just had a rear brake job done on my 2000 Legacy (L) wagon and was curious to know if i had been overcharged on labour and/or parts. Here is what was done: The rear disks were grinded and turned ?(48$ Cnd), and new brake pads were installed for 54$ (Cnd). I was charged 3 hours labour + 103$ total parts. Does it really take 3 hours to grind disks and install pads ??? I don't want to soud picky but does this sound reasonable to any expert out there ?
Any comments would be appreciated
Many thanks
Unless they charged you for the time the lathe took to cut the rotors, you got overcharged. But, they already charged you for that (48$). I cant justify 3 hours to take out four bolts (2 on each side), and the "setting up" of the brake lathe. I did all four corners on mine in 45 mins, taking my time. I also had new rotors ready for it, so it was an on and off job. I believe my rear rotors were like $65 each, fronts $60. The rear pads were $60, fronts $65. These are prices for a wrx though. Save yourself money next time...and there WILL be a next time (i think you can only cut them once, maybe twice), and buy your parts from (no i dont work there) subaruwrxparts.com, pick up a manual, and get crankin'...at least you know your getting oem parts that dont squeak in a week too!
Sally Labour costs are relative to whether the shop uses flat rates or actual time for a job. Three hours does seem excessive for just doing the rear brake pads, by a competent mechanic. However, removing the rear rotors is complicated a little by the parking brake mechanism which is inside the drum on the rear rotors. It usually needs tightened to remove a rear rotor and reset after reinstalling the rotor. That is a tedious little job but not overly time consuming.
If the rotors were actually "grinded and turned" then that cost was not unreasonable but I doubt that they were turned and ground (the order is important if it is done) and just simply turned.
Unfortunately, you have opened the door to one of my favorite rants. This is not a Subaru rant. I just installed all calipers rotors and pads on my `97 Legacy GT and have no complaints other than the price.
Shops use turning for two reasons:
I say "somewhat mechanically sound" because since the rotor has warped, it has been subjected to heat from braking conditions that are likely to re-occur, if the driving conditions remain the same. Since there is now less rotor material to absorb the heat, the rotor will warp more easily than before. This is not necessarily an immediate process but is relative to time: more aggressive stopping = less time.
This is one reason why I always replace warped rotors.
A secondary effect of improper contact can be chattering or squealing when braking, something else shops want to avoid because that will result in customer complaint.
If a rotor is glazed BUT NOT WARPED then rough grinding is a better mechanical option because much less material is removed from the rotor and the surface will be rough enough, similar to that of a new rotor, to properly "wear in" the new pads. I doubt that you will find a standard shop that grinds rotors and if you do then the price will be more than that for turning, possibly significantly more.
Now the process of turning a rotor has a problem in and of itself. If too much heat is generated in the turning process then that can warp the rotor. There are ways that this can happen, eg.: too much material removed at once, dull cutting tool, lack of cutting fluid, etc. A reputable shop should not have this problem but it would be easy for this to happen intentionally.
Also, a turned rotor has an extremely rough surface. This will certainly help to properly seat your new pads faster but it also decreases the life of the pads! The rougher the surface, the more wear, the less pad life.
This is the second reason why I always replace warped rotors and brings us to my conspiracy theory about the turning of brake rotors.
Conspiracy Theory
Every time the pads are changed, the rotors are turned. The life of the pads is shortened, as is that of the rotors. Result: higher turnover of products. Even on new cars, they know that eventually you will run out of warranty.
Even if new parts are covered under a warranty, the labour seldom is, unless you have purchased an extended warranty to cover this.
When you buy new rotors for your unwarrantied vehicle (always use new pads) then installers will turn the rotors first, unless you insist otherwise. When you ask that this not be done, they will try to not guarantee the job, saying not responsible for chatter, squeal, etc. If the caliper alignment is good, new rotors do not need turned.
Some cars have the "brake caliper alignment to the rotor" so out of whack that a very rough rotor surface is the only way to get the pads to seat fast enough to avoid squeal and chatter. This is evidenced by a very uneven wearing of the break pads. On new cars of this type you won't need pads until after the warranty runs out since they have made them extra thick. You won't be able to buy pads exactly like the originals. /end Conspiracy Theory
On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 16:35:54 GMT, RJ Walsh wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@nbnet.nb.ca:
Since Sally seems to be posting from the same place I live, I can guess she was likely charged an exorbitant flat rate by one of our local Subaru dealers. One of the reasons I go to a private mechanic for most things, and do my own brake work.
Another time to point out that warped rotors rarely are.
MotorsForum website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.