Dieselgate

And where is all the extra electricity going to come from?

I've got an idea. Oil fired generators. Then all we need is the extra cabling across the country to feed all those new charging points.

Then a few years on they'll discover it's cheaper and easier to burn the oil directly in a car...

For EV to become mainstream, Elan Musk has to re-think the charging problem; you cannot have random 120kW access to the grid for 51% of cars; it won't work. Musk is imaginary and has faced up to many EV obstacles so far. The solution, as far as I can see, would be battery swaps. Battery swaps would even out the drain on the grid. Oh Yes, they tried this in Denmark for a version of Renault EV, but the swap company went bust.

What is needed is a new type of more compact batteries, then a buttlet proof accounting system which records the work history of the battery and the implied market value, hence up-or downgrading batteries would be accounted for and would not worry the owner, and the car will always have a workable battery through its 20-30 year life span (e.g. Saabs). Old batteries could then be re-furbished.

All this sounds really simple compared with the awful complication of having to fill up with petrol. ;-)

My point was that the storage battery in the car neatly solves the problem with much renewable electricity generation - that it's only viable when combined with storage.

Of course more generating capacity will be required - but it can be of a novel type. It might even reduce the distribition problem, by allowing the power sources to be sited nearer the demand ...

The system used in Denmark only took a couple of minutes to swap out. A pit opened up under the car and did everything automatically. Even then, I envisage that the system could be improved with more standardisation and better accounting for battery work life.

I envisage the AA & RAC inundated with requests for a supercharge or tow from motorists who run out of lectric.

What with electric cars, (silent but deadly for pedestrians), and driverless cars, I think I may be ready to give up driving before I'm 90.

The chaos caused on the Manchester outer ring road as it is converted to a 'smart' motorway is bad enough. What will they do when the hard shoulder is in full use and ?

Gordon H

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Yeah they are testing a "lorry train", something with a row of driverless heavy lorries following a lead lorry with a driver inside. OMG.

Well most people with electric cars plug them in every night *AT HOME* on cheap night rate electricity. There is plenty of generation capacity spare at night as there is over 10 GW difference between peak day demand and low night time demand even in the depths of winter. That gets them a full charge and even for a Nissan Leaf that will do for a daily commute of 40 miles and supermarket / garden centre at weekends. Tesla S/X will be fine for someone that lives in London 5 days a week and then if they go over 250 miles to a weekend house, just add 1hr to the round trip for

2 FREE supercharges. What electric cars won't do is 400+ miles/day that some company reps still do. Unless the site(s) they visit have rapid chargers as they can't afford the recharge time on the road.

Tesla S has been driven across America, dad and daughter 3,400 miles 5 days.

But now it's a RACE! 3,011 miles 58 hours and 55 minutes (average road speed 51mph, it wasn't hanging around).

There is no case for oil. More closed cycle gas turbines maybe. Biomass? Coal is only for cold weather (it's been switched off this weekend). Wind can now peak over 5 GW.

But base load electricity is available every night.

I suggest you hover over the little "oil" gauge up on top row at RHS.

The National Travel Survey claims 56%.

Less than 5 miles? I drove to the Supermarket and back twice this week for a sandwich, and that is less than half a mile.

I can see why that would skew the statistics, but they didn't ask me.

That may be fine for commuting while there are still very few electric cars. Totally different matter if they become the norm. And then there will be no cheap rate electricity.

But the amount of fully electric vehicles is so insignificant that's fine at present, imagine the scenario if 50% of vehicles were fully electric , the load on the grid would be astronomical , plus how do you accommodate houses with several vehicles, or those who live in flats or have no off street parking.

You have enough neighbour parking disputes now, be a nightmare if you needed to charge your car on street.

32 Amps is a lot to pull through a domestic supply ,only properties built in the last 20 years are likely to have spare capacity many older properties are still running on 40 or 60 amp main fuses, the incoming cables may be able to take much more than 100 amps that's your lot .

+1 It's the 30% that justify the car for many, especially the urban population.

unless you are doing these long journeys often, the tesla is fine, most Mway services have superchargers and the fill up is free, even if the range is only 200 miles at a time (realworld reports say over 200), it is not too onerous to stop and have a break while it refills during your once or twice a year trip to Cornwall or Scotland.

I agree it could be a pain if you drive several hundred every day for 40 weeks of the year.

Hmm. Imagine your average supermarket filling station. Imagine how many people fill up in a 4-6 hour period (based on guesstimated charge cycle). How many battery packs would such a station need?

I think it might present problems.

Tim

And what if another Tesla owner is using it? You presumably have to wait until they're finished.

You don't need to want/need to do that distance every day to justify an IC engined vehicle. Once a week is more than enough to justify NOT having an electric car as your only car.

At present, electric cars are just toys for rich people who feel guilty about not paying their taxes.

Tim

Think of the range anxiety for the early Fuel Cell vehicle owners. Toyota are putting in refuelling stations at large dealers (in the states) The new Marai is going to present some interesting logistics problems, and goodness knows what the Fire Brigade will think of 10,000 psi tanks of hydrogen in a car, and how about their use in tunnels?

Hydrogen, in some ways, is safer than petrol. Other than in confined spaces, if it leaks, it rapidly disappears upwards - unlike petrol pooling and vapour remaining all around it. Petrol tanks are also easily ruptured in a crash, wheras hydrogen tanks can withstand a lot more.

When I drive to Italy, I start with a full tank in London, cross the channel and go as far as Chalons and stop overnight. Which is about the limit of a tankful if I have to travel flat out to catch the ferry and/or arrive before the restaurant closes. It so happens that hotel has a supercharger station. But could I get there from Calais?, where would I stop before my next overnight stop in Luzern ?