CEO: Toyota vehicles lacked passion, must be more exciting

Obviously that's silly, but there is certainly SOME subjectivity.

But when it comes to comparing across makes and models, we need not worry about that, unless there is a consistent tendency in reporting...

For example, would you expect Toyota customers to over-report reliability compared with, say, Ford owners?

If reliability is a '9' for Toyota and a '7' for Ford (just making up numbers of course), could you explain away the difference due to 'subjectivity'? If so, what would your argument be that Toyota owners are over-reporting the reliability of their cars?

I would expect Buick owners to over-report reliability compared to anyone.

That's because Buick owners buy their cars then store them in the garage.

Until and unless the "ownership reliability survey" is normalized for miles driven, age group, and use of the vehicle (kids, hauling, traveling salesman, taxi/courier, etc.), then it's just so much garbage.

And that's proven by Buick's consistent top ranking. There is no way the Buick, which is identical to the Chevy and is made by the same company and built in the same factories by the same union workers that are managed by the same GM management, is overall any better or more reliable than the identical Chevy model.

In message , C. E. White writes

In this months Which survey the order from most to least reliable is, Very Good,

Honda. Daihatsu. Toyota. Mazda. Suzuki. Good, Mitsubishi. Hyundai. Subaru. Porsche.

Average,

Mini. Nissan. Mercedes-Benz. Skoda. Ford. BMW. Chevrolet. Kia. Volvo. Jaguar. Seat. Daewoo. Proton.

Poor,

Volkswagen. Vauxhall. Smart. Citroen. Audi. Jeep.

Very Poor,

Peugeot. Saab. Fiat. MG. Alfa Romeo. Chrysler. Rover. Renault. Land Rover.

In message , Clive writes

GM must have really done a number on SAAB. The one I had back in the early 80's was a great car.

You know, even if NOTHING else were stupid about that list, the fact that Mitsubishi is in the "very good" category would render the whole thing suspect.

I think Mistu was in the "good" category. It's in approximately the same spot that Consumer Reports put it.

Compare that to the many thousands of owners who were stranded because VW didn't have enough supply on hand to take care of the issue.

...and regular wheel bearing replacement, and regular electrical problems, and...

That reminds one of Toyotas unsettled sludge problem LOL

the only wheel bearings I've had issues with were the rears; those are a little undersized in the later cars, but being completely conventional it's trivial to repack them with synthetic grease. Now a misadjusted parking brake will cause wheel bearing failure. Only had problems on two cars though - one was my mom's car which had a bad wheel bearing when she bought it, she drove it for another... oh... 15 years without any more issues. The other was my '84 GTI which ate a LR wheel bearing because the e-brake cable had rusted up. The fronts I've never had issues with - only replaced one, ever, and that was on a "barn car." No electrical problems, either. Drove nothing but well- used 80s VWs for a good 10 year period, until they started to become hard to find both used and in junkyards.

I keep hearing of people saying that VWs are so finicky and hard to keep going, but IME they're the spiritual successor to something like a slant-six Dart.

nate

But in reality, Mitsu is about as low on the list as you can get. I mean, even Yugo figured out how to keep the majority of the oil out of the combustion chambers.

Or all the Honda drivers that got stranded by their very similar ignitor issue (not enough parts on hand, backorders, etc.) in the mid 90s. I had to rescue one of those drivers once. She didn't seem amused that an (at the time) unpainted '69 Dodge with rust holes and a swiss cheese convertible top was purring like a kitten (ok, tiger cub) and her almpst-new honda was a useless pile beside a rural backroad.

Every manufacturer has > That reminds one of Toyotas unsettled sludge problem LOL

I was an industrial mechanic for a while in the late '80s (forklifts and such). Mitsu was s*it then. *New* liftrucks (under 1000 hrs) would drop valveguides or leak so much oil as to render them useless in a week of service.

I worked for a Datsun dealer. We replaced hundreds of Mitsus.

Try leaking oil in a carpet warehouse! They go nuts! "Fix this F**king thing before it ruins the inventory!"

Sorry... No Fix... Buy a better forklift...

True story. Al

Heh. Did they use the same heads as the V-6 POS engines they put in Chrysler minivans?

I mean really. How hard is it to spec a proper press fit...?

nate

Yep. Same industrial process creating totally s***ty parts that the company (Mitsui) could care less about servicing/replacing/honoring warranty service about.

Sold a lot of Datsuns/Nissans due to it.

Strange thing is that a 1st gen, turbo, AWD Eclipse is a f**king blast to drive and held up well. Al

Agreed. A friend had a non-turbo FWD Laser and it seemed to be decent enough. I expected it to self destruct at any second just because I knew who'd made it but she had it for years. I guess their anti-engineers must have had an off day when designing that series of cars?

Girlie keeps looking at WRXes and Evos... I told her if she bought an Evo that I would refuse to so much as put new wiper blades on it, because I didn't want to be held responsible for anything bad that could (would) happen to it.

nate

Mazda MX5 3rd Generation. Also called the Eunos or Miata in earlier generations in different markets. Don't know if they still are.

Purebred small engined two seater open top sports car.

They really have. They don't feel as good, and don't last as well.

Hopefully if and when it is finalised and publicised, the Koenigsegg buyout will give back the sensible eccentricities and longevity.