Electric-Assist Power Steering . . .

ChrisCoaster wrote in news:e67b7ec2-6e0a-486e-9424- snipped-for-privacy@i20g2000prf.googlegroups.com:

Good for rear-engined cars, where a belt-driven pump would be way the hell back there, separated by several miles from the steering rack.

Probably also good for reducing drag on the engine under certain circumstances, which is very auspicious in these days of ever more strangulating CAFE regulations.

______________________ This is my reply to someone who responded to me privately, but it fits here:

Obviously you completely missed the 500lb gorilla in the phone booth: HANDLING. Everything you've said about electric steering's simplicity, greenness, and quiet, is true. But currently driving a 2005 Malibu and hearing the reivews about "vague feedback", "numb steering feel", or, "lack of centered-feel", I'd trade all you mentioned in for positive road feedback and a rail-like centered feel. As in a

*vintage* 2003 or 2004 Jetta. I cannot, and will not, wait for a mfg or mfgs to finally get electric power steering, variable assist or not, right. My balloon payment is due on my Malibu next June, and I'll be walking away from that - right into specified Jetta.

And tell me this: If "CAFE" regulations are so important, then how come electric power steering is showing up only in mid-sized(Malibu) and smaller(Jetta, Corolla, etc) cars that get decent mileage in the first place? Until that can be satisfactorily explained, I'll be brushing up on a little German.

Regards,

-CC

______________________ This is my reply to someone who responded to me privately, but it fits here:

Obviously you completely missed the 500lb gorilla in the phone booth: HANDLING. Everything you've said about electric steering's simplicity, greenness, and quiet, is true. But currently driving a 2005 Malibu and hearing the reivews about "vague feedback", "numb steering feel", or, "lack of centered-feel" in that car and in the new Corolla, I'd trade all you mentioned in for positive road feedback and a rail-like centered feel. As in a

*vintage* 2003 or 2004 Jetta with conventional PS. I cannot, and will not, wait for a mfg or mfgs to finally get electric power steering, variable assist or not, right. My balloon payment is due on my Malibu next June, and I'll be walking away from that - right into specified Jetta.

And tell me this: If "CAFE" regulations are so important, then how come electric power steering is showing up only in mid-sized(Malibu) and smaller(Jetta, Corolla, etc) cars that get decent mileage in the first place? Until that can be satisfactorily explained, I'll be brushing up on a little German.

Regards,

-CC

I always hated the excessive centering force that the automotive media decided to equate with "perfromance!" sometime in the 80s. And all the carmakers responded with FWD cars that actually handled like... well... FWD cars that understeer like dumptrucks, but by GOD they had a positive center feel! I find the newer cars with a very tight, but light, steering feel far more pleasant and positive to drive.

The military has been working for years on electrical actuators to replace hydraulics on control surfaces. It is a tough problem. Now, maybe the auto industry can get some help from the millions the AF and others have spent on it, but it is indeed a tough problem. Hydraulics are a mature and proven technology.

Of course, no one is shooting at cars, so battle damage is NOT one of the reasons the auto industry is interested in.

I assume you are talking about total steer by wire (no mechanical connection at all). We will eventually get that. Electric assist is already used by some vehicles. No big deal. I've even owned a car that used it (Saturn Vue). The usual complain about electric assist is that it does not provide good road feel, but often hydraulic assist systems merit the same complaint. I thought the electric assist in the Vue was on par with most recent hydraulic assist systems. It seemed like a good deal to me - no hydraulic pump or hydraulic hoses. The assist motor was mounted to the steering column inside the cabin, not the rack. Everything was in one tidy package.

I have some experience with steer by hydraulics on farm tractors (not just hydraulic assist, but pure hydraulic - no mechanical connection between the steering wheel and the front wheels). When a hose fails, you are screwed :) Oh, and we even have a large lawn tractor with electric assist steering, but it still has the mechanical connection (assist versus fly by wire).

Ed

ChrisCoaster wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@t18g2000prt.googlegroups.com:

Who knows. Lots of possible reasons.

Maybe because CAFE is an average, so the current mileage of any particular model is irrelevant. A 0.1mpg gain per vehicle on a high-volume model would pay off better for CAFE than the same gain on a lower-volume model, even if the high-volume model had much higher mileage to begin with.

It may also be that trucks and large cars have engines that are large and powerful enough that belt-driven pumps rob relatively little of their power compared to cars with smaller engines, so changing to electric wouldn't be worth the effort.

It could also be that the non-electric PS cars are simply using existing technology until it comes their turn at budget time.

______________________ Well I didn't need the "media" to tell me about strongly centered steering with conservative levels of power assist at speeds over

20mph. I've driven cars with those characteristics(as rentals or the vehicle of a friend) over the years and now look back with admiration and preference for that strong centered feel.

And I repeat - until manufacturers can *get* electrical power steering

*right*, I will simply buy and drive cars that have both hydraulic power steering and a good reputatioon for positive road feel and self centering. If that means seeking out a 4 - 8 year old version of a certain model, then so be it, as long as mileage and condition aren't too dear.

-CC

snipped-for-privacy@t18g2000prt.googlegroups.com:

_________________ More "ammunition" against electic power steering (and in a brand new model!):

venza_N.htm

Read particularly the section headed "Steering".

-CC