toyotas, but less than Volvos, parts about the same as Volks but there are more Volks independent shops were I live so I could have gotten service cheaper. The gauge I used for that, besides CAA surveys, was the cost of an aftermarket warranty: I used the cost of a 5 years/100

000 km "bumper-to-bumper" warranty as my base and compared the costs: Subaru ~1900$CAN, Volvo was ~3500$CAN, Volks ~2000$CAN, Honda and Toyota ~1700$CAN. Not an absolute number, but an interesting way to copmpare expected future costs...

I ended up making the more practical choice, between the Subaru and Volvo, putting reliability and AWD over comfort (the Volvo seats are soooooo comfy!) and refinement (not dissing my Subaru, love it, will love it a lot longer than I could have loved a Volvo, but the Volvo felt more solid).

Hope this helps.

Nicolas

i'm assuming they're talking about having a sample size (number of respondents, in this case) that is large enough to be able to generate valid statistical inference on the problem. in general, the larger the sample size, the more confident you will be with your statistics.

Consumers Reports uses a minimum 1,500 samples which is significant. I could look up the odds in an old text book I studied years ago but suggest that

While I DO think the CU reports are, in general, useful. Even 1500 samples are not perfectly representative because they are double 'self-selected'. That is, only folks who decided to subscribe (which may be folks with a particular type of personality to start with) AND folks in that group who elected to fill out a survey.(another subset of folks with perhaps even more rare personality type.) AND there is no way to confirm what they report. Not exactly the same as following 1500 folks randomly sampled leaving the dealerships and looking at repair tickets, maitainenece, driving habits,etc.

Carl

1 Lucky Texan

Edward Hayes wrote:

AWD on Subaru is [way] better than that found on Volvo and [any other] japanese cars. Cost of maintenance maybe less than that for Volvo, but definitely higher than for other japs. My experience with Subaru dealer so far was quite good. Service departments are excellent. But, then, my experience with all automotive dealers was quite good. Bike dealers are another story though... Parts departments, oh boy. You should ride a bike to appreciate service at the auto dealers. Parts are found a service is performed almost instanteneously.

To get a really good appreciation of automotive dealers I was told the way to go is order parts at a Triumph dealer.

YMMV.

From my personal experience only, I'd say the reliability and frquency of repair of the Subaru Legacy ('99 2.5GT wagon) is lower than Honda.

I owned 2 Honda Preludes before my current Subaru ('85 11 years,

214,000mi & '91 (bought in '96) 3 years, 140,000mi (70,000 mine)). Both of these cars had significatly fewer problems than my current Subaru, both minor and major.

The '85 Honda ate AC compressors (every 70,000 mi) and needed too many sets of front brake rotors (about the same frequency). The '91 eventually developed an oil-consumption problem that I was unwilling to fix (traded the car).

My Subaru has needed a passenger side cylinder head replacement (burnt valve), welding of a cracked Y-pipe in the exhaust (dealer wanted to replace it for $400), doesn't like to shift out of park when cold (dealer charged $125 to "clean" out spilled drinks but it didn't fix the problem), rust everywhere (non-working tailgate release), replacement of front-wheel bearing (may have been tire-dealer's fault) and it has developed a massive ATF leak.

Do I like the look of this car? Yes, very much. Do I like to drive it? Yes, very much. Am I worried that repairs are going to bankrupt me? Yes, very much.

Mr. Bill