No brakes while driving in the rain

<SNIP>

Don't have that problem in PNW where it rains a lot.

My guess is your pads are bad or your calipers are out of adjustment. Disk brakes should have a very light contact with the rotor even with no brake applied to keep the rotors and pads dry.

RCE

I thought the "calipers out of adjustment" statement was a real hoot.

I would gamble the lining material is too hard, and/or the pads and rotors are severely glazed.

I would also gamble the rear brakes are way out of adjustment.

Remember the combi valve has three functions. Oh and combi is short for combination valve.

Before tandem brakes, the single reservoir/single bore masters pre 65 vehicles used a proportioning valve to give a 60/40-split front to rear.

With the advent of disc/drum we needed to hold the fronts off till the wheel cylinders over come the resistance of the return spring of so a metering valve was introduced., otherwise the vehicles wanted to swap ends.

Then the pressure differential switch was added to let you know, hey you got a leak, will also seal that end off somewhat. Combine all three and you get a combi valve.

Now then it can get more fun. Some vehicles added yet another valve to the system, mostly mini vans, mostly Chrysler products, but some pick-ups as well (should be all in my opinion), a weight sensing valve. It's hooked to the rear suspension and chassis. As the vehicle is loaded it squats, and the valve allows more pressure to the rear brakes. It also cuts braking pressure when empty or when you really nail the brakes, the nose drops, the tail raises as weight transfers, less weight on the rear wheels and we can get lock up, even with antilock..

Early and mid disc/drum fords could be fun to bleed manually. If you pushed the pedal too hard too fast with a bleeder open, the combi can shut the fluid of to that end sensing a leak, what it's supposed to do. But sometimes they got stuck. You might get it to free up by opening the other end of the systems and hitting the brakes, or some times really jamb the pedal hard and fast with all the bleeders shut (make sure the cover is on the master). Sometimes you had to replace the damn thing. This was more a problem with the early steel and cast iron valves; the problem seemed to go away with use of aluminum.

Whitelightning

<SNIP>

Picture this:

You knew your truck wouldn't stop quickly and you hit someone causing serious injury...hmm...........

I'm going to help you a whole lot. :-)

First, your rears stick don't only in the morning; the problem most likely is that they're sticking all the time. The only seem to free up, but instead they're getting hot and fading, making them useless for stopping. The fact that they're drum brakes only makes it worse, because drums don't dissipate heat as well as disks. First, you have to find what's binding and causing them to stick. It's probably a bad e-brake cable. Then, after you replace the bad cable/cables or whatever, I'd recommend that you replace the rear brake shoes and all hardware in the drum, i.e. springs, adjusters, etc.

Now, as to the problem with the brakes not locking up. There's NO reason why they should not lock up. If they never have locked up, then I'd suggest to you that they were never properly bled at the factory, or that your driving style causes these particular brakes to glaze badly. The fact that you've never replaced the pads in 112k miles, as you stated, indicates that a) you use them very lightly, and b) they're obviously glazed and hardened. Go right now and buy good brake pads for the front. Then get someone who knows what they're doing to help you bleed the brake system completely and thoroughly. If they still won't lock up, come back and tell us.

There you go!

CJB

There is no adjustment on the caliper, I hate to tell ya, LOL! As far as the pads are concerned, they are designed to automatically adjust themselves each time the brake pedal is depressed and released, and as they wear down. That is if the caliper piston and the caliper slider pins are not seized and working properly. As far as staying dry, the heat from each pad lightly contacting the rotor as it spins (without the brake applied) is enough to keep the rotor dry.

This sounds more like an issue of the material of the pads and/or shoes and how wore out they are. The front pads may be good but the rear may be worn out (or visa versa). I think you had better stop driving the truck until you get the wheels off and check the pads and shoes out for yourself. At 7 years old, it is probably time for a brake service.

Good luck Sharky

Sounds like a mechanical issue with the parking brake cable/linkage. I'd resolve that post haste.

OK. Does this happen ALL THE TIME or just when it first starts to rain? Here is SoCal it rains very infrequently and oils build up on the roadway. So, when it does rain the first 30-60 minutes are really fun as that built-up oil sheen is brought to the surface by the rain and floats on the surface.

That really makes for fun driving and the first couple of rains in the rainy season make the area freeways look like amusement park bumper car rides.

If you live in an area where it rains year round you have serious issues. I'd inspect the calipers and the pins to make sure nothing is obviously wrong. As the pads wear the piston in each caliper runs out to maintain proper braking so a hung piston would pose a problem. The pads are designed to always be in slight contact with each rotor to maintain enough heat through friction to keep them dry enough to brake adequately.

Regardless, I would start a thorough brake overhaul until you resolve all issues. Braking is the biggest safety issue confronting any driver, duh, and you have a responsibility to yourself, your loved ones and everyone else on the road to make sure your vehicle's brakes are in safe operating condition.

Good luck!

Thanks to everyone for suggestions.

I just have one more quick question- A few of you have mentioned pad and rotor glazing (which sounds plausible to me), but if it is caused by 'driving style', what sort of thing might I be doing to cause this.

I.e., I can overhaul all the brakes and fix everything, but if i still drive the same it'll happen again...

I mull around doing this myself, *but* since it is brakes, and since I'll probably have to get rotors and drums turned anyways, I might just take it in. What do you suppose a 4-wheel brake job (all new friction, turning all surfaces, but assuming nothing is seriously out of whack, such as effed up calipers) would run?

Thanks again.

Fwiw, this little Ranger has been relatively trouble-free in 112,000 miles. I've had other cars give me more grief in 1/4 the miles. I'm impressed.

Pads and shoes with lower metallic content will help.

Humidity, and environmental temperatures have more to do with it than you personal driving habits. Humidity and heat = Rust Humidity and cold = freeze up

Spdloader

You don't happen to drive double-footed, do you? As in with one foot on the accelerator and the other on the brake pedal at all times. My father drives like this all the time and can never understand why he goes through brakes so quickly. Not only that, it has got to be hard on the drivetrain because he rarely lets up on the throttle when he brakes at high speed.

Most people have mixed opinions on brake pad material, personally I prefer semi-metallic so that you don't destroy rotors and drums by the time you need to do your next brake job. The ceramic material seem to be the new item on the market, personally I would avoid them, as well as fully metallic material.

As far as reliability with your Ranger goes, I've owned a 1991 3.0L with

245,000 kms for 4 years, absolutely no problems with the engine except for a recent water pump. Had to rebuild the tranny the first year, but only because the original owner never checked the fluid level in the manual transmission and it overheated on me, ended up with a snapped tailshaft. Other than that, just normal maintenance and eventually I'll have to do some bodywork thanks to the salty Nova Scotia winter roads. I hope you have the same luck with your truck, they're a great little vehicle.

Good luck Sharky

Glazing is caused by overheating the brakes. A lot of folks think that if they just lightly use the brakes, they'll save them. The only problem is if you brake lightly a lot, you're keeping the pads applied for a longer period of time. This heats up the surface of the pads. As they cool, they get hard and slick. That's glazing. You don't have to hit the brakes hard all the time, but don't "ride" them either. It's actually as bad for the brakes to always brake lightly as it is to always brake hard.

As far as price is concerned, I don't trust too many places when it comes to brakes. I felt really bad last summer because of a situation similar to yours. A lady I go to church with asked me to drive her car and tell her where an odd sound was coming from. It was the brake wear indicators. She had a Taurus wagon like the one I used to have, and, from experience, I told her she'd likely need pads at the way around. She took it to a repair shop and they charged her over $900.00 for the job. That was for new pads and rotors all around. They told her she needed new rotors despite the fact that the car had less than 40k miles on it. I had just driven the thing, mind you, and there was NO indication of warping whatsoever.

To make a long story short, if you can do the labor yourself, you won't get gouged. Besides, you'll know exactly what was done and that no one cut corners on your brake job.

Lastly, I love the Rangers. I'm on my second one, and I couldn't be more pleased. Hope yours keeps running for another couple hundred thousand.

CJB

I don't think I lightly touch the brakes a lot, but I'll have to pay attention. I also don't do the downshifting while deceleration like a lot of people do. I *can* do it, but at some point I decided that I'd rather put the wear and tear on the brakes instead of the powertrain.

What's the chance that I could start braking more firmly (but not hard) in normal weather and eventually 'wear off' the glaze from the brakes, thus returning them to a more normal operation?

I used to be more mechanically handy, but about 10 years ago I got bored with it, sold all my tools and haven't touched a nut or bolt since. After recently spending $266 to have a local shop replace my alternator (which I'll admit is a smoking deal), I considered investing some money into tools again.

(Not that I was very motivated to stand out in the driveway and yard that alternator in 25F weather, mind you. Having it installed by the local shop was only about $35 in labor anyways)

Yeah, but brakes are around $20 or so for pads and you need only minimal tools.

I know ceramics are more, but I don't believe in 'em. <smiley crap>

I love my Ranger too, and I hope it'll go at least another 100K. I have a feeling it'll make it, too.

As they say "once you own a truck you can't go back to driving cars", but I suppose I'll put that to the test. I have no complaints about the Ranger, but my next automobile is most likely going to be a Subaru Wagon. Not any time soon mind you (still lots of life left in the Ranger i'm sure), but i've always liked wagons for practicality, and after much consideration and research I think that a Forrester would be the perfect fit for my needs, lifestyle and desires. Hopefully one of the turbocharged ones that's just shy of 300hp, of course.

By then (or even now) my Ranger will have a trade-in value of about nil*, so I'll probably hang onto it for those weekend trips to the hardwarestore/landscaping-greenhouse/dump/recycling facility. The Missus and I nearly purchased a 3.5-acre farmette about a year ago, and a 'truckette' would have been highly necessary.

-phaeton

*- My Ranger started popping paint about 9 months after I bought it. After much battling with a number of dealerships, the manufacturer of the 'paint sealant' crap that i was forced/duped into, there has been no resolve. I know that paint peeling up has been the scourge of the auto manufacturer for the last 20 years, but if anyone's ever fought this battle they know what I'm up against. In any event, i've taken it upon myself to scrape it off the problem areas and primer/repaint with Krylon every 6 months. It's not beautiful, but it's better than doing nothing. In short, the truck will slowly become hideous.

Check your parking brake cables for looseness when the park brake is released. It sounds like you have one that is sticking. You can check this by parking the truck overnight, a couple days, whatever, and then DONT MOVE THE TRUCK. Jack up the rearend (BOTH SIDES). Block the front wheels, and release the e-brake. Check the tension on both cables on the rear. If they both feel loose, then try turning the wheels. If one is froze, pull both wheels off, and pull the drums. See which one is froze to the drum. You will be able to tell this because the rotor wont come off easy, but if you have never had the rotors off, they wont come off easy anyway. But, there will be an outline of the shoe on the drum where it was stuck, and you will hear it snap when you break it loose. After you have done this, pull the e-brake cable loose from the drum, and the pedal where it intersects under the bed. If you can move it back and forth freely, then the problem is in the hardware in the drum.

As for this problem, I experience this at slow speeds around town, but NOT on the highway. Sounds like your pistons are sticking in the caliper and not moving out to take up the slack. Change your brake pads, and shoes. Get your rotors and drums turned, and put SEMI-metallic pads on. I do alot of start-stop driving, so I have pads that grab harder the hotter they get. It works great for city driving. I bought them at O'reillys.