Is there a legal way to REQUIRE the California DMV to provide specific data?

Beyond the grossly fallacious nature of your theory, which the data you stipulate would not begin to support, you haven't established a need to legally compel the state to provide it. -----

- gpsman

Well, you didn't answer the question.

But, to answer YOUR assumed question, who says you have to KNOW the answer before you can even ask the question.

The question is what bikes pass/fail and what size are they?

Whether or not my "assumption" of the answer (or your assumption, or anyone elses' assumption) is correct is meaningless to the question.

I repeat the question: Does anyone know the actual data of what bikes pass and fail?

That's a different question. -----

- gpsman

having winged the test by virtue of taking advantage of cal subsidized moto course and riding the pig of a 900cc ninja afterwards I can tell you this:

it could be skewed and it very well SHOULD remain the way that it is. I crashed 14 times over 2 years totalling the bike.

Starting to ride on a heavy bike is the most idiotic thing one could possibly do.

I could not possibly see how 500-650cc bike would not be adequate for passing the exam and riding a few years afterwards

Well, the data is what we're after, no matter how we get it.

Any ideas?

My first idea is to forget it, but a letter is third and a phone call is second. -----

- gpsman

"Billy B." wrote in news:512f189e$0$18125$ snipped-for-privacy@read01.usenetall.se:

You need to file a CPRA request.It's similar to a federal FOIA (Freedom of Information Act) request.

Here's one page on how to do it:

More, here:

I got all those results from Google.

Fromwhatnow...?! -----

- gpsman

Ah, thanks. I thought we just called someone at the DMV. I will follow up and post back the results (if any).

thanks!

Bing! You win on two of the three! :)

Given this:

-

What information would tell us what we need to know?

How's this for starters?

1. Number of motorcycle licenses issued in 2012 (or any recent year)
2. Breakdown of HOW they passed their driving test (MSF or DMV)
3. Number of motorcycle riders who ATTEMPTED the DMV test.
4. Pass/fail statistics and motorcycle SIZE for those statistics.

How's that sound for the basic statistics we'd want to know?

He's probably going to want to know if you want M1 or M2.

I'm a genus. That wasn't so hard, was it?

Reports I've read all suggest CA DMV is incredibly responsive to citizen queries.

Sounds great, according to your fulfilling your wishes, but combined and sorted and having the s*it analyzed out of it still isn't going to offer a shred of support for your theory-- "that the system is purposefully skewed to pass tiny bikes and fail larger bikes".

Your theory is a "non sequitur"; a "single-cause fallacy" and "false dilemma". When you start from a "false premise" you can end up anywhere, but, hey, knock yourself out.

- gpsman

I rode bikes at soporific 4-5 k rpm, so a "pure sport" bike would be a poor fit for myself

but it's weird to see 11k redline on 900cc machinery I thought of that as 250-500cc territory

the bike engine tech is busy jumping in hayabusa footsteps i wonder how tire guys are keeping up (or don't) I wonder if we would see a 1k moto tire. would hopefully last longer than $1k NY pizza though

sounds like alec giness killing james dean

You KNEW when to get out ;-) and he was riding without proper gear I take it

I don't know that "proper gear" will save you from anything but road rash... but don't sell it short, road rash sucks.

I actually just had that conversation with a sales guy at a motorcycle shop the other day, bought myself a cheap jacket and he mentioned that a lot of people don't see the need until after they'd wrecked and just ride with flimsy little vests; I laughed and told him that I'd dropped a bicycle on pavement before - was an equipment failure, I was originally doing maybe 35-40ish but managed to get it slowed down a little before I actually lost it, I told him that I had no desire to repeat the experience at twice the speed unless I had some protection, he said that was a good sales pitch and he might use it someday :)

nate

If I were to scrapping for money I'd buy it in this order

1. gloves
2. boots
3. pants (or a single piece, depending on local climate and riding patterns)
4. jacket
5. helmet

the jacket is distant 4th on the list

the most useless gear purchase : "the turtle" aka vest with hard back armor. Hardly ever wore it.

Probably true. I have gloves and I have some work boots that will suffice for now. I bought the jacket before pants because as surprising as it may be I don't have the motorcycle endorsement on my license and a coworker and I are taking the rider course next month so we both can get them (mostly his doing, he wants to go on a motorcycle trip with his family)

I have jeans and Carhartt pants which will be acceptable for class purposes but I figure I'll probably end up buying a cheap bike this spring - been talking about doing it for ages - and a proper motorcycle jacket is nice because it will fit tightly and not flap like e.g. a Carhartt. (pretty much everything flaps on me; clothing manufacturers don't seem to think that people my height should weigh less than 300 lbs...)

nate

Well, that may make sense for you, there seems to be little in that noggin to protect. ------

- gpsman

You, on a motorcycle...??? That's hilarious.

We'll see how well your mind reading tricks work on a bike.

Excuse me, I have to create a Google News Alert now, I wouldn't want to forget. -----

- gpsman

Don't be so bitter just because I'm smarter, more competent, and most likely better looking than you. If you're going to be bitter at everyone who is, you'll just be miserable all the time.

nate