Diesels In England: Why ?

Fiats are coming back to America again, aren't they? Meanwhile, Ford is considering the fate of Mercury cars.Something is wrong with that picture.

Back in the 1950s, my older brother bought a second hand 1957 Mercury Turnpike Cruiser.I used to think that car was a spaceship from Mars, the way that car looked. cuhulin

Reply to
cuhulin
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Diesel engines are popular in Europpe for a couple of good reasons:

  1. The greater thermodynamic efficiency of the diesel engine leads to better fuel mileage. Better fuel mileage and higher fuel taxes lead to lower consumption of petroleum.

  1. Diesel fuel is significantly cheaper than "petrol" in Europe. The refining practices are quite different. You could look it up.

The Euro driver can operate a relatively small diesel or a big gasolene burner. The choice is theirs.

The USA could impose higher fuel taxes that would help pay for our crumbling infrastructure and promote efficiency and reduce foreign dependence (and obviously risky procedures like deep sea drilling) and help pay for things like the mideast wars that always are paid for "off budget". What is required is a thoughtful and rational discussion without rants, name-calling, and general vituperation.

Not likely to happen in today's poisonous political climate...

Reply to
TOF

Most (all?) modern european diesels, at least around here, are turbo charged and most are direct injected, with sophisticated engine management and high pressure injection systems. I can't remember having seen a non-turbo diesel in the last ten years or so.

A few years ago, when VW presented a new Golf GTI, most car magazines recommended getting it with the diesel. They were both 150 bhp and the diesel was the quicker of the two.

Reply to
Thomas Tornblom

This is good to hear - it's a shame we don't have the option to buy these diesels in an economy car.

Reply to
dsi1

While I'm no proponent of high fuel taxes, it is a powerful weapon to bring overall fuel efficiency up. Gas guzzling SUV:s are becoming increasingly hard to sell in Europe.

I get around 45-50 mpg with our gasoline 122 bhp 1.4 TSI 2010 golf

6, which is a nice car, about as spacious as an old Volvo 740.
Reply to
Thomas Tornblom

Absolutely, Roger.. Taxation can be the major component of fuel prices. It currently is not in the USA, but is in a goodly part of Europe. And you are right about the thieving politicians.

Unfortunately, you may not be right about being able to address this at the ballot box. We have had a long run of candidates who offer no alternatives. And when we send someone new to Washington, he or she turns rotten as the newest apple in a very sick barrel. As I see it, we have no obvious candidate in any party who can and will work for the country and for the people.

Reply to
hls

Roger Blake wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@news.eternal-september.org:

I'll forgive you this post as some of you poor US citizens have no idea what a good government is anymore that when you finally get one all it does is confuse you. And BTW he won because he got out the vote of people that *were* fed up with politics as it existed and weren't voting until that election..

Reply to
chuckcar

Fuel taxation is the main reason diesels originally becasme more popular in Europe as a whole. In the old days, there were very few diesel cars. Governments in continental Eurpoe imposed high fuel taxes on gasoline to hold down consumer demand and therefore reduce the importation of fuel from foreign sources. Since diesel fuel was mostly used in commercial vehicles, it was originally not taxed as heavily since they did not want to penalize commerce. However, because of this disparity in taxation, automakers started developing smaller diesel engines for automobiles. These days, at least in the UK, diesel fuel is actually more expensive than unleaded regular gasoline. However, becasue diesel cars get better fuel economy, they are still very popular (especially if you don't care about performance). Remember, becasue of taxation, fuel in the UK and Europe is much more expensive than in the US (2 to 3 times as much per gallon). Becasue of these high prices, good fuel economy is highly valued. People are willing to put up with mediocre performance if it means they can get significantly better fuel economy.

Pros for diesel engines -

- diesel engines are somewhat more efficient that gasolie engines, particularly at part throttle

- diesel fuel has higher engergy content per gallon than gasoline and this is not always reflected in the cost of the fuel

- beacuse of the above two factors, diesel engines often get much better fuel economy

- becasue of the need to make the engines very robust, they generally last longer

- diesel fuel has bettter lubricating properties than gasoline and this helps improve the life of the engine

- no spark plugs (and therefore no high voltage ignition system)

Cons for diesel engines:

- becasue of the much higher cylinder pressures, engines have to be heavier and more expensive to build

- complicated / expensive fuel delivery system, intolerant of fuel contamination

- power output for a given engine weight is less than for a gasoline engine

- exhaut emmissions are more dangerous and harder to control

- diesel engines tend to be less responsive and limited to fewer maximum rpms

- diesel engines tend to be noiser

Ed

Reply to
C. E. White

The price is not higher due to your mythical "confisctory taxation". It is due to intelligent taxation. The taxes in Europe and elsewhere on oil would likely be much higher than they are now, if it were not for the efforts of the US to turn it into a destructive race to the bottom.

People should be still carping about Reagon. Stupid and destructive taxation policy was perfected under Reagon. After the last 30 years of relying on taxing the wages and spending of the lowest wage earners and watching industry disappear you might think it sensible to look back and say maybe something is wrong here. In the last 30 years more and more of the Nations real assets have been converted to paper assets. That has been accomplished by misguided tax policies that started under Reagon. Just how long do you think the US is going to last if all it produces and exports is paper money and derivatives? It's time to shift the taxes from the part of the economy that has been slowly squashed to the ground and look at the part that is out of control due to getting a completely tax free ride. That means taxing oil and Wall street.

-jim

Reply to
jim

Yes, sort of.. Some years ago when the Arab oil embargo kicked gasoline prices sky high, and availability was limited, one of the diesel engine companies prepared a small V8 which could be transplanted into almost any automobile, and exhibited it at the Offshore Technology Conference in Houston.

I believe they specified 3500 rpm on that engine. Not a screamer, but it was proof to me that diesels didnt have to grunt around at 1500 rpm.

These engines were ready for sale, they claimed, but obviously never caught on, as gasoline came back onto the market.

Reply to
hls

Emperial gallon or US gallon?

Reply to
hls

We're Americans, though. We need enormous cars that waddle like huge pigs down the road. With childhood obesity increasing by leaps and bounds, an average family of five will soon weigh over a thousand pounds total, making it that much more important to have a huge pumped-up vehicle that looks like an offroad vehicle but actually isn't. And with American road infrastructure falling apart, it will be that much more important to have the traditional American suspension system that is so soft that you won't even notice the potholes... hell, you could drive over the curb and through a school and not even notice it, the ride is so smooth.

--scott

Reply to
Scott Dorsey

A big flaw in your theory- Europe is SMALL. In a long day, you can pass through several countries. Here in MI, it would take me all day to drive to the other end of the STATE. Texas is even worse. You can choke back your rage at high fuel taxes when 100 klicks is a 'long drive'. Sure, many US commuter cars could get replaced by euro-style golf carts, but if the family can't afford multiple cars, what do they go visit Grandma in?

Reply to
aemeijers

Take a look at Australia for comparison.

Reply to
Bret

US

Reply to
Thomas Tornblom

Around 56 mpg on imperial gallons.

Reply to
Thomas Tornblom

On the web, American Muscle Cars

As long as some people can afford them and drive them, who cars how they spend their money? It is part of auto industry.Jobs. cuhulin

Reply to
cuhulin

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Mustang Maria.Car Girl Brittany. That's what I am talkin bout! cuhulin

Reply to
cuhulin

Isnt it simply because they are cheaper to operate?

Ben

Reply to
ben91932

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