1987-f150 keeps stalling. Could it be the fuel pump? need help! Please.

"Sasha" wrote: 87 F150 302 EFI dual tanks.

The problem started soon after running the rear tank dry. It starts but stalls right away. If I hold the pedal down it will fast idle then almost stall then surge and almost stall over and over again.

I changed the fuel filter on the front frame. The gas is rusty red and cloudy and leaves a fine sediment when left to settle. I don't know whether I have the in-tank fuel pumps. I don't know where to find the high pressure fuel pump, the reservoir, or the fuel pressure regulator.

I plan to remove the rear tank tomorrow and try to clean it out. If that works I will do the same to the front tank. But I don't know how to troubleshoot this problem. Not even sure it is a fuel issue But i think it is. Can anyone please give me some expert advise? I really need it!!! ______________________________________________

It does sound like it's starving for fuel if it won't go above a fast idle no matter how hard the pedal is pushed.

If it was a bad tank pump it would still run okay on the other tank. Before dropping a tank, run the output of the filter into a bucket for a couple of seconds to see if it is being pumped. This is a good time to reconfirm that the filter is not reversed.

Buy an up-to-date manual or look up the vehicle systems in the reference department of a library.

Good luck.

Rodan.

Check eBay Motors for the "Ford Service Manual" for your truck. (Might be termed the Light Truck Shop manual) You want the Service Manual, not any 'repair' manual. I believe you will find one easily and it won't be expensive. If you do buy one on eBay, make sure your seller ships it to you using Media/Book rate...insist on this or you will pay some outrageous shipping fee. You might still be able to buy a new one at the Helminc dot com site. Possibly your local library might have one.....

Dave S(Texas)

If you think the EGR valve is a PITA to get to on a 302, try a 460!

My 1988 F-250 is in the shop right now for surging and stalling, and the first thing they found was the oxygen sensor was ALMOST out of spec enough to set a trouble code. According to them (and I have anecdotal evidence that they are correct) the EEC-IV engine computer in later years (like 1994) will set a trouble code BEFORE the oxygen sensor makes the engine start running bad, but in earlier years (like 1988) the engire will run poorly due a drifting oxygen sensor long before it drifts enough to set a trouble code.

Ken: Thanks for the reply!!! it seems that I was wrong about the EGR location. It is right in front next to the Air intake valve. I don't know what that thing is directly behind the intake manifold.

Please advise here the final outcome of the repair of your 88 F250.It sounds like the same symptom. I only need to get 6 more months out of this vehicle then I hope to sell it for about $800.00 I have had it since it had 25K miles on it and it now has around 77K . needless to say I don't want to just throw money at by changing parts. I worry that a repair shop will do that and argue that they were all the cause. I do plan on replacing the plugs,wires,coil rotor and dist cap tomorrow.

Rick. email . . . . snipped-for-privacy@nospambellsouth.net

I bought mine with 77K on it. The stupid design big block coolant seals in the timing cover went at about 90K. The alternator went at about 100K. The EGR valve went at about 120K I was hoping to get to 150K without major repairs, but about 130K has the C6 transmission replaced (and it didn't need it!!!). A word to the wise: a intermittently locking and unlocking fan clutch feels (and sounds) a lot like a slipping automatic transmission. So, the transmission might have lasted another 100K or could have failed the next day, no way of telling. The replacement did upshift a lot faster and upped my city mileage quite a bit. At about 140K I started getting a bad exhaust leak due to broken exhaust manifold bolts (a known big block problem). At about 150K the front end got really wobbly and required a major rebuild. At about 155K it started missing and stalling, and while replacing the plugs, wires, cap, and rotor helped, I finally decided to let the experts take a look at it. Your symptoms are worse than mine, I understand there is a little plug-in module in the distributor that can cause all sorts of problems like yours, and isn't too expensive to fix.

Right there is the place to stop and put on a fuel pressure gauge. You can just remove all the mystery in about 5 seconds. Fixing cars is easy when you troubleshoot.

I bought one for about $30 at advance auto, but you can probably bum one at Autozone. I just like having one around, it's so handy.

You need to locate two things. One is the fuel pressure regulator, and the other is a valve on the fuel rail that allows you to check pressure.

Both items will be on the fuel rail for your engine. The regulator should have a vacuum line going to it and you should remove the line from the regulator and inspect it. It should be dry and have no fuel inside it. If there is fuel in there, your fuel pressure regulator has failed and is dumping fuel into the intake manifold causing it to flood and run very rich.

If that's not it, you can verify the fuel pressure at the rail which will validate that your fuel pump is doing o.k. You can rent a gauge that will hook onto that fitting from some auto stores, others you pay $25 and you have your own gauge. Fuel pressure should be around 38psi as soon as you turn the key on and maintain pressure when the engine is started and running. If pressure is not maintained, you could have a bad fuel pressure regulator, a bad fuel pump, or a plugged fuel filter.

That was my first thought, as I've had a fried ignition module cause almost the exact same symptoms in my old 88 Ranger. The engine will start right away, and then stall immediately afterwards, leading me to think that the engine ran out of fuel immediately after starting. A mechanic friend explained the problem like this: the ignition module has two modes of operation, a starting mode that applies no spark advance, which changes over to a second mode immediately after the engine starts for normal engine operation. When the second mode circuitry succumbs to corrosion or whatever, the engine will start up fine on the first (starting) mode and then stall immediately when the second mode fails to take over. He was right on the money in my case, as my truck started right up and ran fine after I followed his advice.

This sounds quite similar to the problem experienced by the original poster, with the only difference being that he was able to keep it running for a little while after it started up, which is something I wasn't able to do for any more than a few seconds. My gut instincts still point to the ignition module though, because my engine definitely did sound like it was running out of gas when it was stalling out. As a result, I also spent a great deal of time concentrating on the fuel system before my buddy tipped me off about the ignition module.

Cheers, Ken

Thank you Mike!!!!!

That's what I'll do in the morning, check the fuel regulator and look for the port on the fuel rail and try to buy the appropriate gauge. Is the fitting before the Fuel regulator or past it? Today i replaced the plugs, wires, Dist.cap and rotor.Fuel filter is new too. Rick

The fitting is somewhere along the fuel rail. Not sure where but the fuel pressure regulator (FPR) on Fords is also usually bolted to the fuel rail. Usually there are two lines to the fuel tank. One is fuel to the rail, one is return to the tank.

In this picture of a ford engine, the fuel pressure regulator is the silver canister with a pipe sticking out the top (for the vacuum line) on the middle left side. The view in the picture is from the rear of the engine. My guess is it's similar to what's on your motor as that's what's on my 89 ranger, and my 90 and 93 tbird.

Thanks Joe, It would be a lot easier if I had a better manual than that pos Hynes. I have a Helms coming in the mail and I don't know how much better it will be. I plan on doing the Pressure test. I also want to trouble shoot this truck because I don't want to waste money on it since I plan on selling it in about three months. This is not my primary vehicle so I can take the time to work on it. If I replaced everything that was suggested It would be a total loss, ha! This is probably a good why for me to get some practical automotive repair experience. I need the suggestions though because I don't have any mechanic friends to ask.

Thanks aga>

Remember the manual you are getting was written for mechanics/technicians... I'd first follow Kens advice about the module. That piece is an easy/cheap fix and maybe you then won't have to fool with the gas delivery system at all...

Dave S(Texas)

Dave And Ken, What do you call cheap it's over $100,00 and it does seem that if I can keep it running and keep it from stalling with the accelerator that is working. I had a trouble last year when my truck just died on the way to work and It cost me $450.00 for troubleshooting and parts. it was that module.

Rick.

Does the problem happen when the engine is cold just after starting? Or does it only show up after the engine has warmed up?

If it happens right off of a cold start as well as when warm, the oxygen sensor doesn't have anything to do with it as the engine will still be in it's cold start loop during which the oxygen sensor isn't an input.

If you want to really eliminate it, just disconnect the oxygen sensor and the EEC will just stay in open loop and run with default values. That way if it's a sluggish oxygen sensor, or just plain bad you eliminate it's false inputs into the system and the computer will just live with it.

Check that fuel pressure and the fuel pressure regulator.

No, it's not. Less than $35....

Wow that is a good price! can you send me a link So I can order it?

Rick