Hi All, I Just got a used 04 forester XT with 55,000 miles. Question, is The 60,000 mile service really necessary.At $600.00 this would raise the cents per mile that I'm trying to keep as low as possible! I do however plan 105,000 mile service with the timing belt replacement. What do you think? If money were no object I'd follow the book (The Tribeca or Lexus book) but it is! I want to get at least 200,000 mile on this car. Any advice on Subaru would be most welcome. Thanks
Consider doing some of the work yourself. The air and fuel filter changes are easy as can be and I found the spark plugs to be rather easy. Your local shop should be able to perform the brake fluid changes rather inexpensively.
At 60k mine was due for coolant resplacement, fuel filter replacement, spark plug repalcement, and brake fluid replacement.
If you want the car to last to that age without having a failing radiator or brake system, it'd behoove you to perform this maintenance. $600 will seem cheap if you have to replace a radiator, head gasket, master cylinder, or have an ABS brake issues due to lack of these maintenance items.
if you want to get 200,000 miles of any car, maintain it in the best possible way. Why people will spend $30,000 on a car and then complain about $25 oil changes is beyond me.
If you must - stretch the service out over 3-4 pay periods. Inspect all major fluids NOW and top off as required. Do the oil, then the brakes, then the tranny if auto - try to spring for a full flush, if not, do the drain/fill, then the coolant. If the car is running well and no CEL is on, do the plugs last. But do it in as timely a fashion as possible. Then, begin putting aside money for the next biggie - the timing belt!
The general low down is "do the factory service schedule". Some of that you can do yourself and save hugely over dealership gouging.
The other aspect is dealerships will add more "dealer recommended" services to the factory schedule list. These dealer add ons are mostly just additional profit items, and not useful. Make a list of the factory schedule and tell the service person that is all you want done.
Expect to have to hold them to it, even after all that. At my last Subaru service, they added a $3.50 charge for topping off the washer fluid, which I'd done the night before.
In another thread we were talking about a fellow who got a million miles on his Saab. You'll see this quote in several of the reports on this car if you Google it: "Gilbert attributes his vehicle's longevity, other than being a Saab, to 'maintenance and rigorous fluid replacement.'" In addition, at least one site reports he used "premium, synthetic oil" though no brand was listed. (There's a fellow in the Guinness book w/ 1.2 mil on a Honda who used Castrol Syntec--but I'd suggest the "rigorous fluid replacement" part of the regimen was more important than actual brand before someone jumps on that broken down bandwagon.) Another site reports strict adherence to the book's maintenance schedule.
Ok, what points am I trying to make? For longevity, CLEAN fluids are a must. 200k miles is no longer "that far" for many cars today, assuming decent maintenance.
Over and above that, look carefully at what the book says, NOT what the dealer says. As mentioned, dealers will upsell when possible to make an extra buck. Then, if time and/or money are tight (aren't they always?), and you CAN'T do everything at once, prioritize the maintenance schedule according to "this could kill me, this could kill the engine, this won't hurt if I wait until next paycheck" kinds of things.
Tires, brakes and the braking system would be "this could kill me" items. Timing belts, oil and filters would be "this could kill the engine" items. Changing the spark plugs and gearbox oil could "wait until next paycheck." You see where I'm going?
Figure out what maintenance items you can do yourself to save a buck or two, or get "better" products for the same money. Example: my local Jiffy Lube advertises a Pennzoil oil change for $39.95. You'll get up to five qts of regular dino oil and a Pennzoil house-branded version of Fram's bottom line filter. For the same $40, you can put five qts of Mobil 1 and an OEM or "premium" aftermarket filter in there like Mobil 1 or Wix. Or you can go dino and "standard" filter for around $20. The choice is yours! Then you can leave only the items you CAN'T do to the dealer...
"Extra" maintenance, such as 3000 mile oil changes when the book says
5000 miles would fall under the definition of "rigorous" in my book, but will NOT hurt the car! They MIGHT help, and will take a few extra pennies from your pocket, but how many oil changes can you do for just ONE extra car payment that you might be able to avoid by extending the useful miles from your car? To err on the side of caution will probably save you money in the long run.
Finally, when it comes to items like filters... you won't go wrong using OEM filters throughout. They usually won't cost any more than "premium" aftermarket items, and you know for sure they meet factory performance specs (as opposed to simply meeting warranty requirements.) Items that advertise "enhanced performance" are suspect, be they blue pills or "million mile air filters." Use them at your own risk. "Cheap" aftermarket filters may or may not serve well, depending on the overall maintenance schedule. For example, a $2.50 house branded oil filter w/ "no name" $1.50/qt dino oil that meets the appropriate API or other specs, changed every 2500 miles, will probably serve as well as (if not better than) stretching a $10 filter w/ $6/qt synthetic oil out to 10k mile change intervals. As with many things, only controlled testing (which most of us aren't equipped to do) will tell, so let's NOT start THAT war again, it's just a suggestion.
I doubt oiled filters are quite as bad as the naysayers make out - though there are tests that show they alloy more silicon (sand) in oil analyses (but I wonder what the particle size is) and any HP gain is minimal. There are also poor paper filters out there - so it depends on what comparisons you wanna make.
Aside from a few things that need to be replaced (and most are well within the abilities of anyone with any mechanical aptitude) most other service items are of the 'check and adjust if needed' type. Timing rarely changes on new cars. Valve adjustment can be expensive if the engine uses shims. BUT ... shimmed valves rarely need adjustment. It's easy to check them and you can save a few hundred dollars that the dealer would charge (their price is usually worst case where they need to spend a few hours changing out lots of shims). If they check OK, no need for further work.
Checking brakes is another easy thing.
It's been a long time since I've had a new car that needed a 60K checkup. In the two previous cases ( '83 Camry, '86 MR2 ) nothing needed adjustment. Everything checked out good. I just replaced the indicated filters, etc. Total cost under $100 and a few hours of checking things.
If not, you're reading something in I didn't say. However, if you like K&N filters, that's fine. It's your money you're spending.
But let's think about something here: K&N is not the only company who makes (or has made) an oilable "no replacement" filter. Any car mfr has access to them, and I'm sure K&N would LOVE to get an OEM contract (maybe the folks I know who've worked for 'em--the company's only a half hour from me--could get a raise?) Yet we don't see K&N or any other "serviceable" filter on a factory car today.
Conspiracy theorists will claim that's cuz the mfrs want to sell a lot of paper filters. Some engineers will claim it's cuz paper filters trap more "stuff" and keep the engine cleaner. W/o seeing side by side data from controlled tests, it's your call who is right.
BTW, YES, I HAVE used serviceable filters in the past. I've returned to the paper ones...
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