Punctures & Repairs

I've just had a puncture repaired- thankfully no 'drama' - I noticed the problem before the tyre was 'flat', inflated it, drove a few hundred
yards to a local place, which did the repair. The only 'niggle', it looks like the offending item was a screw off my garage floor!
I happened to comment to the chap who did the repair something like 'That is the only one I can have on that tyre.' He corrected me and said that 3 were allowed, subject to positioning. I've not checked the rating of the tyre (it is on a 4x4) but my understanding was that only one was permitted. Have the rules changed?
Next question. I know proper type places, like the one I used, remove the tyre and patch from the inside etc. with a 'mushroom' like patch. These have a patch on the inside and a stalk that fills the hole.
However, many years ago (in the 1960s) I recall my father having a DIY kit which you poked a plug, dipped in glue, into the hole from the outside. My understanding is these were banned - at least that is what I was told in the 1970s.
BUT I see similar kits are now available and there are numerous videos of them being used. They seem popular with motorcyclists. I'd have thought the last think the latter would want is a dodgey repair!
Are these DIY kits legal/any good? Obviously they would only work (in theory) for 'simple' holes of limited size and in the 'right' location- on the main part of the tread.
The modern kits seem slightly different from the 1960s one I recall but the essential principle is the same- a rubber like 'bung' dipped in glue, inserted from the outside in the hole, after the screw, nail, etc is removed, and the hole cleaned. The only obvious differences are the colour- and the modern bungs are longer and seem to be 'doubled over' when inserted.
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When I read tales like this I really wonder if it's just me ... who has been sent back from the future or that 'most people' are still very much stuck in the past ...? ;-(
When I hear about people having punctured repaired manually I wonder if they still also start their cars manually with a starting handle or have to keep the fuel pressure up using a hand pump as they drive? ;-)
We have several computers in most cars these days ... we have cars that automatically call for help in the case of an accident ... that park themselves or stop if something steps in front of them, yet, 'most people' still seem to be living in the stone age when it comes to dealing with punctures? ;-(
This seems to be especially strange given how many cars don't automatically come with a spare wheel any more.
Now, I'm not saying everyone should do as I do and treat all their vehicles with the likes of Punctureseal, but when I think about it I wonder why they don't?
I guess 'they don't know about it' could be the answer from many ... or, because of myths or out_of_date information, aren't aware how well the good stuff works or how easy it is to apply or how cheap it is given the inconvenience of a puncture etc, especially when spread over the lifetime of an average tyre.
So it's sorta got to the point now why when anyone asks about or mentions 'punctures' I'll just shrug ... like someone listening to an .MP3 player might when someone asks where you can get audio cassettes from. ;-)
Keep banging them rocks together guys. ;-)
Cheers, T i m
p.s. Obviously much of the above is said with tongue-in-cheeks but I'm still intrigued why I am happy to rely / use the likes of Punctureseal and many others aren't (or don't, and many do of course)? Don't get me wrong, I'd hate for someone to also rely on it and it not work for them but maybe it's one of those things where you would have to actually experience it in use for yourself ... to have done thousands of miles on what would have been a 'punctured' tyre with no ill effect or even the loss of one PSI to 'get' what it's all about?
If the likes of Continental tyres can offer a tyre pre-treated with a puncture sealing gel, I'm guessing such must be up to muster and given the RW difficulty of knowing if the tyre you picked up in your own garage, that got thrown out a few yards later, the puncture sealed and you weren't aware of any of it suggests that it's ok as a long term puncture solution?
'Of course' any tyre/ sealant manufacturer would 'recommend' you have a punctured tyre checked, but how soon do we ever know we have a puncture (pre TPS) and how many miles might we do with the object still stuck in there or the tyre slowly deflating?
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On 23/01/2018 23:16, T i m wrote:

I know about it, I even have some (or the equivalent that came with the car) but I don't and wouldn't use it. I don't trust it, the car has a TPMS with sensors in the wheels, ...... I bought a 'space saver' spare but, on this occasion, didn't need to use it. The tyre wasn't totally 'flat', I have a decent compressor so could inflate it, and drive the 1/4 mile or so to a local tyre place who repaired it for £15. The car is new so the tyre has done about 1200 miles- I didn't want to right it off unless I had to.
When I went to collect the car, there was another 4x4 having a tyre changed. He'd driven on some tyre and ruined it- it had some kind of 'protection' in it an he'd not noticed he had a puncture. I'm not sure what it was (the tyre protection) but he wasn't a happy camper. Again, the tyre had been all but new- although the car wasn't.
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<snip> >> I guess 'they don't know about it' could be the answer from many ...

I'm not sure there is such a thing as 'an equivalent, especially if it 'comes with the car' Brian. If it 'comes with the car' that sounds like a 'get you home' vinyl gunge and *nothing* like Punctureseal.

You have experience of 'it' to not trust it OOI? I wonder what it is about those who do trust it, how / why they are different? (And we aren't talking a get-you-home gunge here).
If I tell you I used it respectively to repair two punctures on two of my own cars and on one car the tyre continued to be fine till I eventually scrapped the car and the other is on the car we are driving currently, do you believe me? Do you think maybe that I have some sort of magic powers that makes the stuff work for me but not for you for example? I'm just trying to understand ... ;-)

OK, and ... ? The sensors are by the rim and nowhere near the sealant inside the tread (centripetal force takes care of that, if that was your concern)?
https://www.continental-tyres.co.uk/car/technology/extended-mobility-main/contiseal

Good idea. There will always be the time where the tyre get's badly damaged etc.

Yes, you said.

Yeah, you said. *Luckily* you were local to home and not on a busy motorway, at night, in the rain, with a caravan on the back.

Quite ... and there was no reason 'to' right it off for a small screw puncture was there? What would have written it off?

?
Doesn't sound like very good 'protection' as it sounds like it didn't 'protect'? This is exactly the sort of thing I'm talking about. People (potentially) comparing apples and pears.

So (in an effort to try to find out *why* people may not use the likes of Puncturseal) you don't trust whatever came with the car so you don't use something different?
Assuming the stuff in the 'other' 4X4 you mentioned failed, how different would that be to the tyre without the sealant OOI?
As I said, I really DGAF if others don't use the likes of Punctureseal, I just wondered *why* they didn't. <shrug>
Thanks for the feedback. ;-)
Cheers, T i m
p.s. Say you bought a second hand car and it came fitted with 4 as new tyres that happened to be 'Contiseal' type. If you realised what they were, would you replace them with some 'std' tyres?
If you didn't appear to have a puncture, would you have them checked for punctures?
If you realised you had a puncture, and it sealed itself, would you have it further 'repaired' and if not, how would you feel about them if they didn't exhibit a puncture or any other issues till you finally wore them out?
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On 24/01/2018 00:20, T i m wrote:

We very rarely buy s/h but, if I did, I'm not familar with this type of tyre. Chances are, if a car was fitted with them, I'd avoid it.
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On 24/01/2018 07:51, Brian Reay wrote:

Pah, bring back solid tyres, they never suffered from punctures.
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On Wed, 24 Jan 2018 08:48:35 +0000, MrCheerful

Hehe.
Cheers, T i m
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On 24/01/2018 08:48, MrCheerful wrote:

Yes, snowflakes! IIRC the winner of the very first Isle of Man TT fixed three punctures himself in the course of the race.
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On Wed, 24 Jan 2018 12:54:21 +0000, newshound

Proper geeza. ;-)
Both my Lambretta SX150 and Messerschmitt KR200 had split rims, meaning I just needed to carry a spare tube (although both also carried a spare wheel). ;-)
I'd have to say, not having to deal with most punctures on the move is a real boon, something many take for granted these days with slime filled cycle tyres etc.
I note that the TPMS system was first brought in because several people had died because of tires that were being run under inflated, were than failing catastrophically (tread delaminating / blowout), causing vehicles to overturn etc.
A second issue is the very slow loss of air because of the porosity of the rubber itself. This means un-checked tyres can be run for extended periods at very low (and progressively decreasing) pressures, again, leading to stress of the carcase and premature failure.
As a matter of course I have always glanced over any vehicle I'm due to drive or even passenger in, looking for things like damaged lights, mirrors or tyres that looked 'soft' (or damaged etc).
The trouble is, not everyone does and I have spotted (and warned the driver if possible) of a particularly soft tyre, when I have spotted it on the road.
Again, a pre-emptive sealant that helps reduce such porosity issues has to be a good thing?
Daughter is about to replace the front tyres on her Corsa and I may take advantage of that to video some 'attacks' on the tyres, as they are treated with Puncturseal.
I wonder if that would convince anyone as to the abilities of the likes of PS ... or if they would still prefer to have their (say) daughter or wife stuck at the side of the road (motorway?) because of a basic puncture?
As soon as the new tyres go on, the fresh Punctureseal goes in, why wouldn't you? ;-)
Cheers, T i m
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MrCheerful wrote:

Or fill them with some sort of foam :-)
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On 24/01/18 13:14, Dan S. MacAbre wrote:

Don't some of the 'run flat' tyres do that? I recall seeing some with 'balloons' of 'gunge' which burst and then expanded. I assume the tyre was then 'done for' but may be not.
I don't feel the urge to change all the tyres on any of our vehicles to anything 'exotic'- run flat or otherwise. I tend to buy a 'normal' quality tyre and deal with the odd puncture if needed. As for 'low profile' etc., I can't see the attraction. I've never been a 'boy racer' ;-), even in the MX5.
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Brian Reay wrote:

I don't know. I knew one lad years ago who filled a tyre with straw, but this was on an old A40 we used to drive around some nearby waste ground. It always looked happy enough, though.
But filling a tyre with some sort of synthetic foam does not seem completely ridiculous to me. Yet.

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I've not seen that. Most 'run flats' are called such because the tyre stays on the rim and will tolerate being run flat for longer than a std tyre. They still need to be replaced, including the other non-flat tyre on the same axle because of the extra stresses it has had to endure.
Better IMHO not to have the tyre go flat in the first place! ;-)

Quite. Nor would I.

I tend to go for a good (primary) branded as a minimum.

You don't have the choice with many cars these days, that's what's fitted as standard. ;-(

The kitcar has 80 profile tyres. ;-)
Cheers, T i m
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wrote:
<snip> >>>> p.s. Say you bought a second hand car and it came fitted with 4 as new

Hehe! ;-)
Or if not a foam, a nice layer of thixotropic gel over the inside of the tread area, ready to instantly seal and plug any hole that does appear. ;-)
Cheers, T i m
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T i m wrote:

Ah, is it just the tread area? I was wondering if it was the answer to my annoying slow bead leak.

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On 24/01/18 14:17, Dan S. MacAbre wrote:

Years ago I had one of those, after a some new tyres were fitted. I just returned to the supplier (I wasn't sure what the problem was), they found it, 'reseated' the tyre, problem solved. I assume a but of much or something had got in the way. A bit later, a boy racer drove into the car and it was written off!
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Brian Reay wrote:

I think mine is caused by corroded alloy at the rim - I can see it at the affected area. It seems that the only reliable answer is to polish it out.
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wrote:
<snip> >I think mine is caused by corroded alloy at the rim - I can see it at

You can do that or clean it up, acid etch prime, paint and seal.
The problem with doing that is having the wheel off long enough to do a good job.
The ally rims on my Honda CB 250 Nighthawk were slightly porous and so I tripped them clean, sprayed with acid etch primer, prayed them up inside and out and left them to cure in the sun for a week or so. Fitted new tyres and they hardly lose a psi between checks (that is normally MOT time). ;-)
For a more instant repair they often use a black tyre sealant gunge that just fills the holes etc.
Cheers, T i m
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T i m wrote:

I can do without this particular car for a while - it's a sort of runabout. I'm just not sure I can get the tyre off without distorting the rim.

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On 24/01/2018 15:49, Dan S. MacAbre wrote:

once the bead seal is broken then conventional old school tyre levers will remove any normal tyre, bead seal can be broken (often) by lowering the heavy end of a car onto the wall of the tyre.
But for the average person it is easier to just get a tyre shop to strip the tyre off, take the wheel home, clean and paint it, then get the tyre shop to re-fit and balance.
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