Re: Lisa Horton is One Smart Woman: SUVs Stink

It never ceases to amaze me the ignorance on a subject that can be propagated by the media. My jacked up redneck SUV with big tires can take any corner on any road at the posted speed limit. Explain to me why that is not enough to be safe.

Nomen Nescio wrote:

You need to quit watching the news, SUV's don't roll over as easily as the anti-SUV crowd says. Think about it, Suburbans, Blazers, Broncos, Scouts, etc have been around since the 50's and 60's, I took my drivers test in a '79 Blazer, they didn't roll over then, they weren't unsafe then. The problem now is the drivers not the SUV's. The most dangerous vehicle I ever owned was a minivan. Bad brakes, poor acceleration, poor handeling. Going down mountain roads my brakes would fade to the point of non working at the bottom of the hill. Had to slow down 5-10 below the speed advisory sign on highway on ramps or it would lean way over. That was a '92 minivan with all the modern stuff, ABS, rack and pinion steering, front wheel drive with AWD. In contrast the '79 Blazer was an old fashioned truck and I drove it like any teenager with a v8 witha 4 barrel carb :) and never came close to rolling it over. That 79 Blazer got 14MPG up and down the hills of WV, I don't know the highway milage, but it didn't have OD so it probabally wasn't much better. The 92 Minivan got 16-18 city and 25 highway, the highway milage was acceptable, but the city was not espically when you consider the poor acceleration. My 88 S-10 hit 27MPG highway with a load of wire racks and tools under an aluminum cap, granted it was a manual transmission with no AC but also had no cruise. My parents had a 93 chevy blazer at the same time we had the minivan, it would get between

20-25mpg, it was about 3" shorter than the minivan so it blocked less poeples views as well. I feel much safer shareing the road with SUV's than I do minivans. Now when I talk about SUV's I mean real ones with frames and RWD. So many of the new ones really are FWD minivans labeled as SUV's with all the poor performance of a minivan to go with it. The truck based SUV's are some of the better vehicles out there, why? because their driveline components are oversized. Trucks are made to carry loads and the brakes and suspension have to be sized to account for that extra weight. SUV's by being built off those same truck frames get to share some of the biggr brakes and springs. The magazine tests won't show it but I've saved the life of many honda drivers by trading my mini van for a truck that can stop when they cut me off because their little car can fit in the space in front of me.

what's with the Latin, guy who doesn't know his own name ? you were saying the same thing ad nauseam ad infinitum not "to the point of " ad nauseam, ad infinitum. If you are going to be pretentious, at least be correct and pretentious.

Dave Milne, Scotland '99 TJ 4.0 Sahara

"Nomen Nescio" wrote in message news: snipped-for-privacy@dizum.com... : >Not being an SUV driver, I'd simply steer out of the way, knowing that I : >can actually turn sharply without rolling over. With any luck, it would : >be rainy, or on a curve, and I could see evolution in action as a bonus. : >

: >Lisa : : Lisa, you scored with me. Taking on hundreds of redneck bozos takes guts. : : You must have been reading my posts, because I have said the same thing : over and over and over again, almost to the point of ad infinitum & ad : nauseum. : : Building cars in the 2000's with the balance (or lack of) of cars discarded : to the rubbish bin in the 1920's is the epitomy of hilarity. I never cease : to be amazed that so many fools are blowing their wads on those tipsy SUVs. : : The problem with SUVs isn't fuel consumption. Its your gas. You can burn : it with a match for all I care. The problem is you SUV owners are going to : kill somebody with it because you are scared shitless to whip that steering : wheel back and forth to do a collision advoidance. You have no alternative : but to plow at full speed directly into some defenseless car full of kids : because if you try anything like steering around an emergency situation you : will flip and kill yourself first, before continuing your death slide into : your victims' car and taking them out as well. : : There is a way. If it can be reasonably demonstrated (51%) that you could : have prevented a fatal by manuevering, but you didn't, I would charge you : with frustrated manslaughter. Even though its really your SUV's fault : because it steers like a battleship. I would also hold the manufacturer : accountable for peddling off an accident waiting to happen. Prosecute some : of those executives for conspiracy to commit unmitigated manslaughter. : Don't fine them...they've already made monetary allowances for fines and : judgments in the overcharges. Don't those trash heaps cost $30,000 and up? : : One more thing for you out there that don't read my posts regularly. You : already know how tipsy SUVs are. But its worse than you think. When they : are loaded to maximum gross weight, including the roof rack load, they are : MORE TIPSY. And when fuel is minimum, they are MORE TIPSY YET. All things : considered, they are much much worse than you thought and worse than : CONSUMER REPORTS THINK ALSO. I suggest all you SUV owners organize and : launch a class-action suit to recover all the unused value (as if they had : any to start with) left in your SUVs, based on a straight-lin 10 year : depreciation. It will bankrupt the lenders, dealers, and manufacturers! : Take the money and run before you flip and kill yourself or ram somebody : and go to prison penniless. : : Federal Government: In between wars, set up the DOT so it regulates and : certifies cars for roadworthiness just like you did private airplanes back : in the '30s. Don't let any cars be sold for the road unless they are : triple safe. :

uhhhhh . . . because there's zero margin of error? -Dave

"redneck bozos" How do you figure that one?

Foksk who call Ms. Horton on her goofiness are redneck bozos for some reason?

I never cease

Many people are amazed by things that they can't comprehend.

The problem is you SUV owners are going to

Perhaps you would be scared shitless but many folks that can actually drive certainly aren't.

You have no alternative

situation you

Bullshit.

Same damn thing happens with tractor trailers. The drivers can't control the things so they just barrell right on thru any problem and don't care who they kill. That's why we need much stiffer penalties for traffic violations involving massive vehicles. Some psychopath caught driving a 7000 pound excursion at 80 mph or more should do a few months in the can and lose their DL permanently.

My SUV Isuzu Bighorn (read Trooper if you're in the US), at 1980 Kg and big brakes stops faster than my Nissan Laurel at 1275 Kg. in a crash with the Bighorn, impact speeds will b lower, giving both vehicles occupants more chance of surviving. The 2.8L Turbo Diesel in the Bighorn uses less fuel than the 2L petrol in the Sedan. Add to that the fact that my Bighorn can get right up the creek to the camp and I don't have to haul my dead deer 8 Km to the nearest road a car can manage and I'll stay with the SUV.

Suggesting that all SUV's are dangerous just because the handling properties accredited to a curious narrow track, high c-o-g Japanese style jeep (a Suzuki, but laterly known as the Geo Tracker) led to a succession of rollovers and fatalitites in the hands of idiots is kinda like suggesting that all cars are based on the Chevrolet Corvair (the car that spawned the book "Unsafe at any speed") and, as such, should be banned from use on public roads.. all vehicles are dangerous to the occupants and others if in the 'wrong' hands.. as long as the SUV driver engages sense at the same time as selecting 4WD, and the 'Hot' Honda Civic driver activates sense as well as the 1000 watt stereo and the 'hydraulic' suspension, we should be able to all get along without killing each other..

-- History is only the past if we choose to do nothing about it..

alternative

You might want to GoogleGroups on our fine Latinate friend.

Searched Groups for author:nomen author:nescio. Results 1 - 10 of about 73,200. Search took 1.23 seconds.

[bate snipped]

You ever drive a tractor trailer?? You ever see how many stupid drivers there are out there???

I was riding in a buddy's semi last week on a run... We were aproaching a split in the interstate. 2 lanes go straight, 2 lanes exit to the right. We were in the right hand lane for the straight pair. When we get to the split a person in a car that was in the far right lane of the right split realized that they were going the wrong way. They slammed on their brakes and swerved sharply over into our lane. When you're driving a 80,000 truck that's doing 60MPH and a car pulls in front of you doing 20 you do not have many choices. There's no way you can stop quick.... If you swerve sharply, you can jacknife the trailer or worse yet roll the thing on it's side both of which would cause a major accident and block the road for hours. Fortunatly, in this case, there was no one on our left and the guy driving was able to gently swerve around the offending car.....

It's not that semi drivers do not care... All that I've met are courtous and professional drivers. The bigger issue is that people driving smaller vehicles do not know or understand that a tractor trailer does not react or handle like their car.

Mike

Shoot, I thought it wuz just plain fun to run over the "size challenged" cars. I must admit that it can be difficult to pick them out of the frame rails when I get home, though....

Really, driving around D.C. in a small car is the pits. People cut you off and are, in general, very rude drivers. Driving my old Jeep, people tended to be a bit more cautious. Perhaps it was the fact that when they looked out their back window all they seen was rubber and differential. = )

Here is a concept -- how about everyone driving like there is a police car directly behind them. I think that there would be a significant reduction in auto accidents and traffic jams.

IOW, drive as courteous as you would like others to be.

-- Joe

Shoot, I thought it wuz just plain fun to run over the "size challenged" cars. I must admit that it can be difficult to pick them out of the frame rails when I get home, though....

Really, driving around D.C. in a small car is the pits. People cut you off and are, in general, very rude drivers. Driving my old Jeep, people tended to be a bit more cautious. Perhaps it was the fact that when they looked out their back window all they seen was rubber and differential. = )

Here is a concept -- how about everyone driving like there is a police car directly behind them. I think that there would be a significant reduction in auto accidents and traffic jams.

IOW, drive as courteous as you would like others to be.

-- Joe

Shoot, I thought it wuz just plain fun to run over the "size challenged" cars. I must admit that it can be difficult to pick them out of the frame rails when I get home, though....

Really, driving around D.C. in a small car is the pits. People cut you off and are, in general, very rude drivers. Driving my old Jeep, people tended to be a bit more cautious. Perhaps it was the fact that when they looked out their back window all they seen was rubber and differential. = )

Here is a concept -- how about everyone driving like there is a police car directly behind them. I think that there would be a significant reduction in auto accidents and traffic jams.

IOW, drive as courteous as you would like others to be.

-- Joe

Shoot, I thought it wuz just plain fun to run over the "size challenged" cars. I must admit that it can be difficult to pick them out of the frame rails when I get home, though....

Really, driving around D.C. in a small car is the pits. People cut you off and are, in general, very rude drivers. Driving my old Jeep, people tended to be a bit more cautious. Perhaps it was the fact that when they looked out their back window all they seen was rubber and differential. = )

Here is a concept -- how about everyone driving like there is a police car directly behind them. I think that there would be a significant reduction in auto accidents and traffic jams.

IOW, drive as courteous as you would like others to be.

-- Joe

On Mon, 20 Oct 2003 01:00:03 +0200 (CEST), the following appeared in rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys, posted by Nomen Nescio :

Gee, so can I. Imagine that...

Only if you missed the curve.

She had to be told? Not very proficient, are you? ("Put it back in the sand...")

Especially for anonymous posters.

Why? Did you see her puke?

Leave out the "almost", moron.

Bye, now...

Amen to that. 80% of all accidents between cars and large trucks are caused by the car drivers, that is a statistical fact. Anyone who doubts it can look up the stats themselves.