Toyota aims to replace GM as the largest automaker in the world

What does GM expect? Hell, they're moving more and more of their production to Mexico! The goddamn Avalanche and Silverado trucks are made in Mexico. Most Toyotas and also most Hondas are almost all made here in the US. They can't expect loyalty if they move production out of the USA. For the time being, I'll continue driving American cars, the ones built here anyway.

"John Horner" wrote in news:WM3qc.80792$ snipped-for-privacy@nwrddc03.gnilink.net:

Can't compete with factories in countries that don't have to pay taxes to the govenment, or pay their employees enough so they can pay income tax and social security. Social Security payments by employer and employee alone add about 15% to the price of an american made car. If they taxed imports for those items it would be a different market.

Then to make matters worse when they add on "Value Added" (Sales tax).

Mike:

I do not know about Toyota, but Honda has 2 Engine plants here in Ohio. As well as a vehical assembly plant. From what I understand some Honda's are over 40% US made parts content. Not as bad as they used to be. Toyota & Honda are in the US market for good, like Diamler-Chrysler.

I my self attempt to buy as many made in the USA products as possible. Although in the TV, home adudi, car audio, and clothing departments,you really have no choise. Even shoes, and work boots.

If you look in my tool boxes (2 roll aways, and a top box, plus 5 smaller boxes), you will see 95% of the tools are US Made. The other 5%, I have a German made pair of pliers (knipex), a Japan made Blue Point Impact, and some M-B wrenches.

If you shop at Wal-Mart a company that claimed they supported US manufactors, you will see 75% of non food items are made out side the USA. Even Zebco reels! Charles

True, but there are costs associated with moving factories to Mexico or elsewhere: shutting down perfectly good plants here in the US (loss of capital they had tied up in factories here), having to build new factories in Mexico, additional costs for transporting some of the materials there and for transporting the finished products back here, having to move key employees down there to oversee operations, plus losing long term market share (by pissing off American consumers who prefer their cars to be built here instead of in Mexican sweatshops) and by an ever increasingly less afluent American base (caused by our jobs being sent to foreign countries). All of these are costs/factors associated with producing vehicles in other countries. I'd be interested to know how much exactly (by percentage) American auto manufacturers actually save (after taking all of the above into consideration) by moving south of the border. I bet it's a relatively small amount, 3 or 4%, but even this small savings will make the greedy bean counters want to move to Mexico, even though the long term economic impact to the co. is going to be severe.

No big loss. I could live without Ford.

(snip)

Blah blah blah.

Corporate concerns aren't the reason to buy car *made* in the U.S. Corporations are always asses. What's important is that in an era of companies firing 3000 employees here and 5000 here, Toyota and Honda are providing thousands of stable jobs to U.S. employees with no plans to move them offshore. GM? Couldn't care at all about U.S. labor. Pretty soon, GM will be nothing but a front for a large importation company.

Those factories also require lots of maintainence and support/logistics, as well as transportation. All with U.S. labor that feed money into the local economy and not into someplace in India or Indonesia or Mexico.

That's all bull. Toyota and Honda do just fine in the U.S. GM and Ford's continual whining is annoying. They just want more profit, pure and simple.

Along with being by far the world's most profitable automaker, Toyota is also the one most valued by shareholders. The total value of Toyota's stock was $113 billion when the market closed last week.

That's more than double the combined value of GM ($25 billion) and Ford ($27 billion). And it's nearly as much as the combined values of DaimlerChrysler ($43 billion), Nissan ($40.5 billion) and Honda ($39 billion).

GM has no one to blame but themselves... Anyone remember the 'road to redemtion' campain? Finally admitting they built crap for years and now they want people to trust them again? The old saying 'Fool me once... Fool me twice...'

Sounds like a boxer before a fight saying how he's going to win. Funny thing is, both boxers claim to be the future victor, but only one ends up that way. As far as actual fact right now, GM is still the heavyweight champion of the world. We'll see what happens later, but I'll wait to see.

** To email a reply, please remove everything up to and including the underscore in my email reply header.

When will all these companies realize that when they move jobs overseas to build products there and ship them back, they are cutting their own throat? sooner or later there will be no more americans with jobs (because they have all been outsourced!) to buy their products, and at that point they can't even sell them in the 3rd world countries they are built in since they have been paying them pennies a day and wouldn't be able to afford a $30K truck even with their entire lives earnings!

This is exactly why our economy is in a recession despite indicators that show otherwise.

When a large company shuts down a factory or fires a few

*thousand* people at once, it causes a micro-depression in the local area as there are far too many people for the available jobs.

The lucky ones get lower paying jobs. The rest get evicted or have to move elsewhere, or end up on welfare or other social programs. Entire cities have imploded because of this.

It all trickles into the local areas, and if there are multiple companies doing it in an area, it can literally collapse the economy of an entire county or section of a state. Currently, the economy of the U.S. is riddled with hundreds of these "sinkholes" and it's dragging the rest of us down.

In terms of profitability, customer perception and investor perception Toyota has already won.

GM forgot how to really lead in the 1980s and shows little sign of ever regaining it's former glory.

John

Compared to GM's gasket problems that they still refuse to properly address? I'd take a Toyota engine anyday over a

3.1 or 3.4 GM engine.

I must be really, Really, REALLY Twisted. I like the Majority of GM products made from The erly 80's to the mid 90's.

Look at them old 80's Cavaliers. I still see heards of 1.8 1982 Cavaliers on the road, chugging on. The later 80's models are better mechanically. But you just can't beat the box car J bodies.

Even the Citations X-11's are kind of cool. Imaging dropping a 3.4 Twin Dual cam in it (Z-34 2 cams per head V6).

The 80's were the best years for Chevy Full Size 73-87 C/K and 88 to 91 R/V (R=2WD C-30 Cab & Chassis, Blazer, & Suburban, V=4WD).

The 80's is when GM brought out the Astro, the Real Mini-Van. RWD, Guts enough to tow, and suspension that handles a load.

The 80's saw some of the best looking F-cars made, and some of the best Handling.

The 80's also brought us the LT-5 Powered ZR-1 Corvettes, a Murcrusier Marine Engine. Murcrusier engines in boats make me drool. Drop one in a car, better bring buckets, and lots of them baby!

And how can we forget the one year only Tubro 3.1 V6 Gran Prix? Sleeper FWD!

Or the Ultra Cool rides. Like the GN-X, the GMC AWD Brother the Typhoon & Syclone. Or the Ultra Wicked Turbo Trans Am

Maybe GM just didn't do enough advertising in the 80's, cause the rides kicked ass, and make most of todays production look like crap in a diper. Charles

Sludge can be dealt with easier than a blown gasket.

"Joseph Oberlander" wrote in message news:lCFqc.1196$ snipped-for-privacy@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...

Are you sure?

"Do I need the engine replaced? Since Toyota has started the Special Policy Adjustment for model years between 1997 - 2001 this page will pertain to owners of earlier engines with the problem. If you have an engine with the sludge problem and it's one of the models covered by the Special Policy Adjustment for "gel" then contact the dealer for assistance. Automotive News article 4/3/02 & 2/8/02 I get a lot of questions about owners being told that because of engine sludge build-up they now need an new engine. In some cases that is true so lets offer some examples and see where you fit in. Engine sludged and the motor will not turn over. You need a motor, the cost of repairing that one will exceed the cost of a new short block assembly. When the engine is torn down for removal they will check the cylinder head assemblies for damage and you may need to have more work done. Engine sludged and the motor makes fairly loud noises when its running. You need to replace the short block and maybe the cylinder heads. Once the engine is torn down for removal will they know for sure if the cylinder heads and associated parts are good or bad. Engine smokes and runs but does not have any noise. You probably have a good engine and all that needs to be done is cleaning the engine. It sounds easy but its labor intensive to do a good job. It really is not all that difficult (again if the engine is quiet when running). NOTE: Before starting the repair make sure you have all the parts you need or a way to get them once the engine is apart. The best way to clean the engine of sludge is to follow this formula:

1) Get the engine hot. 2) Take off the valve covers and using Diesel fuel in a spray bottle, spray the cylinder heads and other sludged parts. The Diesel fuel, when applied to a hot or very warm surface, will actually make the sludge flow off the parts and then using a scrub brush of some type start brushing the area and it will make it look new. 3) Now that Diesel fuel and sludge will wind up in the oil pan and that needs to come off also and be cleaned. 4) You then need to replace the oil pump pick-up screen (cleaning may work if you are careful), the valve cover (Covers if V-6) will normally need to be replaced. Cleaning the valve covers is difficult since the vented area toward the top of the cover can't be cleaned. 5) Clean the intake as well as you can, change the oil and filter, PCV valve and once together run the engine for a short time, then replace the oil and filter again to be safe. You will probably need to clean the throttle body to allow the engine to idle, the sludge will build up a varnish that may prevent base idle. If things were not to bad to begin with you can probably get it done for as little as a couple of hundred dollars if you "repair" some parts instead of replacing them. Some dealers take the cylinder head off others do not. Taking them off does a better job but adds to the cost, cleaning on the engine should be good for the repair. Some are saying that the piston rings should be replaced. Since the problem is a sludge problem which is results in oil laying on metal surfaces the piston rings are not affected and do not need to be replaced. " "Sludge buildup causes engine performance to deteriorate and, in extreme cases, causes engines to seize."

"Hundreds of other angry customers, some claiming repair bills as high as $8,000 and stuck with vehicles they were still paying for but couldn't drive, have vented their anger on the Internet or taken their complaints to lawyers."

"Parry said he has measured the temperature of the cylinder block and heads. He said the block runs at 190 to 210 degrees Fahrenheit, while the heads typically reach 260 to 270 degrees.

Parry, who says he has repaired about 30 sludge-filled Toyota engines since

1998, contends the V-6's cylinder head temperature is too high because Toyota reduced the size of coolant passages in the head gaskets.

He says that makes for a hotter, cleaner burn, but also causes sludge to build up because the oil gets too hot. Also, Parry says, sludge develops as the oil passes back into the block, which is running 60 to 70 degrees cooler. "

"We took our year 2000 Toyota Sienna Van (22,989 miles) in for a checkup at Crescent City Toyota because on 1/13/02 p.m.our "low oil pressure" warning light came on. After immediately checking the oil, the van had burned through 4 quarts of oil after an oil change had just been done at 22,911 mileage and gray smoke was seen exiting the tailpipe upon engine startup. We took it to Crescent City Toyota first thing 1/14/02 a.m. The service dept at Crescent City Toyota checked it out, performed a "15,000 mile checkup", re-changed the oil and said they found nothing wrong and sent us on our way. We stressed that it was very important that it was thoroughly checked since my wife and toddler daughter would be taking a road trip out of state on the road alone. They said it was ok. On 1/28/01 a.m. the "low oil pressure" warning light came on again at 24,000 miles and the oil was very low upon immediately stopping and checking.

We filled it with oil and revisited Crescent City Toyota where they now say we need a new engine because the oil had built up inside the valves due to neglecting to change the oil. Cost: $5,000. Why did they not find this on

1/14/02? Burning an engine out seems highly peculiar on a 1.5 year old vehicle with only 24,000 miles." (this site herehas quite a few toyota car problems)

Those are automated assembly plants. The parts all come from Japan.

IMHO, Toyota's biggest talent is in marketing...convincing the press and the public that their rather undistinguished cars are high quality. The Camry seems to be a decent enough car, but the rest of their line up is nothing to write home about. Their trucks are pathetic, and their cheaper cars are, well, cheap cars.

Where did those figures on company stock value come from? A Toyota press release? Smells more than a little fishy to me.

From the Detroit Free Press - the largest newspaper in Detroit and the state of Michigan (Home of GM/FORD)!!!

Here is the link:

Scroll down about half way thru for the following paragraph:

Along with being by far the world's most profitable automaker, Toyota is also the one most valued by shareholders. The total value of Toyota's stock was $113 billion when the market closed last week. That's more than double the combined value of GM ($25 billion) and Ford ($27 billion). And it's nearly as much as the combined values of DaimlerChrysler ($43 billion), Nissan ($40.5 billion) and Honda ($39 billion).