Don't you need zone approval for an incident like this, ie: complete engine
on top of a plausable explanation. Had the same thing with one of my techs,
back in 93 with a Northstar, didn't want to fix it so ran it around the
block, jammed 'er down in park. Of course the pcm recorded the rpm's at
failure, hence no job!
Yes, we do have to get zone approval. In fact, now, anytime you want
a complete unit (whether it be engine, trans, t/case...etc) you must phone
a particular branch of GM in order to get the item. And of course, you
have to jump through the hoops, lots of documentation..etc.
Fortunately, our shop foreman has a very good rapport with the
DSM and seems to be able to shove things like this through. He's
very honest, and keeps our warranty quite low, and is always looking
for ways to save GM money ( I disapprove of this part).
I don't know what story they came up with on this one. It's an
obvious "f**k*p" as far as I'm concerned, but oh well...things
I guess it wasn't destined to reach 280,000 miles was it? Sad......
1991 Pontiac Bonneville LE
3800 V6 ( C ), Black/Slate Grey
~~~The Former Fleet ~~~
89 Cavalier Z 24 convertible
78 Holiday 88 coupe
68 LeSabre convertible
73 Impala sedan
Yeah, it is too bad, as it's a great engine. I'm keeping an eye on
this one, and if GM doesn't want it back, I figure I can scavenge
everything but a cylinder block and one, possibly two connecting
rods. The connecting rods broke in the center, so there will be
no damage to the crank. Eventually, I should be able to build
a complete engine.
good God..... how does the service manager explain that one to the
car's owner? kinda reminds me of when I had my truck at the local
tranny shop for a warranty issue... came back at the end of the day,
tranny was in the build room... "your truck won't be ready today".
Cadillac owners are a curious breed. They don't seem to get too
excited...as long as the vehicle gets fixed in the end. Plus, they are
given rentals out the ying yang whenever stuff like this happens, or
if they are in for pretty much any repair.
It would have been interesting to hear what the story was that
was told to the customer. In any case, the piston slap will be gone!
I tell you what, I'm a picky SOB. Especially with my cars. There's one
dealership Im not legally allowed near for beating a tech to the point he
probably doesn't turn a wrench with out seeing my face.
Blow my engine, You aint dropping in a good wrench service replacement.
You better be calling MY engine builder, and getting one to my specs. Free
of charge to me as well.
When the tech puts drywall screws in the floor of my car to fix lose
carpeting, instead of adheasive, or replacing it as should have done (3rd
time issue), I got a bit pissed. A few of my sustomers would shoot a person
for crap like that.
So you "physically" beat some tech up? That's a great way to
deal with things, Charles! Fortunately, in our shop, if someone
tried that, they would be dealing with more then "one" tech.
In the case of this engine, you wouldn't have any choice. It's not the
customer's call as to what they get for a new engine. The customer
is getting a brand new Cadillac engine, not a "goodwrench" engine.
Most Goodwrench service engines are brand new engines....there
are a few (like the 3800 engines) that are horrible cobbled together
rebuilts, but we like them about as much as you do.
You wouldn't get very far in our dealership with that attitude.
We'd probably "fire" you as a customer.
| You wouldn't get very far in our dealership with that attitude.
| We'd probably "fire" you as a customer.
I suspected, based on my own experience, that this sort of culture of treating
a paying customer in this manner existed at GM. Nice to see it confirmed.
There is just one significant problem with this. You don't pay the
customer...the customer pays you! The one doing the paying is the only one
with the power to "fire".
There is a certain small percentage of customers that are nothing
but a pain in the ass, and certainly not worth the time spend on
attempting to please them. I don't know what you do for a living,
but I can guarantee that this type of customer exists in every type
of business, and the smart ones "fire" this type of customer. It doesn't
happen very often in our dealership, but every now and then a
customer steps over the line, and we won't deal with them anymore.
We do have that power, James.....and there isn't anything wrong
with using it. This idea that the "customer is always right, even when
acting like a total asshole" is ridiculous. These type of customers
always say, "I'll take my business elsewhere"....to that I say, "go,
see how far the other folks will put up with your shenanigans".
We've had certain people that have been basically blacklisted
from almost every GM dealership in the city. Nobody "needs"
that kind of customer.
Here's the long story. I not only knew the owners of this dealer for
over 10 years, we bought all our buick there, as did our buick owning
We used to get great service there. Untill a few years ago. They know
Im a Professional Mechanic. The owner of the dealersip owns two cars I did
build up's on.
This same tech, had given me problems before about repairing things
under warrantee. I even knew the guy personally. So I asked the service
manager to not send my car to him for repairs. There are 30 other techs
their that could have worked on it. When the service manager refused, I
asked the dealership owners to do so. They promanced they would do that.
The Dealership knew I would not accept any jurry rigging. Especially
after the third time. Im sure GM doesn't approve of 3 inch long Drywall
screws being driven thru the rocker panels. The dealership owners knew I
only bought this used car from them while rebuilding my credit so I could
buy another new car from them. They knew in 3 years I would be back to buy,
if not sooner. Heck I had just brought a friend of mine in the week before
who bought a brand new century for asking price with no haggling.
The dealer had the car for one week. I get a call saying it's ready. I
leave work, and get my G/F to take me to pick it up. Being just off work, I
avioded the show room, and went in thru the service entrance.
I ask the Casheir for my paper work, and if I owed any non-warranty
cost. I get charged $2.50. Which I assumed was for a can of adheasive (such
as 3M #77). I walked thru the service department out to the parking area
for repaired cars. Avoiding the show room as I looked like I had worked for
a week with out sleep. (who really wants to see that in a show room?)
As I walk thru I hear snickering for said tech, and the service manager.
I just keep walking. I get in my car, do not even look at the passengers
side carpet. I was in a hurry to get back to work. I had someones car on the
rack torn apart.
When I go to leave work, I took the time to inspect the passengers side
floor, where the issue occured. Not only is the carpet not under the rocker
trim molding as it is supposed to be, there are visible screw heads showing.
In the carpeting.
The next day I call the service department about this, and get aksed
not to come back again. This really makes me mad. So call #2 was to the
dealership owner. I asked them what I had done to get asked that, and why
an improper repair like that was prefromed. I was informed by him that I had
walked thru the service department threating that "if my car aint right Im a
goona kill people" Something I never had done, nor said.
Later that night I was at a bar I go to often, and in walks the tech
in question. Who has the gull to sit next to me. He started talking smack,
and down he went. I hate fighting, but at times it is needed.
Yes I did break his jaw, and his nose. He filed a restraining order
against me, so I can not leggally go on the property of any shop he works
at. He also got a life time ban from the bar for coming in and inciting a
fight. I am still welcome there.
If my engine fails due to no fault of the tech, what GM installs will be
fine. Execpt it will be sold asap.
If a tech screws up my engine, and causes it to blow, it's is the
responcibility of the dealership to replace the engine, with one acceptible
to me, not GM's problem.
If I blow the engine, due to my own fault I will replace it on my
I never have an attitude untill one is given to me first. Often when I
take a car in for service I am respectfull dressed. I explaine to the
service write what the issues are, in detail. Fill out the paper work, make
sure I didn't leave any personal effects in the car that I may need before
it's returned (parking passes, cell phone charger, ect). Once done I hand
the keys over, and make sure I left both my contact numbers again.
What causes me to get an attitude is when a tech or a service manager
tries to explaine I do not know what I am talking about. A good example of
this is when my alternator was going out. I took the car in, and explained
what it was doing. Low charge when headlamps were on, headlamps dim &
flickering at idle, squeal from alt rear barring, visible arcs in low light
from rear of alt.
The service manager tried to tell me all of this was normial, and I was
being too picky. After listening to him, I asked if it is normial to have
to use a booster pack to start a newer car. He replied with the comment "you
don't know your ass from a hole in the ground".
Yea when he gave me that attitude, I went over his head. Made them fix
it to my standard of accptible. I was a nice guy till insulted.
Funny thing is, I have never had a problem at any other dealership. I
don't bring my cars in for things like a worn or crakced serpentine belt
when they have 55K miles and expect them to replace it for free. I do that
sort of stuff my self.
As for firing, I now go to a different dealership for my car
purchases. As do my friends. That dealership has lost atleast 2 new cars
sales per year, and 3 used cars sales per year. As well as revenew
generated from service work.
No, more like "damn it all". I ribbed him a bit this morning when
I brought in a 2004 Venture van with a blown motor. The engine
was squealing like crazy (motor had no oil pressure and probably
spun a bunch of bearings). Some of the other techs came over
to see what all the noise was, and I casually said, "oh, I was just
doing a decarb procedure".....got that far and looked over at
the other fellow. He took it all in good humour.
> Looking at that casting I see GM is still buying a LOT of recycled
The aluminum castings are much better then they used
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